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From: Alan Mackenzie <acm@muc.de>
To: Gregory Heytings <gregory@heytings.org>
Cc: Lars Ingebrigtsen <larsi@gnus.org>, Jean Louis <bugs@gnu.support>,
	emacs-devel@gnu.org
Subject: Re: Suggested experimental test
Date: Mon, 22 Mar 2021 17:46:54 +0000	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <YFjYDt88zF3a1lyL@ACM> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <271290d7aa8b3d984968@heytings.org>

Hello, Gregory.

On Mon, Mar 22, 2021 at 17:08:32 +0000, Gregory Heytings wrote:

[ .... ]

> > For now I count 3 people from mailing lists who already objected to it, 
> > including me.

> I've only seen one (you), and perhaps a second one (Alfred), but I'm not 
> quite sure because he initially thought that open-line would be removed.

You ignored my objections on Saturday.  That makes at least 3 people
who've objected.  That's not counting the people who have merely
"commented" rather than objected whole-heartedly.

[ .... ]

> > Gregory, don't you think that 3 users including me who expressed their 
> > objections is not part of the experiment already?

> No, precisely because nobody actually experimented the potential change. 

There's no need for any "experiment".  It's perfectly obvious what you're
proposing and the effect it will have.

And describing it as an "experiment", as though your intention is purely
to discover something about Emacs use, is more than a little disingenuous.

There remains the possibility that you intend to push through this
removal of the C-o binding, and describing it as "an experiment" should
soften the resistance to it.  Of course, it is very easy to forget to
restore the binding once the "experiment" is over.

C-o is a much used binding, valued by lots of people, including me.

> You cannot give an opinion on a change before experimenting it for some 
> time, say, at least a day.

Anybody who wishes to experiment with this thing is perfectly able to
make the temporary adjustments to his own key maps without annoying other
users of the master branch.

-- 
Alan Mackenzie (Nuremberg, Germany).



  reply	other threads:[~2021-03-22 17:46 UTC|newest]

