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From: Richard Stallman <rms@gnu.org>
To: Karl Fogel <kfogel@red-bean.com>
Cc: cwebber@dustycloud.org, ndame@protonmail.com, emacs-devel@gnu.org
Subject: Re: What is the most useful potential feature which Emacs lacks?
Date: Thu, 14 May 2020 23:16:49 -0400	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <E1jZQq9-0007tZ-FW@fencepost.gnu.org> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <87y2pvqhuj.fsf@red-bean.com> (message from Karl Fogel on Wed, 13 May 2020 23:08:04 -0500)

[[[ To any NSA and FBI agents reading my email: please consider    ]]]
[[[ whether defending the US Constitution against all enemies,     ]]]
[[[ foreign or domestic, requires you to follow Snowden's example. ]]]

  > User does `C-x C-f' to find a file, but they hit Return at the
  > wrong moment while typing the file path, causing a Dired buffer
  > comes up visiting the file's directory.  The user is, of course,
  > totally baffled by this result.  And yet it's obvious why this is
  > a good default behavior for `find-file' -- for people who
  > understand what's going on.

This is a useful observation.  How can we arrange to inform users
about this at the right time?

One idea: the first time a user tries to specify a directory in find-file,
display a help screen to explain what that means, and describe a few
usual ways out.

Do you think this would ameliorate the problem?

Any other ideas?

    > If we just say "Emacs should be easier for newcomers to learn",
    > that's not a useful rallying cry IMHO.

I think it can have a practical benefit -- if it motivates people to
observe beginners' stumbling blocks as you have done, and then to study
how to help beginners cope with them.

What other frequent points of confusion have you observed?

It could be useful to make a list of those, and we could
try to work on each of them over time.

  > If we say instead "Emacs should try to attract newcomers who have
  > a higher-than-average probability of becoming high-investment
  > users, and should explain early on to those newcomers what the
  > road ahead looks like"

We should do that, but not by exaggerating.

-- 
Dr Richard Stallman
Chief GNUisance of the GNU Project (https://gnu.org)
Founder, Free Software Foundation (https://fsf.org)
Internet Hall-of-Famer (https://internethalloffame.org)





  parent reply	other threads:[~2020-05-15  3:16 UTC|newest]

