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From: tomas@tuxteam.de
To: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@gnu.org>
Cc: emacs-devel@gnu.org
Subject: Re: Ligature support
Date: Fri, 5 Nov 2021 20:52:45 +0100	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <20211105195245.GC24570@tuxteam.de> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <83ee7uct47.fsf@gnu.org>

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On Fri, Nov 05, 2021 at 09:14:32PM +0200, Eli Zaretskii wrote:
> > Date: Fri, 5 Nov 2021 18:13:56 +0100
> > From: <tomas@tuxteam.de>
> > 
> > Thing is you sometimes want the ligature and sometimes you don't.
> > [depends on language]

[...]

> > it would have to know (or guess?) the language it is treating.
> 
> We do pass the language to HarfBuzz when we think we know it, but the
> problem is Emacs itself has no good notion of the "current language".

This is what I was pointing at. I don't think this is a problem which
can be solved in general. You have homographs (words that write the
same) within one language, you have them across languages.

If the text itself is multilingual, your best bet is to ask the user
and your second-best bet is to do some statistical heuristics, which
only will "work" for a longer stretch of text.

If you press me, I think I can find two German homographs where the
one would take a ligature and the other not >:-)

> Such a notion is problematic in a multilingual editor such as Emacs.
> It is something we still need to figure out, and after that implement
> the necessary infrastructure.  What we have now is rudimentary and
> very insufficient.

I think that will always be an approximation. AFAIK Mozilla has (had?)
a library for guessing a text's (human) language (this is useful for
other things: capitalisation is language-dependent too, e.g. the Turkish
dotless i).

But it will always be something which fails in edge cases, I think.

Cheers
 - t

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  reply	other threads:[~2021-11-05 19:52 UTC|newest]

