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From: Dimakakos Dimos <bendersteed@gmail.com>
To: guix-devel@gnu.org
Cc: GNU Guix maintainers <guix-maintainers@gnu.org>
Subject: Re: Joint statement on the GNU Project
Date: Tue, 08 Oct 2019 19:38:38 +0300	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <87wodfi44x.fsf@gmail.com> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <87ftk4hbhu.fsf@gnu.org>


Ludovic Courtès writes:

> We, a group of GNU maintainers sharing a vision for a stronger GNU
> Project, are publishing this statement today:
>
>   https://guix.gnu.org/blog/2019/joint-statement-on-the-gnu-project/

Hello to everyone. First of all I think that Guix blog was certainly not
the proper place for such an announcement. I agree that software,
especially free is a political issue and statement. On the other hand,
there shall be a separation since many people are involved in Guix and
may not be at the same page ideologically with the project's maintainers
and so could be alienated.

On the subject, I think that the discussion of rms's position in GNU is
valid but that at the same time such an announcment should be made after
a careful consideration and research. Do we have evidence that rms has
caused harm to GNU's projects? Even in the aspect of diversity and
community building, do we have evidence that rms is block or is it that
we just play along with a media campaign, that was in a fact a full on
personality attack on rms, by going as far as misquoting him.

I would like to hear you expand on ways that the empowerment of all
computer users was undermined by rms. I write all these in good
faith. On one hand I can accept that if there is concrete evidence, on
the other hand I see in the web media, people, associated with companies
that would like the software freedom fronts to collapse, bash and drive
out a person that offered his life to create and support the movement.

In my opinion the timing is a bit off. By trying to solve whatever issue
the community has with rms at this particular point, is like validating
the misinformation that has spread this last month about his name. It's
like the whole character assasination that happens on web is valid so we
need to cancel rms. I think this is totally unfair. At the same time
it's also important to move our community forward in ways that include
every person and also enable people of all kinds of background to take
part in GNU and this way realize the software freedom ideals.

So to sum up it would be nice to expand a bit on the announcement. My
main questions are:

     1. How does the GNU project operate, in the light of all the
     different projects, and what role and influence had rms as the head
     of GNU?

     2. How does rms with his afformentioned role undermine diversity
     and inclusivity of people working in GNU projects?

     3. What would be your suggestion on the next day of GNU when rms
     hypothetically steps down? Is he a single issue or are the other
     issues that our community shall overcome.

     4. In the case that rms is actually harming to our community how do
     we protect free software ideals while removing a person so closely
     related to their creation?

  parent reply	other threads:[~2019-10-08 16:38 UTC|newest]

