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From: "Jason Spiro" <jasonspiro4@gmail.com>
To: "Drew Adams" <drew.adams@oracle.com>
Cc: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org, 1305@emacsbugs.donarmstrong.com,
	control@emacsbugs.donarmstrong.com
Subject: bug#1305: All code that currently beeps should use visual bellinstead
Date: Sat, 8 Nov 2008 23:08:48 -0500	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <c241693f0811082008w2955cfd3hf2eb89696a3791ad@mail.gmail.com> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <009901c9421f$5bd0a6b0$0200a8c0@us.oracle.com>

2008/11/8 Drew Adams <drew.adams@oracle.com> wrote:

> IIUC, that sounds terrible, to me. Today, one can simply turn off (or down) the
> sound at the computer level and have zero distraction from the bell. That is not
> unusual for users who share an office - it's not unlike turning down the volume
> of a telephone ring.
>
> This possibility of turning off or down the bell at the computer level should
> not be removed. If Emacs just replaces the bell by the visible bell everywhere,
> that will introduce lots of distraction. And unlike the bell, which has variable
> volume, the visible bell is all-or-none.

Many people don't know how to turn the PC speaker beep lower or off.
And IMO its volume is too high by default.  It can distract an entire
classroom.  That's 30+ people per beep.

> What's wrong with leaving things as they have been since day one? Users who want
> to turn off the bell can always do so, within Emacs or otherwise. Users should
> be able to easily get any of these behaviors: (1) bell only, (2) visible bell
> only, (3) bell and visible bell, (4) nothing.

OK, can we make that an option on the Options menu?  Should I file a
new bug to request that?

> We should not systematically replace the bell by the visible bell just because
> someone found the bell to be annoying. It's not difficult to turn off. Users
> have been living with this option since the beginning.
>
> Bell and visible bell should not really be regarded as replacements for each
> other, in any case. They are two different ways to attract a user's attention.
>
> And one is *not* less annoying than the other. At least not for all users in all
> contexts. Each can be very annoying.

Fair enough.

> If you think there are currently too many places where Emacs beeps, try instead
> to remove some of those beeps on a case-by-case basis. Don't just replace
> beeping with flashing.

How do we remove them on a case-by case basis?  The beep from pressing
C-g perhaps is possible to remove individually.  But how about the
"End of buffer" one you get when you try to move the point past the
end of the buffer?  That is just a beep on (error).







  reply	other threads:[~2008-11-09  4:08 UTC|newest]