Thread overview: 342+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
2021-10-25 18:32 Entering emojis Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-10-25 18:45 ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-10-25 19:21   ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-10-25 19:26     ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-10-25 19:36       ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-10-25 19:40         ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-10-25 19:49           ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-10-25 20:14             ` Gregory Heytings
2021-10-25 20:49               ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-10-26  2:01                 ` Howard Melman
2021-10-26  2:29                 ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-10-26  3:38                   ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-10-26  9:10                     ` Stefan Kangas
2021-10-26 11:50                       ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-10-26 14:35                         ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-10-27 12:18                           ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-10-27 13:49                             ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-10-26 15:46                         ` Stefan Kangas
2021-10-26 16:09                           ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-10-26 16:36                             ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-10-26 16:42                               ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-10-26 16:52                                 ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-10-26 17:36                                   ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-10-26 16:49                               ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-10-26 17:09                                 ` Robert Pluim
2021-10-26 17:14                                   ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-10-26 17:33                                   ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-10-26 17:39                                     ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-10-27 12:44                                       ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-10-26 17:43                                     ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-10-26 17:54                                       ` Gregory Heytings
2021-10-26 18:14                                         ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-10-26 17:55                                       ` Robert Pluim
2021-10-26 18:08                                         ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-10-26 17:46                                     ` Robert Pluim
2021-10-26 17:58                                       ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-10-26 18:07                                         ` Robert Pluim
2021-10-26 18:14                                           ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-10-26 18:18                                             ` Robert Pluim
2021-10-26 18:24                                               ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-10-26 19:18                                       ` describe-char on emoji sequences Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-10-26 19:28                                         ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-10-26 19:42                                           ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-10-27 13:35                                             ` James Cloos
2021-10-27 13:43                                               ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-10-27 15:07                                                 ` Andreas Schwab
2021-10-27 15:15                                                   ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-10-27 15:59                                                   ` Robert Pluim
2021-10-27 16:11                                                     ` Andreas Schwab
2021-10-27 16:05                                                   ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-10-27 16:12                                                     ` Andreas Schwab
2021-10-27 16:23                                                       ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-10-27 16:34                                                         ` Andreas Schwab
2021-10-27 16:36                                                         ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-10-27 16:43                                                           ` Andreas Schwab
2021-10-27 17:02                                                             ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-10-27 17:32                                                               ` Robert Pluim
2021-10-27 19:40                                                                 ` Andreas Schwab
2021-10-27 19:48                                                                   ` Gregory Heytings
2021-10-27 16:26                                                       ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-10-27 16:36                                                         ` Andreas Schwab
2021-10-27 17:08                                                 ` James Cloos
2021-10-27 17:13                                                   ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-10-27 17:36                                                     ` Robert Pluim
2021-10-27 18:23                                                       ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-10-28  7:02                                                     ` James Cloos
2021-10-28  7:46                                                       ` Robert Pluim
2021-10-28  9:34                                                         ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-10-28  9:39                                                           ` Robert Pluim
2021-10-28  9:16                                                       ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-10-28 19:24                                                         ` James Cloos
2021-10-28 19:34                                                           ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-10-28 12:21                                                 ` Richard Stallman
2021-10-28 12:23                                                   ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-10-27 13:49                                               ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-10-27 13:57                                             ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-10-27 14:25                                               ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-10-27 16:30                                                 ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-10-27 17:30                                                 ` T.V Raman
2021-10-28 14:35                                                   ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-10-28 23:17                                                     ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-10-26 16:45                             ` Entering emojis Stefan Kangas
2021-10-26 17:34                               ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-10-26 18:39                                 ` William Xu
2021-10-26 19:35                           ` Stefan Monnier
2021-10-26 20:41                             ` Broken Stefan Kangas
2021-10-26 21:12                           ` Entering emojis Stefan Kangas
2021-10-27  1:38                             ` Howard Melman
2021-10-27  8:27                             ` Mattias Engdegård
2021-10-27  8:51                               ` Andreas Schwab
2021-10-27 14:14                                 ` T.V Raman
2021-10-27 15:14                                   ` Gregory Heytings
2021-10-27 17:20                                     ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-10-27 16:01                                   ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-10-27 17:50                                     ` Gregory Heytings
2021-10-27 18:27                                       ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-10-27 18:38                                         ` Gregory Heytings
2021-10-27 18:41                                           ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-10-27 18:56                                             ` Gregory Heytings
2021-10-27 19:15                                               ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-10-27 19:20                                                 ` Gregory Heytings
2021-10-28  5:56                                                   ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-10-28  6:50                                                     ` Gregory Heytings
2021-10-28  9:11                                                       ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-10-28  9:37                                                         ` Gregory Heytings
2021-10-28  9:39                                                           ` Gregory Heytings
2021-10-28 10:00                                                           ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-10-28 10:05                                                             ` Gregory Heytings
2021-10-28 10:25                                                               ` Gregory Heytings
2021-10-28 10:33                                                               ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-10-28 11:20                                                                 ` Gregory Heytings
2021-10-28 13:26                                                                   ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-10-28 13:55                                                                     ` Gregory Heytings
2021-10-28 16:27                                                                       ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-10-28 17:06                                                                         ` Gregory Heytings
2021-10-28 17:37                                                                           ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-10-28 21:10                                                                             ` Gregory Heytings
2021-10-29  7:51                                                                               ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-10-29 10:32                                                                                 ` Gregory Heytings