Thread overview: 171+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
2021-03-20  9:03 Suggested experimental test Gregory Heytings
2021-03-20 11:14 ` Jean Louis
2021-03-20 11:27   ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-03-20 11:34   ` Gregory Heytings
2021-03-20 12:37 ` Proposal to remove C-o binding [was: Suggested experimental test] Alan Mackenzie
2021-03-21  6:53 ` Suggested experimental test Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-03-21  8:35   ` Alfred M. Szmidt
2021-03-21 13:20     ` Gregory Heytings
2021-03-21 18:16       ` Alfred M. Szmidt
2021-03-21 22:16         ` Gregory Heytings
2021-03-21 22:54           ` Alfred M. Szmidt
2021-03-21 23:05             ` Gregory Heytings
2021-03-21 23:13               ` Alfred M. Szmidt
2021-03-21 23:46                 ` Gregory Heytings
2021-03-22  0:40                   ` Alfred M. Szmidt
2021-03-22 10:05                     ` Gregory Heytings
2021-03-22 18:14                       ` Alfred M. Szmidt
2021-03-22 19:06                         ` Gregory Heytings
2021-03-22 19:56                           ` [External] : " Drew Adams
2021-03-22 21:03                             ` Alfred M. Szmidt
2021-03-22 21:26                               ` Drew Adams
2021-03-23  8:06                                 ` Alfred M. Szmidt
2021-03-22 21:08                           ` Alfred M. Szmidt
2021-03-22 11:21                   ` Jean Louis
2021-03-22 11:07               ` Jean Louis
2021-03-22  3:33           ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-03-22 10:05             ` Gregory Heytings
2021-03-22 11:37               ` Philip Kaludercic
2021-03-22 12:20                 ` Gregory Heytings
2021-03-22 17:38               ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-03-22 17:48                 ` Gregory Heytings
2021-03-22 18:11                   ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-03-22 18:15                   ` Alfred M. Szmidt
2021-03-22 18:14               ` Alfred M. Szmidt
2021-03-22  8:59           ` Rudolf Schlatte
2021-03-22 10:05             ` Gregory Heytings
2021-03-22 10:49           ` Jean Louis
2021-03-21 10:48   ` Gregory Heytings
2021-03-21 10:58     ` Sv: " arthur miller
2021-03-21 13:20       ` Gregory Heytings
2021-03-21 18:16       ` Sv: " Alfred M. Szmidt
2021-03-22  5:11         ` Richard Stallman
2021-03-22 10:24       ` Sv: " Jean Louis
2021-03-22 10:14     ` Jean Louis
2021-03-22 12:06     ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-03-22 12:23       ` Gregory Heytings
2021-03-22 16:15         ` Jean Louis
2021-03-22 16:14       ` Jean Louis
2021-03-22 17:08         ` Gregory Heytings
2021-03-22 17:46           ` Alan Mackenzie [this message]
2021-03-22 17:59             ` Gregory Heytings
2021-03-22 18:23             ` Alfred M. Szmidt
2021-03-23  6:09             ` Richard Stallman
2021-03-22 18:03           ` Jean Louis
2021-03-22 17:20       ` Robin Tarsiger
2021-03-22 17:40       ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-03-22 17:55         ` Gregory Heytings
2021-03-22 18:13           ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-03-22 20:22             ` Gregory Heytings
2021-03-23  8:06               ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-03-23 14:15                 ` Gregory Heytings
2021-03-23 14:37                   ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-03-23 16:51                     ` Gregory Heytings
2021-03-23 17:13                       ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-03-23 18:08                       ` Alfred M. Szmidt
2021-03-23 21:06                         ` Gregory Heytings
2021-03-23 21:43                           ` Alfred M. Szmidt
2021-03-23 21:57                             ` Gregory Heytings
2021-03-23 22:08                               ` Alfred M. Szmidt
2021-03-23 22:14                                 ` Gregory Heytings
2021-03-23 22:42                                   ` Alfred M. Szmidt
2021-03-23 23:05                                     ` Gregory Heytings
2021-03-24  5:15                                 ` Richard Stallman
2021-03-24  5:16                           ` Richard Stallman
2021-03-24  6:39                           ` Jean Louis
2021-03-24  6:32                       ` Jean Louis
2021-03-24  6:10                   ` Jean Louis
2021-03-22 18:17         ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-03-22 18:50           ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-03-22 19:09             ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-03-22 19:55               ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-03-22 22:02                 ` Stefan Kangas
2021-03-22 22:33                   ` [External] : " Drew Adams
2021-03-22 23:28                     ` Stefan Kangas
2021-03-22 22:44                   ` Dmitry Gutov
2021-03-22 23:22                     ` Stefan Kangas
2021-03-23  5:22                     ` Jean Louis
2021-03-23  7:43                       ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-03-23 12:28                         ` Philip Kaludercic
2021-03-23 12:41                           ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-03-23 13:09                             ` Dmitry Gutov
2021-03-23 13:27                               ` Philip Kaludercic
2021-03-23 14:00                                 ` Dmitry Gutov
2021-03-23 13:54                               ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-03-23 17:04                                 ` Dmitry Gutov
2021-03-23 21:06                                 ` chad
2021-03-24  5:07                             ` Jean Louis
2021-03-25  5:09                               ` Richard Stallman
2021-03-23  6:12                     ` Yuri Khan
2021-03-24 23:41                       ` Dmitry Gutov
2021-03-25  6:12                         ` Yuri Khan
2021-03-25 13:20                           ` Dmitry Gutov
2021-03-25 14:30                             ` Basil L. Contovounesios
2021-03-25 17:09                               ` Dmitry Gutov
2021-03-25 18:59                               ` Yuri Khan
2021-03-25 19:30                             ` Yuri Khan
2021-03-25 21:11                               ` Stefan Monnier
2021-03-25 23:54                                 ` Dmitry Gutov
2021-03-26 10:34                                   ` Stefan Kangas
2021-03-26 23:13                                     ` Dmitry Gutov
2021-03-26 23:34                               ` Dmitry Gutov
2021-03-27  0:02                                 ` Stefan Monnier
2021-03-28 13:59                                   ` Dmitry Gutov
2021-03-22 20:22               ` Gregory Heytings
2021-03-22 20:36                 ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-03-22 21:03                   ` Alfred M. Szmidt
2021-03-22 20:56         ` Thierry Volpiatto
2021-03-22 18:11       ` [EXTERNAL] " Stephan Mueller
2021-03-22 18:34         ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-03-22 18:56           ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-03-22 19:13             ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-03-22 19:19               ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-03-22 19:25                 ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-03-22 19:49                   ` Stefan Monnier
2021-03-22 19:52                     ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-03-22 20:54                       ` Stefan Monnier
2021-03-22 21:04                         ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-03-23  7:18                           ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-03-22 19:21               ` chad
2021-03-22 19:26                 ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-03-22 19:51                   ` Stefan Monnier
2021-03-22 20:04                     ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-03-22 20:11                       ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-03-22 20:16                         ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-03-23  7:04                           ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-03-22 20:49                       ` Stefan Monnier
2021-03-22 21:02                         ` [External] : " Drew Adams
2021-03-23  7:09                         ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-03-22 19:28                 ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-03-22 19:56                   ` [External] : " Drew Adams
2021-03-22 20:56                     ` Stefan Monnier
2021-03-22 21:19                       ` Drew Adams
2021-03-22 20:22             ` Gregory Heytings
2021-03-23  8:09               ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-03-23 14:15                 ` Gregory Heytings
2021-03-23 14:31                   ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-03-23 17:21                   ` Bob Rogers
2021-03-24  5:42                   ` Jean Louis
2021-03-23 20:55                 ` chad
2021-03-25 17:04           ` [EXTERNAL] " Stephan Mueller
2021-03-22 19:37         ` Stefan Monnier
2021-03-22 19:42         ` Dmitry Gutov
2021-03-22 20:33       ` Jose A. Ortega Ruiz
2021-03-22 18:42     ` Sean Whitton
  -- strict thread matches above, loose matches on Subject: below --
2021-03-23 21:51 Paul W. Rankin via Emacs development discussions.
2021-03-24  8:34 ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-03-24  8:51   ` tomas
2021-03-24  9:16     ` Paul W. Rankin via Emacs development discussions.
2021-03-24  9:22       ` tomas
2021-03-24 10:37     ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-03-24 11:13       ` tomas
2021-03-24 11:51         ` Jean Louis
2021-03-24 11:55           ` tomas
2021-03-25  5:14           ` Richard Stallman
2021-03-24 17:04         ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-03-24 17:19           ` tomas
2021-03-24 17:30         ` Dmitry Gutov
2021-03-24 20:08           ` tomas
2021-03-25  5:14       ` Richard Stallman
2021-03-25  5:48         ` Paul W. Rankin via Emacs development discussions.
2021-03-25  7:46         ` Eli Zaretskii

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