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* Two more computers unable to start X with GDM
@ 2021-03-27  0:43 Bone Baboon
  2021-03-27  2:42 ` Joshua Branson
  0 siblings, 1 reply; 11+ messages in thread
From: Bone Baboon @ 2021-03-27  0:43 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: help-guix

I am trying to get the X server working on a computer that has Guix
installed.

I was having trouble starting an X server on a computer and asked for
help about it here: 
https://lists.gnu.org/archive/html/help-guix/2021-03/msg00197.html

I decided to try to get an X server working on two other computers an
x86_64 and a i686.  I was not able to get an X server working on either
of them.  Below are the detail.

---

i686
GPU: NVIDIA GeForce FX 5200

When I boot the system I am able to unlock the encrypted root partition.
But then the system seems to go unresponsive before I am presented with
a graphical login or a virtual terminal login and I can not switch to
another virtual terminal.  I can however login using ssh and work on a
virtual terminal.

`guix describe` outputs:

```
Generation 1    Mar 25 2021 15:57:08    (current)
  guix ac29d37
    repository URL: https://git.savannah.gnu.org/git/guix.git
    branch: master
    commit: ac29d37e2ffd7a85adfcac9be4d5bce018289bec
```

Here is the operating system configuration:

```
(use-modules (gnu))

(use-service-modules desktop
		     mail
                     networking
                     ssh
                     xorg)

(use-package-modules admin
		     certs
		     compression
                     emacs
                     openbox
                     vpn)

(operating-system

 (locale "en_US.utf8")
 (timezone "America/City")
 (keyboard-layout (keyboard-layout "us" "dvp"))
 (host-name "host")

 (users (cons* (user-account
                (name "user")
                (comment "user")
                (group "users")
                (home-directory "/home/user")
                (supplementary-groups
                 '("wheel" "netdev" "audio" "video")))
               %base-user-accounts))

 (packages
  (append
   (list
    
    ;window manager
    openbox
    
    ;networking
    nss-certs
    openvpn
    
    ;emacs
    emacs
    
    ;compression
    unzip)
   
   %base-packages))

 (services
  (append
   (list (service openssh-service-type)
         (set-xorg-configuration
          (xorg-configuration
           (keyboard-layout keyboard-layout))))
   %desktop-services))

 (bootloader
  (bootloader-configuration
   (bootloader grub-bootloader)
   (target "/dev/sda")
   (keyboard-layout keyboard-layout)))

 (mapped-devices
  (list (mapped-device
         (source
          (uuid "9e6a9648-e6b4-41b4-a467-dd5e5660261e"))
         (target "cryptroot")
         (type luks-device-mapping))))

 (file-systems
  (cons* (file-system
          (mount-point "/")
          (device "/dev/mapper/cryptroot")
          (type "ext4")
          (dependencies mapped-devices))
         %base-file-systems)))
```

---

x86_64
GPU: Intel Mobile 946GM/GMS/GME, 943/940GML Express

When I boot this computer I get a graphical error:

A sad face with the text "Oh no! Something has gone wrong. A problem has
occurred and the system can't recover. Please contact a system
administrator".

It seems to be unresponsive and I can not switch to a virtual terminal.
However I can connect by ssh and use a virtual terminal.

`guix describe` outputs:

```
Generation 3    Mar 23 2021 21:50:15    (current)
  guix 8b2b546
    repository URL: https://git.savannah.gnu.org/git/guix.git
    branch: master
    commit: 8b2b5463963d5d4dee480b0cf73fa4a9eca414ba
```