Thread overview: 180+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
2008-11-09  1:50 bug#1305: All code that currently beeps should use visual bell instead Jason Spiro
2008-11-09  2:00 ` Processed: " Emacs bug Tracking System
2008-11-09  3:57 ` bug#1305: All code that currently beeps should use visual bellinstead Drew Adams
2008-11-09  4:08   ` Jason Spiro [this message]
2008-11-09 19:17     ` Eli Zaretskii
2008-11-09 19:04   ` Eli Zaretskii
2008-11-09 19:19     ` Drew Adams
2008-11-09 20:00       ` Eli Zaretskii
2008-11-10  2:07         ` Stefan Monnier
2008-11-10  6:28           ` Drew Adams
2008-11-11 21:20             ` bug#1305: All code that currently beeps should usevisual bellinstead Drew Adams
2008-11-10  8:34           ` bug#1305: All code that currently beeps should use visual bellinstead Lennart Borgman
2008-11-10 15:22             ` Stefan Monnier
2008-11-10 16:58               ` Lennart Borgman
2008-11-11 18:38                 ` Jason A. Spiro
2008-11-10 22:17           ` Richard M. Stallman
2008-11-11 18:50             ` Jason Spiro
2008-11-12  3:33               ` Richard M. Stallman
2008-11-13  7:41                 ` Jason Spiro
2021-04-17  6:06           ` bug#1305: All code that currently beeps should use visual bell instead Stefan Kangas
2021-04-17  7:03             ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-04-17 11:54             ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-04-17 12:31               ` Gregory Heytings
2021-04-17 12:39                 ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-04-17 12:55                   ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-04-17 13:07                     ` Stefan Kangas
2021-04-17 13:13                       ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-04-17 13:32                         ` Stefan Kangas
2021-04-17 13:39                           ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-04-17 14:05                             ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-04-17 14:08                             ` Stefan Kangas
2021-04-18 10:41                               ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-04-18 12:22                                 ` Stefan Kangas
2021-04-18 13:32                                   ` Gregory Heytings
2021-04-18 15:23                                   ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-04-18 15:42                                     ` Gregory Heytings
2021-04-17 19:17                           ` Basil L. Contovounesios
2021-04-17 17:01                         ` Dmitry Gutov
2021-04-17 20:59                         ` Gregory Heytings
2021-04-17 21:09                           ` Michael Welsh Duggan
2021-04-17 21:17                             ` Gregory Heytings
2021-04-17 21:52                               ` Michael Welsh Duggan
2021-04-17 22:04                                 ` Gregory Heytings
2021-04-17 23:30                                   ` bug#1305: [External] : " Drew Adams
2021-04-18 10:38                                   ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-04-18 12:22                                     ` Stefan Kangas
2021-04-18 12:36                                       ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-04-18 13:10                                         ` Stefan Kangas
2021-04-18 13:15                                           ` Stefan Kangas
2021-04-18 15:22                                           ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-04-18 15:28                                             ` Stefan Monnier
2021-04-18 15:38                                               ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-04-18 18:34                                                 ` Stefan Monnier
2021-04-19 12:37                                                   ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-04-19 13:04                                                     ` Dmitry Gutov
2021-04-19 13:26                                                     ` Stefan Kangas
2021-04-25 18:06                                                       ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-04-25 20:06                                                         ` Stefan Kangas
2021-04-19 13:30                                                     ` Gregory Heytings
2021-04-18 17:02                                             ` Gregory Heytings
2021-04-18 17:13                                               ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-04-18 18:02                                                 ` Gregory Heytings
2021-04-18 18:35                                                   ` Stefan Kangas
2021-04-18 18:45                                                     ` Gregory Heytings
2021-04-18 19:04                                                       ` Stefan Kangas
2021-04-18 19:19                                                     ` Gregory Heytings
2021-04-18 15:06                                         ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-04-18 15:11                                           ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-04-18 15:23                                             ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-04-18 15:35                                               ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-04-19 12:56                                               ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-04-19 13:12                                                 ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-04-25 18:03                                                   ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-04-25 18:52                                                     ` Andreas Schwab
2021-04-25 19:01                                                       ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-04-25 19:18                                                         ` Andreas Schwab
2021-04-25 19:33                                                           ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-04-18 16:07                                             ` Andreas Schwab
2021-04-19 12:38                                               ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-04-18 16:12                                             ` Stefan Kangas
2021-04-18 16:20                                               ` Andreas Schwab
2021-04-19 12:39                                               ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-04-18 15:18                                           ` Dmitry Gutov
2021-04-18 15:26                                         ` Dmitry Gutov
2021-04-18 15:37                                           ` Gregory Heytings
2021-04-18 16:27                                           ` Stefan Kangas
2021-04-18 16:38                                             ` Gregory Heytings
2021-04-18 17:05                                               ` Dmitry Gutov
2021-04-18 17:14                                               ` Stefan Kangas
2021-04-19 12:33                                                 ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-04-19 12:40                                                   ` Dmitry Gutov
2021-04-19 12:47                                                     ` Gregory Heytings
2021-04-19 13:01                                                       ` Dmitry Gutov
2021-04-19 13:16                                                         ` Gregory Heytings
2021-04-19 13:26                                                           ` Stefan Kangas
2021-04-19 13:37                                                           ` Dmitry Gutov
2021-04-19 14:41                                                           ` Alan Third
2021-04-20 14:21                                                             ` Gregory Heytings
2021-04-20 18:27                                                               ` Dmitry Gutov
2021-04-20 19:19                                                                 ` Gregory Heytings
2021-04-21  1:16                                                                   ` Dmitry Gutov
2021-04-21  6:47                                                                     ` Gregory Heytings
2021-04-21 13:11                                                                       ` Stefan Kangas
2021-04-21 14:05                                                                         ` Gregory Heytings
2021-04-21 14:12                                                                           ` Dmitry Gutov
2021-04-21 14:30                                                                           ` Stefan Kangas
