From: Philip McGrath <philip@philipmcgrath.com>
To: Liliana Marie Prikler <liliana.prikler@ist.tugraz.at>,
55248@debbugs.gnu.org
Cc: "Ludovic Courtès" <ludo@gnu.org>,
"Maxime Devos" <maximedevos@telenet.be>,
"Liliana Marie Prikler" <liliana.prikler@gmail.com>
Subject: [bug#55248] [PATCH v3 8/9] gnu: chez-scheme-for-racket: Fix supported systems.
Date: Thu, 12 May 2022 01:26:36 -0400 [thread overview]
Message-ID: <885eb0ab-e5a5-fa20-3aeb-ade167775a28@philipmcgrath.com> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <77ff7763a7c87424e7195e9f8624dbdd2a26193c.camel@ist.tugraz.at>
Hi,
On 5/9/22 05:36, Liliana Marie Prikler wrote:
> Hi,
>
> Am Montag, dem 09.05.2022 um 03:55 -0400 schrieb Philip McGrath:
>> Concretely, there are no other uses in Guix.
>>
>> I do not know a robust, correct way to use
>> 'nix-system->chez-machine'---certainly not without it growing many
>> additional features, like maybe computing endianness for pbarch
>> backends when we are able to build them. For example, if we continued
>> using it as we did in 'stex', you couldn't build a package graph for
>> nonthreaded Chez simply by applying a package transformation to
>> remove '--threads' from its '#:configure-flags', because that would
>> change the machine type without updating the uses of 'nix-system-
>>> chez-machine'.
> True, you would have to change the machine type, but I think I already
> noted that we might want to use this machine type as a distinguishing
> factor in packages built on top of chez (and later chez-build-system
> perhaps). You could do this the other way round by deriving flags from
> the given machine-type, e.g. stex for threaded chez machine is given --
> threads, otherwise it's not. Since we have named symbols for these
> features, we could have a "package-with-chez-features" or similar
> transformer. Being able to specify this machine is a strength, not a
> weakness.
>
I can imagine something like this might be useful eventually. My problem
is that, right now, 'nix-system->chez-machine' is an attractive
nuisance: it sounds useful, but I don't know any way of using it that
wouldn't be subtly wrong. I don't even feel certain even about what
cases 'nix-system->chez-machine' would need to cover to be correct and
useful: a fair amount seems to depend on what turns out to be necessary
for cross-compilation and the portable bytecode architectures (which I
hope to work out by July).
>> The idea is that the "portable bytecode" backends should work,
>> including thread support, on any system with a reasonably capable C
>> compiler.
> The idea. In practice, what racket deems reasonably capable can change
> over time and might result in them dropping some architectures
> currently supported. What do you do then?
>
I mean, "over time", at the extreme, anything "might" happen, but I
don't think that's worth worrying about. Racket has an extremely strong
commitment to backwards compatibility. To pick one example, support
libraries for racket/draw and racket/gui are still maintained for
ppc-macosx, which the vendor hasn't released any software for in a
decade or more (depending on how you prefer to count). The C code
deliberately does not require C99 support.
>> The presence of an entry in '%chez-features-table' explicitly means
>> that 'chez-scheme-for-racket' can generate native code.
> That is not explicit at all. There might be an explicit comment
> stating so somewhere, but in terms of actual code, it's super
> implicit.
>
>> There are no other "features" that vary among systems for
>> 'chez-scheme-for-racket'. It doesn't rely on pre-built bootfiles for
>> bootstrapping. Since the initial fork at the beginning of 2017, when
>> support for new systems has been added, native threads have been
>> supported immediately. Racket regularly merges all changes from
>> upstream Chez (which has not added any supported systems during that
>> time---not even the systems added already in Racket's variant).
> I'd still make "supported-by-racket" or however else you decide to name
> that feature an explicit part of that table rather than an implicit
> one, or use a separate "table" for platforms supported by racket.
I really don't understand how this would be helpful. I don't think it
would make sense for a list returned by
chez-upstream-features-for-system to include a symbol
supported-by-racket, which has nothing to do with *upstream* features.
Aside from that, we would be adding this symbol to every single entry in
%chez-features-table. That would imply turning all of the #f entries
into (supported-by-racket), and then we would need some other solution
for identifying platforms with no support upstream.
> Note
> that none of the racket-vm packages appear to currently carry
> supported-systems, which seems dubious.
>
The only constraint on the systems supported by 'racket-vm-cs' is from
'chez-scheme-for-racket'---i.e., the trouble with `configure` for
systems without a native-code backend, which should be fixed by the next
release, if not before. I expect the fact that the
'chez-scheme-for-racket' input is not supported to work as an
alternative to duplicating the filtering in its supported-systems field
(which I think would create a cyclic dependency issue).
AFAIK, 'racket-vm-cgc' and 'racket-vm-bc' should work everywhere (though
possibly without the JIT, futures, and/or places) except that support
for aarch64-macosx is prohibitively poor (IIUC due to W^X issues), which
is fairly irrelevant for Guix.