The configuration is:

```
(use-modules (gnu))

(use-package-modules admin
		     aspell
		     emacs
		     emacs-xyz
		     firmware
		     libreoffice
		     rsync
		     ssh
		     version-control
		     vpn
		     xdisorg
		     xorg
                     certs)

(use-service-modules desktop
		     networking
		     ssh
		     xorg)

(operating-system

  (locale "en_US.utf8")

  (timezone "America/City")

  (keyboard-layout (keyboard-layout "us" "dvp"))

  (host-name "host")

  (users (cons* (user-account
                  (name "user")
                  (comment "user")
                  (group "users")
                  (home-directory "/home/user")
                  (supplementary-groups
                    '("wheel" "netdev" "audio" "video")))
                %base-user-accounts))

  (packages
    (append
     (list

      ;networking
      nss-certs
      ath9k-htc-firmware
      wpa-supplicant
      openvpn
      netcat
      openssh-sans-x
      
      ;version control
      git

      ;spelling
      hunspell
      hunspell-dict-en-us

      ;x
      xorg-server
      xinit
      sx
      xf86-video-vesa
      xf86-video-fbdev
      xf86-video-intel

      ;emacs
      emacs
      emacs-exwm)
      %base-packages))

  (services
   (append
    (list (service openssh-service-type))
   %desktop-services))
  
  (bootloader
    (bootloader-configuration
      (bootloader grub-bootloader)
      (target "/dev/sda")
      (keyboard-layout keyboard-layout)))

  (mapped-devices
    (list (mapped-device
            (source
              (uuid "449c23e1-1130-489d-aa0f-65a1fc26187e"))
            (target "cryptroot")
            (type luks-device-mapping))))

  (file-systems
    (cons* (file-system
             (mount-point "/")
             (device "/dev/mapper/cryptroot")
             (type "ext4")
             (dependencies mapped-devices))
           %base-file-systems))

  (swap-devices (list "/swapfile")))
```


^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 11+ messages in thread

* Re: Two more computers unable to start X with GDM
  2021-03-27  0:43 Two more computers unable to start X with GDM Bone Baboon
@ 2021-03-27  2:42 ` Joshua Branson
  2021-03-27  6:13   ` Yasuaki Kudo
  2021-03-27 14:14   ` Bone Baboon
  0 siblings, 2 replies; 11+ messages in thread
From: Joshua Branson @ 2021-03-27  2:42 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: Bone Baboon; +Cc: help-guix

Bone Baboon <bone.baboon@disroot.org> writes:

> I am trying to get the X server working on a computer that has Guix
> installed.
>
> I was having trouble starting an X server on a computer and asked for
> help about it here:
> https://lists.gnu.org/archive/html/help-guix/2021-03/msg00197.html
>
> I decided to try to get an X server working on two other computers an
> x86_64 and a i686.  I was not able to get an X server working on either
> of them.  Below are the detail.
>
> i686
> GPU: NVIDIA GeForce FX 5200

I'm guessing that the problem is the GPUs...but I would not know how to
help.  Sorry for being so unhelpful.

> x86_64
> GPU: Intel Mobile 946GM/GMS/GME, 943/940GML Express

I feel like the Intel GPUs should work though...


--
Joshua Branson (joshuaBPMan in #guix)
Sent from Emacs and Gnus
  https://gnucode.me
  https://video.hardlimit.com/accounts/joshua_branson/video-channels
  https://propernaming.org
  "You can have whatever you want, as long as you help
enough other people get what they want." - Zig Ziglar


^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 11+ messages in thread

* Re: Two more computers unable to start X with GDM
  2021-03-27  2:42 ` Joshua Branson
@ 2021-03-27  6:13   ` Yasuaki Kudo
  2021-03-27 14:39     ` Bone Baboon
  2021-03-27 14:14   ` Bone Baboon
  1 sibling, 1 reply; 11+ messages in thread
From: Yasuaki Kudo @ 2021-03-27  6:13 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: Joshua Branson; +Cc: help-guix

My apologies if this has been already tried but I personally always use regular Linux with black magic binary drivers unacceptable to plain Guix distribution. 😅 

My AMD (both CPU and Graphics card) computer's visuals will freeze without the modification of the settings to avoid LibreLinux that comes standard with Guix.

Recent AMD video cards appear to have out of the box native drivers built into the Linux Kernel - that's why replaced Nvidia with AMD 😄.   I have a stress-free graphics environment using Guix OS and Regular Linux.  (There was text terminal latency issues with X11 so I use Wayland - it has its limitations and bugs but works better for me😄)