Thread overview: 188+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
2020-05-11 20:09 What is the most useful potential feature which Emacs lacks? ndame
2020-05-12  6:57 ` Arthur Miller
2020-05-12  7:13   ` ndame
2020-05-12 12:54     ` Stefan Kangas
2020-05-12 13:07       ` ndame
2020-05-12 14:56         ` Arthur Miller
2020-05-13  0:39   ` HaiJun Zhang
2020-05-13  1:34     ` Eduardo Ochs
2020-05-13  1:50       ` Eduardo Ochs
2020-05-12 10:00 ` H. Dieter Wilhelm
2020-05-12 11:10   ` Michael Albinus
2020-05-13  3:55     ` Richard Stallman
2020-05-13 10:32       ` Michael Albinus
2020-05-14  5:11         ` Richard Stallman
2020-05-14 10:34           ` Michael Albinus
2020-05-15  3:25             ` Richard Stallman
2020-05-15  8:15               ` Michael Albinus
2020-05-16  4:18                 ` Richard Stallman
2020-05-16 22:07                   ` H. Dieter Wilhelm
2020-05-18  3:45                     ` Richard Stallman
2020-05-18  8:05                       ` Tramp and crypted files (was: What is the most useful potential feature which Emacs lacks?) Michael Albinus
2020-05-19  4:01                         ` Richard Stallman
2020-05-19 14:38                           ` Tramp and crypted files Michael Albinus
2020-05-20  4:00                             ` Richard Stallman
2020-05-19  8:51                         ` Deus Max
2020-05-19 14:48                           ` Michael Albinus
2020-05-20  8:27                             ` Deus Max
2020-05-20  8:49                               ` Michael Albinus
2020-05-20 17:49                                 ` Deus Max
2020-05-20 19:09                                   ` Michael Albinus
2020-05-25 18:48                               ` Michael Albinus
2020-05-26  4:13                                 ` Richard Stallman
2020-05-26  7:13                                   ` Michael Albinus
2020-05-27  3:09                                     ` Richard Stallman
2020-05-28 13:05                                 ` Deus Max
2020-05-29  9:16                                   ` Michael Albinus
2020-05-29 16:33                                     ` Deus Max
2020-06-07 15:08                                       ` Michael Albinus
2020-06-13 12:06                                         ` Deus Max
2020-06-13 13:15                                           ` Michael Albinus
2020-05-29 18:22                                     ` Deus Max
2020-05-17  8:28                   ` What is the most useful potential feature which Emacs lacks? Michael Albinus
2020-05-12 11:57   ` Eric S Fraga
2020-05-12 15:34     ` Michael Albinus
2020-05-12 16:33       ` Eric S Fraga
2020-05-12 17:39         ` Tramp nextcloud (was: What is the most useful potential feature which Emacs lacks?) Michael Albinus
2020-05-12 18:12           ` Tramp nextcloud H. Dieter Wilhelm
2020-05-13  8:59           ` Eric S Fraga
2020-05-13  9:33             ` Tramp nextcloud (SOLVED) Eric S Fraga
2020-05-13 10:45               ` Michael Albinus
2020-05-13 11:10                 ` Eric S Fraga
2020-05-12 15:04   ` What is the most useful potential feature which Emacs lacks? Arthur Miller
2020-05-12 16:00   ` Drew Adams
2020-05-12 12:30 ` Helmut Eller
2020-05-13  1:22   ` Jose A. Ortega Ruiz
     [not found]     ` <5AYrQ3kvagEiLsXcUuMZvkDj1gBHT4YnJyVCX6RsvMkayS1ZbGWk18lJOyo_m8XanhsUygUtEqZw8OOOQOlwkg==@protonmail.internalid>
2020-05-13  2:45     ` Stefan Monnier
2020-05-13  3:58       ` jao
2020-05-13 23:12   ` João Távora
2020-05-14  0:04     ` Stefan Kangas
2020-05-14 10:08       ` Helmut Eller
2020-05-14 10:17         ` tomas
2020-05-14 10:34           ` Robert Pluim
2020-05-14 10:40             ` tomas
2020-05-15  3:25               ` Richard Stallman
2020-05-15  3:39                 ` Dmitry Gutov
2020-05-15  3:25               ` Richard Stallman
2020-05-15  3:51                 ` Dmitry Gutov
2020-05-16  4:18                   ` Richard Stallman
2020-05-16  9:29                     ` Dmitry Gutov
2020-05-17  2:55                       ` Richard Stallman
2020-05-15  3:17       ` Richard Stallman
2020-05-15  6:56         ` Eli Zaretskii
2020-05-16  4:18           ` Richard Stallman
2020-05-16  7:13             ` Eli Zaretskii
2020-05-16 12:56               ` Stefan Monnier
2020-05-17  2:56               ` Richard Stallman
2020-05-17  7:22                 ` Andreas Schwab
2020-05-18  3:42                 ` Richard Stallman
2020-05-18 14:29                   ` Eli Zaretskii
2020-05-19  3:56                     ` shr.el rename? Richard Stallman
2020-05-19  5:50                       ` Drew Adams
2020-05-19 12:41                       ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2020-05-19 15:04                         ` Stefan Monnier
2020-05-19 16:47                           ` T.V Raman
2020-05-20  3:59                           ` Richard Stallman
2020-05-20  4:02                         ` Richard Stallman