Thread overview: 137+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
2019-10-07 14:32 Joint statement on the GNU Project Ludovic Courtès
2019-10-08  0:24 ` Jesse Gibbons
2019-10-08  1:59   ` Wilson Bustos
2019-10-08  8:19     ` pelzflorian (Florian Pelz)
2019-10-08 10:32       ` Jan
2019-10-08 13:52         ` Jesse Gibbons
2019-10-10  3:51         ` Jean Louis
2019-10-10 20:12         ` Adam Pribyl
2019-10-08 14:37       ` Wilson Bustos
2019-10-10  3:55         ` Jean Louis
2019-10-10  3:48       ` Jean Louis
2019-10-10  3:46     ` Jean Louis
2019-10-08  8:34   ` Ludovic Courtès
2019-10-08  8:48     ` Pierre Neidhardt
2019-10-08 11:17       ` Ricardo Wurmus
2019-10-10  4:01         ` Jean Louis
2019-10-10  4:00       ` Jean Louis
     [not found]         ` <87pnj5i3u2.fsf@elephly.net>
2019-10-10  5:17           ` Jean Louis
2019-10-10 14:29             ` Ludovic Courtès
2019-10-10 16:56               ` Thorsten Wilms
2019-10-10 22:10                 ` Ludovic Courtès
2019-10-10 16:57               ` Stefan Huchler
2019-10-10 22:50                 ` Ricardo Wurmus
2019-10-10 17:27               ` Jean Louis
2019-10-10 19:13               ` Svante Signell
2019-10-10 19:22                 ` Jean Louis
2019-10-10 20:23                   ` Svante Signell
2019-10-10 20:27                     ` Jean Louis
2019-10-12  7:06                     ` Jean Louis
2019-10-30  2:04                       ` Richard Stallman
2019-10-30  6:09                         ` Jean Louis
2019-10-30 18:16                           ` Thompson, David
2019-10-10 20:32                   ` P
2019-10-10 20:51                     ` Wilson Bustos
2019-10-10 21:03                       ` Vasya Boytsov
2019-10-12 12:05                         ` Jean Louis
2019-10-12 14:38                       ` Jean Louis
2019-10-12  7:52                     ` Jean Louis
     [not found]               ` <fa683d19-34ec-7b09-30a4-f4c139adf5ee@frantovo.cz>
     [not found]                 ` <87h84gtig9.fsf@gnu.org>
     [not found]                   ` <0936b8b2-ffbf-6370-71be-db24be1fd743@frantovo.cz>
     [not found]                     ` <87r23jvi7n.fsf@gnu.org>
2019-10-11  8:53                       ` František Kučera
2019-10-12 11:15               ` Jean Louis
2019-10-10 23:27             ` Quiliro Ordóñez
2019-10-11  8:03               ` Ludovic Courtès
2019-10-12 12:19               ` Jean Louis
2019-10-12 12:27                 ` Pierre-Henry F.
2019-10-10  3:57     ` Jean Louis
2019-10-10  8:43       ` Hartmut Goebel
2019-10-10 10:10         ` Jean Louis
2019-10-08 16:38 ` Dimakakos Dimos [this message]
2019-10-08 17:30   ` P
2019-10-08 19:17     ` Dimakakos Dimos
2019-10-10  4:11     ` Jean Louis
2019-10-08 20:18   ` zimoun
2019-10-10  4:15     ` Jean Louis
2019-10-09  8:56   ` Andy Wingo
2019-10-10  4:26     ` Jean Louis
2019-10-10 21:41     ` Arun Isaac
2019-10-10 21:53       ` Svante Signell
2019-10-10 22:24     ` František Kučera
2019-10-10  4:09   ` Jean Louis
2019-10-08 16:42 ` Pierre Neidhardt
2019-10-08 16:57   ` Tobias Geerinckx-Rice
2019-10-09  9:49     ` Pierre Neidhardt
2019-10-09 11:01       ` Tobias Geerinckx-Rice
2019-10-10 16:19 ` Mikhail Kryshen
2019-10-10 22:25   ` Ludovic Courtès
2019-10-10 23:49     ` Catallaxy
2019-10-13  3:55     ` Mikhail Kryshen
2019-10-13  6:30       ` Jean Louis
2019-10-11 18:41 ` Taylan Kammer
2019-10-11 19:14   ` Dmitry Alexandrov
2019-10-11 21:09   ` Christophe Poncy
2019-10-12 14:43     ` Jean Louis
2019-10-11 23:04   ` Jelle Licht
2019-10-12 18:43     ` Taylan Kammer
2019-10-12 19:09       ` Alfred M. Szmidt
2019-10-12 19:26         ` Dmitry Alexandrov
2019-10-12 20:11           ` Jean Louis
2019-10-12 19:26         ` P
2019-10-12 21:27           ` Ricardo Wurmus
2019-10-12 21:45       ` Alexander Vdolainen
2019-10-14  1:50         ` Richard Stallman
2019-10-14  1:44       ` Richard Stallman
2019-10-18  3:10     ` Richard Stallman
2019-10-12 13:06   ` Jean Louis
2019-10-12 13:38     ` pelzflorian (Florian Pelz)
2019-10-12 14:16       ` Jean Louis
2019-10-12 14:27       ` František Kučera
2019-10-12 17:22         ` Jean Louis
2019-10-12 17:37           ` P
2019-10-12 17:46             ` Wilson Bustos
2019-10-12 17:59               ` Jean Louis
2019-10-12 17:59               ` P
2019-10-12 18:22                 ` Jean Louis
2019-10-12 18:31                   ` P
2019-10-12 18:24                 ` Wilson Bustos
2019-10-12 18:32                   ` P
2019-10-12 19:04                     ` Wilson Bustos
2019-10-12 19:24                       ` P
2019-10-12 19:28                         ` Wilson Bustos
2019-10-12 21:01                           ` František Kučera
2019-10-12 21:23                           ` Reminder about discussions on this list Ricardo Wurmus
2019-10-12 20:52                         ` Joint statement on the GNU Project František Kučera
2019-10-12 21:23                           ` “do not add my address as an explicit recipient” (was: Joint statement on the GNU Project) Dmitry Alexandrov
2019-10-12 18:40                   ` Joint statement on the GNU Project Jean Louis
2019-10-14 13:30               ` zimoun
2019-10-14 16:14                 ` Wilson Bustos
2019-10-14 17:13                   ` zimoun
2019-10-14 22:26                     ` Wilson Bustos
2019-10-12 17:53             ` Jean Louis
2019-10-12 18:03               ` P
2019-10-12 18:14                 ` P
2019-10-14  1:44                   ` Richard Stallman
2019-10-12 18:27                 ` Jean Louis
2019-10-12 18:37                   ` P
2019-10-12 18:54                     ` Jean Louis
2019-10-12 19:20                       ` P
2019-10-12 21:42                         ` František Kučera
2019-10-12 19:33                       ` pelzflorian (Florian Pelz)
2019-10-14  1:44               ` Richard Stallman
2019-10-14  7:51                 ` František Kučera
2019-10-12 15:44       ` Wilson Bustos
2019-10-12 15:50         ` Jean Louis
2019-10-12 16:05           ` Eric Myhre
2019-10-12 16:13             ` Jean Louis
2019-10-13 17:24       ` Ingo Ruhnke
2019-10-12 17:08   ` Alfred M. Szmidt
2019-10-12 17:26     ` Jean Louis
2019-10-12 15:49 ` brice
2019-10-12 17:36 ` znavko
2019-10-12 17:43   ` P
2019-10-29 14:11 ` Eric Brown
2019-10-29 15:05   ` don catnip
  -- strict thread matches above, loose matches on Subject: below --
2019-10-07 21:14 František Kučera
2019-10-07 21:41 ` Ludovic Courtès
2019-10-10  3:45   ` Jean Louis
2019-10-10 10:48     ` František Kučera
2019-10-10  3:40 ` Jean Louis

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