-Philip
next prev parent reply other threads:[~2022-05-12 5:27 UTC|newest]
Thread overview: 58+ messages / expand[flat|nested] mbox.gz Atom feed top
2022-05-03 18:31 [bug#55248] [PATCH 0/7] gnu: Update Racket to 8.5 and Chez Scheme to 9.5.8 Philip McGrath
2022-05-03 18:33 ` [bug#55248] [PATCH 1/7] gnu: racket: Update to 8.5 Philip McGrath
2022-05-04 6:53 ` Liliana Marie Prikler
2022-05-05 21:49 ` Philip McGrath
2022-05-06 6:37 ` Liliana Marie Prikler
2022-05-07 18:39 ` Philip McGrath
2022-05-07 20:01 ` Maxime Devos
2022-05-03 18:33 ` [bug#55248] [PATCH 2/7] gnu: racket: Fix out-of-source build Philip McGrath
2022-05-04 9:29 ` Maxime Devos
2022-05-05 18:53 ` Philip McGrath
2022-05-05 19:52 ` Liliana Marie Prikler
2022-05-05 20:36 ` Maxime Devos
2022-05-05 20:33 ` Maxime Devos
2022-05-05 21:55 ` Philip McGrath
2022-05-03 18:33 ` [bug#55248] [PATCH 3/7] gnu: chez-scheme: Update to 9.5.8 Philip McGrath
2022-05-03 18:33 ` [bug#55248] [PATCH 4/7] gnu: chez-scheme: Refactor documentation phases Philip McGrath
2022-05-03 18:33 ` [bug#55248] [PATCH 5/7] gnu: chez-scheme: Refactor configure phase and fix '--threads' Philip McGrath
2022-05-03 18:33 ` [bug#55248] [PATCH 6/7] gnu: stex: Get machine type dynamically Philip McGrath
2022-05-04 6:58 ` Liliana Marie Prikler
2022-05-05 19:39 ` Philip McGrath
2022-05-03 18:33 ` [bug#55248] [PATCH 7/7] gnu: chez-scheme-for-system: Adjust support logic Philip McGrath
2022-05-04 7:21 ` Liliana Marie Prikler
2022-05-05 20:42 ` Philip McGrath
2022-05-06 7:08 ` Liliana Marie Prikler
2022-05-07 19:18 ` Philip McGrath
2022-05-08 20:07 ` [bug#55248] [PATCH v2 0/9] gnu: Update Racket to 8.5 and Chez Scheme to 9.5.8 Philip McGrath
2022-05-08 20:07 ` [bug#55248] [PATCH v2 1/9] gnu: racket: Update to 8.5 Philip McGrath
2022-05-08 20:07 ` [bug#55248] [PATCH v2 2/9] gnu: racket: Fix out-of-source build Philip McGrath
2022-05-09 3:54 ` Liliana Marie Prikler
2022-05-09 6:02 ` [bug#55248] [PATCH v3 0/9] gnu: Update Racket to 8.5 and Chez Scheme to 9.5.8 Philip McGrath
2022-05-09 6:02 ` [bug#55248] [PATCH v3 1/9] gnu: racket: Update to 8.5 Philip McGrath
2022-05-09 6:02 ` [bug#55248] [PATCH v3 2/9] gnu: racket: Fix out-of-source build Philip McGrath
2022-05-09 6:02 ` [bug#55248] [PATCH v3 3/9] gnu: chez-scheme: Update to 9.5.8 Philip McGrath
2022-05-09 6:02 ` [bug#55248] [PATCH v3 4/9] gnu: chez-scheme: Refactor documentation phases Philip McGrath
2022-05-09 6:02 ` [bug#55248] [PATCH v3 5/9] gnu: chez-scheme: Refactor configure phase and fix '--threads' Philip McGrath
2022-05-09 6:02 ` [bug#55248] [PATCH v3 6/9] gnu: stex: Get machine type dynamically Philip McGrath
2022-05-09 6:02 ` [bug#55248] [PATCH v3 7/9] gnu: chez-upstream-features-for-system: Improve implementation Philip McGrath
2022-05-09 6:21 ` Liliana Marie Prikler
2022-05-09 7:20 ` Philip McGrath
2022-05-09 7:41 ` Liliana Marie Prikler
2022-05-09 6:02 ` [bug#55248] [PATCH v3 8/9] gnu: chez-scheme-for-racket: Fix supported systems Philip McGrath
2022-05-09 6:34 ` Liliana Marie Prikler
2022-05-09 7:55 ` Philip McGrath
2022-05-09 9:36 ` Liliana Marie Prikler
2022-05-12 5:26 ` Philip McGrath [this message]
2022-05-12 8:04 ` Liliana Marie Prikler
2022-05-09 6:02 ` [bug#55248] [PATCH v3 9/9] gnu: chez-scheme-for-system: Adjust for bytecode backend Philip McGrath
2022-05-09 9:44 ` [bug#55248] [PATCH 0/7] gnu: Update Racket to 8.5 and Chez Scheme to 9.5.8 Ludovic Courtès
2022-05-12 3:50 ` Philip McGrath
2022-05-12 3:59 ` [bug#55248] [PATCH v4 1/9] gnu: racket: Update to 8.5 Philip McGrath
2022-05-12 10:32 ` bug#55248: [PATCH 0/7] gnu: Update Racket to 8.5 and Chez Scheme to 9.5.8 Ludovic Courtès
2022-05-08 20:07 ` [bug#55248] [PATCH v2 3/9] gnu: chez-scheme: Update " Philip McGrath
2022-05-08 20:07 ` [bug#55248] [PATCH v2 4/9] gnu: chez-scheme: Refactor documentation phases Philip McGrath
2022-05-08 20:07 ` [bug#55248] [PATCH v2 5/9] gnu: chez-scheme: Refactor configure phase and fix '--threads' Philip McGrath
2022-05-08 20:07 ` [bug#55248] [PATCH v2 6/9] gnu: stex: Get machine type dynamically Philip McGrath
2022-05-08 20:07 ` [bug#55248] [PATCH v2 7/9] gnu: chez-upstream-features-for-system: Improve implementation Philip McGrath
2022-05-08 20:07 ` [bug#55248] [PATCH v2 8/9] gnu: chez-scheme-for-racket: Fix supported systems Philip McGrath
2022-05-08 20:07 ` [bug#55248] [PATCH v2 9/9] gnu: chez-scheme-for-system: Adjust for bytecode backend Philip McGrath
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