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From: Drew Adams <drew.adams@oracle.com>
To: "Przemysław Wojnowski" <esperanto@cumego.com>,
	"Dmitry Gutov" <dgutov@yandex.ru>,
	"Paul Eggert" <eggert@cs.ucla.edu>,
	emacs-devel@gnu.org
Subject: RE: Escaping quotes in docstrings, Was: A simple solution to "Upcoming loss of usability ..."
Date: Sun, 2 Aug 2015 12:16:40 -0700 (PDT)	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <ec012e80-b66f-44bd-9082-4427b248bb1a@default> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <55BDD9B5.108@cumego.com>

> 1. What was purpose of the change?
>    To replace `' with the other one (sorry, don't have it on my 
>    keyboard)? What for?
> 
> 2. *Was it worth it*?
>    Considering number of people involved and time spent by those
>    writing and reading emails (even I'm wasting my time now on 
>    writing this email).
> 
> Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying that you shouldn't do what
> you are doing.

Provided it is optional for users to suffer from it.
Let them opt in, if they really want this behavior.

At a minimum, let them easily opt out, pretty-please.

I don't even see that possibility currently.  How to opt out
doesn't seem to be documented, at least, and lots of source
code seems to hard-code your changes.

We were told over and over that this would be just a healthy
"experiment" and that people shouldn't react prematurely.

Well, it's been several months now.  Are you prepared to
back this misguided feature out?  

Or were those who decried such a gratuitous & invasive
development correct, in supposing that backing-out would
become next to impossible and this gross hack job would be
here to stay, whatever the post-mortem judgment might be?

> Everyone can do with their time what they want, but maybe it
> would be good to create a Backlog for Emacs and prioritize
> (at least a bit) to see what's really important and _is_
> worth the effort.

+1

So far, my impression is that there have been a shiPload of
deep changes that try to work around all kinds of problems
that have been introduced - and to work around the problems
that those workarounds have introduced...

I haven't seen such an invasive change in a long time (never?).
Makes Rube Goldberg machines look Occam-elegant.  And for
what?  Just to fit the esthetic, cosmetic concerns of two
or three developers?

Please tell users now _how to opt out completely_, at a
minimum.  If letting users restore the longstanding behavior
means getting rid of hard-coded hacks, so be it - please do it.



  reply	other threads:[~2015-08-02 19:16 UTC|newest]

Thread overview: 51+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
2015-06-25 14:59 A simple solution to "Upcoming loss of usability ..." Oleh Krehel
2015-06-25 15:37 ` Dmitry Gutov
2015-06-25 16:36 ` Paul Eggert
2015-06-25 17:00   ` Oleh Krehel
2015-06-25 20:48     ` Paul Eggert
2015-06-25 21:10       ` Dmitry Gutov
2015-06-25 22:15         ` Paul Eggert
2015-06-25 22:25           ` Dmitry Gutov
2015-06-25 22:41             ` Paul Eggert
2015-06-25 22:52               ` Dmitry Gutov
2015-06-27 15:00         ` raman
2015-06-25 18:32   ` Dmitry Gutov
2015-06-25 22:17     ` Paul Eggert
2015-06-25 22:38       ` Dmitry Gutov
2015-06-26  2:35         ` Paul Eggert
2015-06-26 12:06           ` Dmitry Gutov
2015-06-27 17:28             ` Paul Eggert
2015-06-27 17:53               ` Dmitry Gutov
2015-06-27 21:09                 ` Paul Eggert
2015-06-28  1:04                   ` Dmitry Gutov
2015-06-28 15:20                     ` Paul Eggert
2015-06-28 20:27                       ` Escaping quotes in docstrings, Was: " Dmitry Gutov
2015-06-28 23:29                         ` Dmitry Gutov
2015-07-01  2:56                           ` Paul Eggert
2015-07-02  0:09                             ` Dmitry Gutov
2015-07-02  6:57                               ` Paul Eggert
2015-07-02  9:46                                 ` Dmitry Gutov
2015-07-06  6:12                                 ` Paul Eggert
2015-07-06 12:07                                   ` Dmitry Gutov
2015-07-06 16:30                                     ` Paul Eggert
2015-07-06 22:10                                       ` Dmitry Gutov
2015-07-07  7:54                                         ` Paul Eggert
2015-07-07  8:39                                           ` Dmitry Gutov
2015-08-01  1:36                                             ` Paul Eggert
2015-08-01 21:05                                               ` Dmitry Gutov
2015-08-02  6:56                                                 ` Paul Eggert
2015-08-02 12:51                                                   ` Dmitry Gutov
2015-08-02 15:13                                                     ` Paul Eggert
2015-08-02 18:31                                                       ` Dmitry Gutov
2015-08-02  8:49                                                 ` Przemysław Wojnowski
2015-08-02 19:16                                                   ` Drew Adams [this message]
2015-06-27 17:57               ` Dmitry Gutov
2015-06-25 23:12       ` João Távora
2015-06-26  7:40       ` Oleh Krehel
2015-06-26 14:54         ` Paul Eggert
2015-06-26 15:03           ` Dmitry Gutov
2015-06-25 20:58   ` Alan Mackenzie
2015-06-25 22:34     ` Paul Eggert
2015-06-25 22:40       ` Dmitry Gutov
2015-06-25 22:45         ` Paul Eggert
2015-06-25 22:55           ` Dmitry Gutov

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