-Yasu






> On Mar 27, 2021, at 11:43, Joshua Branson <jbranso@dismail.de> wrote:
> 
> Bone Baboon <bone.baboon@disroot.org> writes:
> 
>> I am trying to get the X server working on a computer that has Guix
>> installed.
>> 
>> I was having trouble starting an X server on a computer and asked for
>> help about it here:
>> https://lists.gnu.org/archive/html/help-guix/2021-03/msg00197.html
>> 
>> I decided to try to get an X server working on two other computers an
>> x86_64 and a i686.  I was not able to get an X server working on either
>> of them.  Below are the detail.
>> 
>> i686
>> GPU: NVIDIA GeForce FX 5200
> 
> I'm guessing that the problem is the GPUs...but I would not know how to
> help.  Sorry for being so unhelpful.
> 
>> x86_64
>> GPU: Intel Mobile 946GM/GMS/GME, 943/940GML Express
> 
> I feel like the Intel GPUs should work though...
> 
> 
> --
> Joshua Branson (joshuaBPMan in #guix)
> Sent from Emacs and Gnus
>  https://gnucode.me
>  https://video.hardlimit.com/accounts/joshua_branson/video-channels
>  https://propernaming.org
>  "You can have whatever you want, as long as you help
> enough other people get what they want." - Zig Ziglar
> 


^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 11+ messages in thread

* Re: Two more computers unable to start X with GDM
  2021-03-27  2:42 ` Joshua Branson
  2021-03-27  6:13   ` Yasuaki Kudo
@ 2021-03-27 14:14   ` Bone Baboon
  2021-03-27 15:29     ` Joshua Branson
  2021-03-27 18:24     ` Leo Famulari
  1 sibling, 2 replies; 11+ messages in thread
From: Bone Baboon @ 2021-03-27 14:14 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: Joshua Branson; +Cc: help-guix


Joshua Branson writes:

> Bone Baboon <bone.baboon@disroot.org> writes:
>
>> i686
>> GPU: NVIDIA GeForce FX 5200
>
> I'm guessing that the problem is the GPUs...but I would not know how to
> help.

X server worked fine with this NVIDIA GeForce FX 5200 GPU when Debian
was installed on this computer.  It also looks like Debian uses a
deblobbed kernal based on this Wikipedia article.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Binary_blob

> Sorry for being so unhelpful.

Thank you for your help.

>> x86_64
>> GPU: Intel Mobile 946GM/GMS/GME, 943/940GML Express
>
> I feel like the Intel GPUs should work though...


^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 11+ messages in thread

* Re: Two more computers unable to start X with GDM
  2021-03-27  6:13   ` Yasuaki Kudo
@ 2021-03-27 14:39     ` Bone Baboon
  0 siblings, 0 replies; 11+ messages in thread
From: Bone Baboon @ 2021-03-27 14:39 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: Yasuaki Kudo; +Cc: help-guix


Yasuaki Kudo writes:

> My apologies if this has been already tried but I personally always
> use regular Linux with black magic binary drivers unacceptable to
> plain Guix distribution. 😅 
>
> My AMD (both CPU and Graphics card) computer's visuals will freeze
> without the modification of the settings to avoid LibreLinux that
> comes standard with Guix. 
>
> Recent AMD video cards appear to have out of the box native drivers
> built into the Linux Kernel - that's why replaced Nvidia with AMD 😄.
> I have a stress-free graphics environment using Guix OS and Regular
> Linux.  (There was text terminal latency issues with X11 so I use
> Wayland - it has its limitations and bugs but works better for me😄

Thank you for your suggestion.

Switching from Linux-libre to Linux with Guix would be a last resort for
me.  The deblobbed Linux-libre kernel was one of the key features that
attracted me to Guix.

I would be more inclined to try to make one of these work first:
- Gentoo with a deblobbed kernel
- OpenBSD (has no binary blobs)
- Devuan testing (I think they have a deblobbed kernel)

However I still want to make Guix with Linux-libre work as Guix has
other features that I like that Gentoo, OpenBSD and Devuan do not have. 