2021-10-29 10:54                                                                                   ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-10-28 21:40                                                                             ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-10-29  7:31                                                                               ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-10-29 12:51                                                                                 ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-10-29 13:31                                                                                   ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-11-05  5:04                                                                                     ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-11-05  7:56                                                                                       ` Ligature support (was: Entering emojis) Eli Zaretskii
2021-11-05 13:42                                                                                         ` Ligature support Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-11-05 14:33                                                                                           ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-11-05 14:38                                                                                             ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-11-05 15:14                                                                                               ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-11-05 15:20                                                                                                 ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-11-05 15:26                                                                                                   ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-11-05 15:40                                                                                                     ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-11-05 16:35                                                                                                       ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-11-05 15:26                                                                                                   ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-11-05 15:37                                                                                                     ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-11-05 15:56                                                                                                       ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-11-05 16:39                                                                                                         ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-11-05 16:34                                                                                                       ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-11-05 16:45                                                                                                         ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-11-05 17:05                                                                                                           ` Yuri Khan
2021-11-05 17:16                                                                                                             ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-11-05 18:54                                                                                                               ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-11-05 22:17                                                                                                                 ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-11-06  7:04                                                                                                                   ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-11-06 18:02                                                                                                                     ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-11-05 20:09                                                                                                               ` Yuri Khan
2021-11-05 22:20                                                                                                                 ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-11-06  9:01                                                                                                                   ` Yuri Khan
2021-11-05 17:13                                                                                                           ` tomas
2021-11-05 19:14                                                                                                             ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-11-05 19:52                                                                                                               ` tomas [this message]
2021-11-05 20:16                                                                                                                 ` Werner LEMBERG
2021-11-05 20:18                                                                                                                   ` tomas
2021-11-05 20:35                                                                                                                   ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-11-05 20:30                                                                                                                 ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-11-06  9:16                                                                                                                   ` tomas
2021-11-06  9:49                                                                                                                     ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-11-05 20:43                                                                                                                 ` Stefan Kangas
2021-11-05 20:49                                                                                                                   ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-11-05 17:18                                                                                                           ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-11-05 18:55                                                                                                             ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-11-05 19:11                                                                                                           ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-11-05 22:38                                                                                                             ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-11-05 22:50                                                                                                               ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-11-05 23:02                                                                                                                 ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-11-06  8:32                                                                                                                   ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-11-06 18:08                                                                                                                     ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-11-06 18:34                                                                                                                       ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-11-06  5:23                                                                                                               ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-11-06  8:40                                                                                                                 ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-11-12 20:28                                                                                                                 ` chad
2021-11-15  4:51                                                                                                                   ` Richard Stallman
2021-11-15  6:19                                                                                                                     ` Stefan Kangas
2021-11-18  3:50                                                                                                                       ` Richard Stallman
2021-11-15 12:52                                                                                                                     ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-11-06  7:12                                                                                                               ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-11-06 18:05                                                                                                                 ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-11-06 18:30                                                                                                                   ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-11-06 13:25                                                                                                           ` Benjamin Riefenstahl
2021-11-06 13:34                                                                                                             ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-11-06 17:03                                                                                                               ` Benjamin Riefenstahl
2021-11-06 17:33                                                                                                                 ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-10-27 19:23                                                 ` Entering emojis Gregory Heytings
2021-10-28  5:58                                                   ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-10-27 14:16                                 ` T.V Raman
2021-10-27 12:09                               ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-10-27 12:27                                 ` Robert Pluim
2021-10-27 11:48                             ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-10-27 12:36                               ` Robert Pluim
2021-10-27 13:07                                 ` Robert Pluim