2021-04-21 14:35                                                                             ` Gregory Heytings
2021-04-21 14:45                                                                               ` Stefan Kangas
2021-04-21 14:53                                                                                 ` Gregory Heytings
2021-04-21 21:27                                                                                   ` Stefan Kangas
2021-04-21 14:33                                                                         ` Stefan Monnier
2021-04-21 14:51                                                                           ` Dmitry Gutov
2021-04-21 15:14                                                                             ` Stefan Monnier
2021-04-25 18:12                                                                           ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-04-25 21:03                                                                             ` Stefan Monnier
2021-04-27  1:07                                                                               ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-04-27  9:54                                                                                 ` Gregory Heytings
2021-04-27 15:15                                                                                   ` bug#1305: [External] : " Drew Adams
2021-04-27 23:21                                                                                   ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-04-28 10:08                                                                                     ` Stefan Kangas
2021-04-28 13:12                                                                                       ` Gregory Heytings
2021-04-29 16:50                                                                                         ` Dmitry Gutov
2021-04-29 19:48                                                                                           ` Gregory Heytings
2021-04-29 20:17                                                                                             ` Dmitry Gutov
2021-04-29 21:46                                                                                               ` Gregory Heytings
2021-04-29 23:23                                                                                                 ` Dmitry Gutov
2021-04-29 23:35                                                                                                   ` bug#1305: [External] : " Drew Adams
2021-04-29 23:52                                                                                                     ` Dmitry Gutov
2021-05-01  7:50                                                                                                     ` Gregory Heytings
2021-05-01 14:13                                                                                                       ` Drew Adams
2021-05-01 16:55                                                                                                         ` Gregory Heytings
2021-05-01 14:28                                                                                                       ` Stefan Monnier
2021-05-01 16:48                                                                                                         ` Gregory Heytings
2021-05-02 10:44                                                                                                         ` Stefan Kangas
2021-04-30  7:09                                                                                                   ` Gregory Heytings
2021-04-30 22:22                                                                                                     ` Dmitry Gutov
2021-04-30 23:19                                                                                                       ` Gregory Heytings
2021-04-30 23:28                                                                                                         ` Dmitry Gutov
2021-05-01  0:00                                                                                                           ` Gregory Heytings
2021-05-01  0:57                                                                                                             ` Dmitry Gutov
2021-05-01  7:50                                                                                                               ` Gregory Heytings
2021-05-01  0:05                                                                                                           ` bug#1305: [External] : " Drew Adams
2021-05-01  1:08                                                                                                             ` Dmitry Gutov
2021-05-01  2:05                                                                                                               ` Drew Adams
2021-04-29 23:36                                                                                                 ` Stefan Monnier
2021-04-30  7:13                                                                                                   ` Gregory Heytings
2021-04-29 22:38                                                                                               ` Stefan Kangas
2021-04-29 23:11                                                                                                 ` Dmitry Gutov
2021-04-30  6:58                                                                                                 ` Gregory Heytings
2021-04-30 13:08                                                                                                   ` Gregory Heytings
2021-04-30  5:05                                                                                               ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-04-30  6:51                                                                                                 ` Gregory Heytings
2021-04-30  7:06                                                                                                   ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-04-30  7:27                                                                                                     ` Gregory Heytings
2021-04-30  8:03                                                                                                       ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-04-30  8:41                                                                                                         ` Gregory Heytings
2021-04-21 15:08                                                                         ` Dmitry Gutov
2021-04-21 15:18                                                                           ` Stefan Monnier
2021-04-21 16:14                                                                             ` Gregory Heytings
2021-04-21 17:27                                                                               ` Stefan Monnier
2021-04-21 20:26                                                                                 ` Gregory Heytings
2021-04-21 22:03                                                                                 ` bug#1305: [External] : " Drew Adams
2021-04-21 14:45                                                                       ` Dmitry Gutov
2021-04-21 16:01                                                                         ` Gregory Heytings
2021-04-21 17:34                                                                           ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-04-21 20:22                                                                         ` Gregory Heytings
2021-04-19 12:51                                                     ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-04-19 14:03                                                       ` Stefan Monnier
2021-04-18 15:27                                         ` bug#1305: [External] : " Drew Adams
2021-04-18  6:30                           ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-04-18 11:10                             ` Gregory Heytings
2021-04-18 11:38                               ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-04-18 15:14                             ` bug#1305: [External] : " Drew Adams
2021-04-17 13:16                     ` Drew Adams
2021-04-17 16:59                     ` Dmitry Gutov
2008-11-10 21:25 ` Xavier Maillard
  -- strict thread matches above, loose matches on Subject: below --
2008-11-17  7:32 bug#1305: All code that currently beeps should use visual bellinstead Tim Connors
2008-11-17  7:37 ` Jason Spiro
2008-11-17  8:01   ` Sven Joachim
2008-11-17 14:52   ` Stefan Monnier

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