^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 11+ messages in thread

* Re: Two more computers unable to start X with GDM
  2021-03-27 14:14   ` Bone Baboon
@ 2021-03-27 15:29     ` Joshua Branson
  2021-03-27 18:24     ` Leo Famulari
  1 sibling, 0 replies; 11+ messages in thread
From: Joshua Branson @ 2021-03-27 15:29 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: Bone Baboon; +Cc: help-guix

Bone Baboon <bone.baboon@disroot.org> writes:

> Joshua Branson writes:
>
>> Bone Baboon <bone.baboon@disroot.org> writes:
>>
>>> i686
>>> GPU: NVIDIA GeForce FX 5200
>>
>> I'm guessing that the problem is the GPUs...but I would not know how to
>> help.
>
> X server worked fine with this NVIDIA GeForce FX 5200 GPU when Debian
> was installed on this computer.  It also looks like Debian uses a
> deblobbed kernal based on this Wikipedia article.
> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Binary_blob

I can also confirm that Debian usually works better out of the box for
me on various laptops that I have tried.  :)


-- 
Joshua Branson (joshuaBPMan in #guix)
Sent from Emacs and Gnus
  https://gnucode.me
  https://video.hardlimit.com/accounts/joshua_branson/video-channels
  https://propernaming.org
  "You can have whatever you want, as long as you help
enough other people get what they want." - Zig Ziglar
  


^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 11+ messages in thread

* Re: Two more computers unable to start X with GDM
  2021-03-27 14:14   ` Bone Baboon
  2021-03-27 15:29     ` Joshua Branson
@ 2021-03-27 18:24     ` Leo Famulari
  2021-03-29  8:06       ` Yasuaki Kudo
  1 sibling, 1 reply; 11+ messages in thread
From: Leo Famulari @ 2021-03-27 18:24 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: Bone Baboon; +Cc: help-guix, Joshua Branson

On Sat, Mar 27, 2021 at 10:14:05AM -0400, Bone Baboon wrote:
> X server worked fine with this NVIDIA GeForce FX 5200 GPU when Debian
> was installed on this computer.  It also looks like Debian uses a
> deblobbed kernal based on this Wikipedia article.
> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Binary_blob

The Guix kernel (linux-libre) and the Debian kernel (Linux) have
different hardware support and, in general, Linux supports more hardware
than linux-libre.


^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 11+ messages in thread

* Re: Two more computers unable to start X with GDM
  2021-03-27 18:24     ` Leo Famulari
@ 2021-03-29  8:06       ` Yasuaki Kudo
  2021-03-29 14:32         ` Gary Johnson
  2021-03-29 15:13         ` Joshua Branson
  0 siblings, 2 replies; 11+ messages in thread
From: Yasuaki Kudo @ 2021-03-29  8:06 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: Leo Famulari; +Cc: help-guix, Joshua Branson

I read a little bit about the current state of video cards, etc - man this seems like an uphill battle😅  Basically no manufacture sympathizes with the concept of total transparency.

I was just thinking what the practical end-game of this might be - do you think at some point there will be an FPGA+power+various I/O ports kit that can be totally programmed to provide CPU and video acceleration?   Something like that might be the only way to end this nonsense😅

Then the battle will be proprietary vs free software rather than hardware.   But then again, I don't know what kind of nasty patents there might be...

-Yasu



> On Mar 28, 2021, at 03:25, Leo Famulari <leo@famulari.name> wrote:
> 
> On Sat, Mar 27, 2021 at 10:14:05AM -0400, Bone Baboon wrote:
>> X server worked fine with this NVIDIA GeForce FX 5200 GPU when Debian
>> was installed on this computer.  It also looks like Debian uses a
>> deblobbed kernal based on this Wikipedia article.
>> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Binary_blob
> 
> The Guix kernel (linux-libre) and the Debian kernel (Linux) have
> different hardware support and, in general, Linux supports more hardware
> than linux-libre.
> 


^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 11+ messages in thread

* Re: Two more computers unable to start X with GDM
  2021-03-29  8:06       ` Yasuaki Kudo
@ 2021-03-29 14:32         ` Gary Johnson
  2021-03-29 16:24           ` Leo Famulari
  2021-03-29 15:13         ` Joshua Branson
  1 sibling, 1 reply; 11+ messages in thread
From: Gary Johnson @ 2021-03-29 14:32 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: Yasuaki Kudo; +Cc: help-guix

Yasuaki Kudo <yasu@yasuaki.com> writes:

> I read a little bit about the current state of video cards, etc - man
> this seems like an uphill battle😅 Basically no manufacture
> sympathizes with the concept of total transparency.

I've always had good luck using linux-libre with Intel integrated
graphics controllers.