2020-05-18 15:20             ` What is the most useful potential feature which Emacs lacks? Filipp Gunbin
2020-05-18 15:26               ` Eli Zaretskii
2020-05-15  9:10         ` Robert Pluim
2020-05-15 10:21           ` Eli Zaretskii
2020-05-15 11:07             ` Robert Pluim
2020-05-15 11:28               ` Eli Zaretskii
2020-05-15 11:49                 ` Robert Pluim
2020-05-15 11:58                   ` Eli Zaretskii
2020-05-15 12:14                     ` Robert Pluim
2020-05-15 12:56                       ` Eli Zaretskii
2020-05-15 15:22                       ` Stefan Monnier
2020-05-15 15:28                         ` Robert Pluim
2020-05-16  4:18               ` Richard Stallman
2020-05-16  4:17           ` Richard Stallman
2020-05-16  6:50             ` Andreas Schwab
2020-05-16  8:24               ` Yuri Khan
2020-05-17  2:56               ` Richard Stallman
2020-05-14 11:57   ` Dmitry Gutov
2020-05-12 12:44 ` Christopher Lemmer Webber
2020-05-13 16:36   ` Karl Fogel
2020-05-14  3:01     ` Christopher Lemmer Webber
2020-05-14  4:08       ` Karl Fogel
2020-05-14 10:01         ` Robert Pluim
2020-05-14 16:35         ` Christopher Lemmer Webber
2020-05-17  1:31           ` Dmitry Gutov
2020-05-18  3:43             ` Richard Stallman
2020-05-15  3:16         ` Richard Stallman [this message]
2020-05-28  4:00           ` Karl Fogel
2020-05-28 13:18             ` Stefan Monnier
2020-05-28 17:19               ` Karl Fogel
2020-05-28 18:05                 ` Drew Adams
2020-05-28 18:45                 ` Dmitry Gutov
2020-05-28 20:52                   ` Alan Third
2020-05-28 21:02                     ` Stefan Monnier
2020-05-28 21:10                       ` Alan Third
2020-05-28 21:27                         ` andres.ramirez
2020-05-28 21:54                         ` Stefan Monnier
2020-05-29 13:24                         ` Arthur Miller
2020-05-28 21:14                       ` Joost Kremers
2020-05-29 13:24                         ` Arthur Miller
2020-05-29  1:24                       ` Karl Fogel
2020-05-29  3:36                         ` Drew Adams
2020-05-29  3:06                     ` Richard Stallman
2020-05-29  3:41                       ` Drew Adams
2020-05-29 13:19                       ` Arthur Miller
2020-05-30  5:23                         ` Thibaut Verron
2020-05-29 13:11                     ` Arthur Miller
2020-05-13 17:48 ` ndame
2020-05-14  1:15   ` Arthur Miller
2020-05-14  4:10     ` ndame
2020-05-14  4:28       ` Arthur Miller
2020-05-15 10:38       ` Eli Zaretskii
2020-05-17  5:37         ` ndame
2020-05-17 12:42           ` Stefan Kangas
2020-05-17 13:18             ` Arthur Miller
2020-05-19  3:47               ` Richard Stallman
2020-05-17 22:03             ` chad
2020-05-13 21:05 ` Vasilij Schneidermann
2020-05-14 14:35 ` Björn Lindqvist
2020-06-03 11:39 ` What is the most useful potential feature which Emacs lacks? A: Autocompletion Konstantin Kharlamov
2020-06-03 12:36   ` Dmitry Gutov
2020-06-03 12:50     ` Konstantin Kharlamov
2020-06-03 13:10       ` Dmitry Gutov
2020-06-03 13:59         ` Konstantin Kharlamov
2020-06-03 14:21           ` Dmitry Gutov
2020-06-03 14:40             ` Konstantin Kharlamov
2020-06-03 18:49               ` Dmitry Gutov
2020-06-03 14:49   ` Drew Adams
2020-06-03 20:15     ` Konstantin Kharlamov
2020-06-03 20:36       ` Drew Adams
2020-06-03 20:49         ` Drew Adams
  -- strict thread matches above, loose matches on Subject: below --
2020-05-12  7:11 What is the most useful potential feature which Emacs lacks? Zhu Zihao
2020-05-12  7:22 ndame
2020-05-27 15:58 Van Ly
2020-05-28  3:13 ` Richard Stallman
2020-05-30  7:17   ` Van Ly
2020-05-31  7:10     ` Richard Stallman
2020-05-31 10:01       ` Van Ly
2020-05-31 12:49         ` excalamus--- via Emacs development discussions.
2020-06-01  3:54           ` Richard Stallman
2020-06-01  5:21             ` Yuri Khan
2020-06-02  2:55               ` Richard Stallman
2020-06-02  3:57             ` Karl Fogel
2020-06-02  5:15               ` Ihor Radchenko
2020-06-02 13:42               ` Stefan Monnier
2020-06-01  9:11           ` Bastien
2020-06-01 15:03             ` Eli Zaretskii
2020-06-01 23:32               ` Bastien
2020-06-01 23:50                 ` Jean-Christophe Helary
2020-06-06  9:42                   ` Eli Zaretskii
2020-06-06  9:58                     ` tomas
2020-06-06 10:11                       ` Eli Zaretskii
2020-06-06 10:29                         ` tomas
2020-06-06 14:19                         ` Stefan Monnier
2020-06-06 14:58                           ` Arthur Miller
2020-06-06 20:18                         ` tomas
2020-06-06 22:20                           ` Stefan Monnier
2020-06-06  9:59                     ` Thibaut Verron
2020-06-06 10:12                       ` Eli Zaretskii
2020-06-06 10:18                       ` tomas
2020-06-06 12:05                     ` Jean-Christophe Helary
2021-03-04 11:46 Evgeny Zajcev

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