2021-10-27 13:09                                   ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-10-27 13:26                                     ` Robert Pluim
2021-10-27 13:50                                       ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-11-08 19:52                                       ` chad
2021-11-08 19:58                                         ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-10-27 13:34                                   ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-10-27 15:12                                     ` Robert Pluim
2021-10-27 16:08                                       ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-10-27 17:00                                         ` Robert Pluim
2021-10-27 13:22                                 ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-10-27 13:28                                   ` Robert Pluim
2021-10-27 14:06                                     ` Stefan Kangas
2021-10-27 14:15                                       ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-10-27 14:22                               ` Stefan Kangas
2021-10-27 15:34                                 ` Michael Albinus
2021-11-02 23:36                           ` Jonas Bernoulli
2021-11-04  6:27                             ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-11-04 15:12                               ` Jonas Bernoulli
2021-11-04 17:18                                 ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-11-04 18:34                                 ` T.V Raman
2021-10-25 19:42         ` Gregory Heytings
2021-10-25 20:10           ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-10-25 20:18             ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-10-25 20:31               ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-10-25 20:36   ` Matthias Meulien
2021-10-26  2:36     ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-10-25 20:54 ` T.V Raman
2021-10-26 21:20 ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-10-26 21:43   ` Stefan Kangas
2021-10-27 12:45     ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-10-27 14:22       ` Stefan Kangas
2021-10-27 12:01   ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-10-27 12:28     ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-10-27 13:19       ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-11-02 23:40         ` Jonas Bernoulli
2021-10-27 14:38       ` Stefan Kangas
2021-10-27 15:40         ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-10-27 17:11           ` Move shorthands.el to lisp/emacs-lisp/? Stefan Kangas
2021-10-28 21:28             ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-10-29  5:31               ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-10-29  9:45                 ` Yuri Khan
2021-10-29 10:10                   ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-10-29 10:31                     ` Yuri Khan
2021-10-29 10:41                       ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-10-29 10:51                       ` Dmitry Gutov
2021-10-29 12:37                 ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-10-27 15:52         ` Entering emojis Eli Zaretskii
2021-10-27 16:27           ` Stefan Kangas
2021-10-27 16:37             ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-10-27 15:56         ` Stefan Monnier
2021-10-27 16:06           ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-10-27 16:20             ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-10-27 16:27             ` Stefan Kangas
2021-10-28 21:27               ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-11-02 23:48                 ` Jonas Bernoulli
2021-11-03  1:50                   ` T.V Raman
2021-11-04  6:28                   ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-10-28 14:14       ` Kévin Le Gouguec
2021-10-28 14:16         ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-10-28 14:31           ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-10-28 14:56             ` Kévin Le Gouguec
2021-10-28 14:59               ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-10-28 15:27                 ` Kévin Le Gouguec
2021-10-28 21:43                   ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-10-29  9:32                     ` Kévin Le Gouguec
2021-10-29 13:03                       ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-10-29 15:30                         ` Kévin Le Gouguec
2021-10-29 16:01                           ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-10-29 16:45                             ` Kévin Le Gouguec
2021-10-29 17:18                               ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-11-03  0:08                                 ` Jonas Bernoulli
2021-11-03 16:15                                   ` Jonas Bernoulli
2021-10-27 17:25 ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-10-28  9:18   ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-10-28 10:33     ` Stefan Kangas
2021-10-28 11:08       ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-10-28 11:19         ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-10-28 12:54           ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-10-28 12:56             ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-10-28 13:32               ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-10-28 13:54                 ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-10-28 15:57                   ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-10-28 21:49                     ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-10-29  5:45                       ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-10-29 12:46                         ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-10-29 13:30                           ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-10-29 13:38                             ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-10-29 13:55                               ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-10-29 14:12                                 ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-10-29 14:30                                   ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-10-29 14:45                                     ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-10-29 14:53                                       ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-10-29 16:02                                         ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-10-29 16:39                                           ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-10-29 16:01                                     ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-10-29 16:34                                       ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-10-29 18:06                                         ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-10-29 18:23                                           ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-10-29 19:46                                             ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-10-29 20:43                                               ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-10-29 20:57                                                 ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-10-29 21:09                                                   ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-10-29 21:21                                                     ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-10-30  6:08                                                       ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-10-30  7:06                                                         ` Andreas Schwab
2021-11-03 18:56                                                           ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-10-30 12:17                                                         ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-10-28 13:56                 ` Robert Pluim
2021-10-28 20:44         ` Stefan Kangas
2021-10-28 21:51           ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-10-28 22:34             ` Stefan Kangas
2021-10-28 22:39               ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-11-03  0:35                 ` Jonas Bernoulli
2021-10-28 13:30       ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-10-28 23:37         ` Stefan Kangas
2021-10-28 23:48           ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-10-29  6:10             ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-10-29  6:09           ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-10-29 14:43             ` Stefan Kangas
2021-10-29 16:06               ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-10-29 17:01                 ` Stefan Kangas
2022-01-29 10:23                   ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-10-29 17:41               ` Daniel Martín
2021-10-29 21:46                 ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-10-29 22:16                   ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-10-30  6:19                     ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-10-30  6:36                       ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-10-30 12:25                         ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-10-30 12:30                           ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-10-30 12:34                             ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-10-30 12:49                               ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-10-30 12:20                       ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-10-30  6:22                     ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-10-30 14:26                   ` Howard Melman
2021-10-28 14:19     ` T.V Raman
2021-10-28 14:33       ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-10-28 16:04       ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-11-01 19:47 ` Jonas Bernoulli
2021-11-02  2:06   ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-11-03  1:27     ` Jonas Bernoulli
2021-11-03  2:07       ` Reading multiple files (was: Entering emojis) Stefan Monnier
2021-11-03 16:21         ` Jonas Bernoulli
2021-11-04 17:31       ` Entering emojis Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-11-13 19:43 ` Problem with some new emoji in Emacs Jean Louis
2021-11-13 20:16   ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-11-13 20:49     ` Jean Louis
2021-11-14  6:35       ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-11-14  7:50         ` Jean Louis
2021-11-13 20:37   ` Stefan Monnier
2021-11-13 20:53     ` Jean Louis
2021-11-13 21:14       ` Jean Louis

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