> I was just thinking what the practical end-game of this might be - do
> you think at some point there will be an FPGA+power+various I/O ports
> kit that can be totally programmed to provide CPU and video
> acceleration? Something like that might be the only way to end this
> nonsense😅

I like to buy my laptops from ThinkPenguin. All of the computers they
sell work out of the box with linux-libre. I'm, of course, running Guix
System on one of their laptops right now.

  https://www.thinkpenguin.com/

Happy hacking,
  Gary

-- 
GPG Key ID: 7BC158ED
Use `gpg --search-keys lambdatronic' to find me
Protect yourself from surveillance: https://emailselfdefense.fsf.org
=======================================================================
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Please avoid sending me MS-Office attachments.
See http://www.gnu.org/philosophy/no-word-attachments.html


^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 11+ messages in thread

* Re: Two more computers unable to start X with GDM
  2021-03-29  8:06       ` Yasuaki Kudo
  2021-03-29 14:32         ` Gary Johnson
@ 2021-03-29 15:13         ` Joshua Branson
  1 sibling, 0 replies; 11+ messages in thread
From: Joshua Branson @ 2021-03-29 15:13 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: Yasuaki Kudo; +Cc: Leo Famulari, Bone Baboon, help-guix

Yasuaki Kudo <yasu@yasuaki.com> writes:

> I read a little bit about the current state of video cards, etc - man
> this seems like an uphill battle😅 Basically no manufacture
> sympathizes with the concept of total transparency.
>
> I was just thinking what the practical end-game of this might be - do
> you think at some point there will be an FPGA+power+various I/O ports
> kit that can be totally programmed to provide CPU and video
> acceleration?  Something like that might be the only way to end this
> nonsense😅

There is this:

https://www.crowdsupply.com/libre-risc-v/m-class/updates

They are still working on it, but that website hasn't seen updates in a
while.  They have another website that they update more often.

>
> Then the battle will be proprietary vs free software rather than
> hardware.  But then again, I don't know what kind of nasty patents
> there might be...
>
> -Yasu
>
>> On Mar 28, 2021, at 03:25, Leo Famulari <leo@famulari.name> wrote:
>> 
>> On Sat, Mar 27, 2021 at 10:14:05AM -0400, Bone Baboon wrote:
>>> X server worked fine with this NVIDIA GeForce FX 5200 GPU when Debian
>>> was installed on this computer.  It also looks like Debian uses a
>>> deblobbed kernal based on this Wikipedia article.
>>> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Binary_blob
>> 
>> The Guix kernel (linux-libre) and the Debian kernel (Linux) have
>> different hardware support and, in general, Linux supports more hardware
>> than linux-libre.
>> 

-- 
Joshua Branson (joshuaBPMan in #guix)
Sent from Emacs and Gnus
  https://gnucode.me
  https://video.hardlimit.com/accounts/joshua_branson/video-channels
  https://propernaming.org
  "You can have whatever you want, as long as you help
enough other people get what they want." - Zig Ziglar
  


^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 11+ messages in thread

* Re: Two more computers unable to start X with GDM
  2021-03-29 14:32         ` Gary Johnson
@ 2021-03-29 16:24           ` Leo Famulari
  0 siblings, 0 replies; 11+ messages in thread
From: Leo Famulari @ 2021-03-29 16:24 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: Gary Johnson; +Cc: help-guix

On Mon, Mar 29, 2021 at 10:32:49AM -0400, Gary Johnson wrote:
> I've always had good luck using linux-libre with Intel integrated
> graphics controllers.

Agreed, Intel is the way to go for free graphics drivers.


^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 11+ messages in thread

end of thread, other threads:[~2021-03-29 16:25 UTC | newest]

Thread overview: 11+ messages (download: mbox.gz / follow: Atom feed)
-- links below jump to the message on this page --
2021-03-27  0:43 Two more computers unable to start X with GDM Bone Baboon
2021-03-27  2:42 ` Joshua Branson
2021-03-27  6:13   ` Yasuaki Kudo
2021-03-27 14:39     ` Bone Baboon
2021-03-27 14:14   ` Bone Baboon
2021-03-27 15:29     ` Joshua Branson
2021-03-27 18:24     ` Leo Famulari
2021-03-29  8:06       ` Yasuaki Kudo
2021-03-29 14:32         ` Gary Johnson
2021-03-29 16:24           ` Leo Famulari
2021-03-29 15:13         ` Joshua Branson

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