bug#35261: 26.1; EBDB Documentation

bug#35261: 26.1; EBDB Documentation

[David Masterson]

This is a documentation problem for EBDB.

The documentation lacks clarity on how to setup EBDB for the first time
in the case where you are *not* converting from BBDB or Org Contacts.
More information is needed on how to create an EBDB database for the
first time, how to setup the first record(s) that you put into the
database, and (perhaps) an example session.  As it is, the documentation
is too esoteric for someone unfamiliar with EBDB (or BBDB) concepts to
make heads or tails of it and get their feet wet.


In GNU Emacs 26.1 (build 1, x86_64-unknown-cygwin, X toolkit, Xaw3d scroll bars)
 of 2018-05-28 built on DESKTOP
Repository revision: d802fa4a0642157d7aff9a9d599785df7604e4d1
Windowing system distributor 'The Cygwin/X Project', version 11.0.11906000
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Features:
(shadow emacsbug sendmail eieio-opt speedbar sb-image ezimage dframe
help-fns radix-tree apropos org-archive dired-aux log-edit add-log
diff-mode pcvs pcvs-parse pcvs-info pcvs-defs pcvs-util ewoc preview
prv-emacs tex-bar tex-buf toolbar-x font-latex latex latex-flymake
flymake-proc flymake warnings tex-ispell tex-style tex dbus crm tex-mode
compile latexenc org-table mhtml-mode css-mode smie color eww mm-url
url-queue url url-proxy url-privacy url-expand url-methods url-history
url-cookie url-domsuf url-util shr svg xml browse-url js json map imenu
thingatpt cc-mode cc-fonts cc-guess cc-menus cc-cmds cc-styles cc-align
cc-engine cc-vars cc-defs sgml-mode dom ox-texinfo ox-org ox-odt rng-loc
rng-uri rng-parse rng-match rng-dt rng-util rng-pttrn nxml-parse nxml-ns
nxml-enc xmltok nxml-util ox-latex ox-icalendar ox-html table ox-ascii
ox-publish ox shell vc-cvs org-eldoc org-journal flyspell ispell
org-indent org-toc org-man org-git-link org-bookmark bookmark pp
org-eshell esh-var esh-io esh-cmd esh-opt esh-ext esh-proc esh-arg
esh-groups eshell esh-module esh-mode esh-util org-w3m org-tempo tempo
org-rmail org-protocol org-mouse org-mhe org-irc org-inlinetask org-info
org-id org-habit org-agenda org-gnus nnir org-eww org-docview doc-view
jka-compr image-mode org-crypt org-bibtex bibtex org-bbdb org-element
avl-tree generator org ob ob-tangle ob-ref ob-lob ob-table ob-exp
org-macro org-footnote org-src ob-comint ob-keys org-pcomplete pcomplete
comint ring org-list org-faces org-entities noutline outline easy-mmode
org-version ob-emacs-lisp ob-core ob-eval org-compat advice org-macs
org-loaddefs find-func cal-menu calendar cal-loaddefs cl-extra help-mode
sort smiley ansi-color gnus-cite mail-extr qp gnus-async gnus-bcklg
gnus-ml disp-table cursor-sensor nndraft nnmh nnfolder utf-7
network-stream nsm starttls gnus-agent gnus-srvr gnus-score score-mode
nnvirtual gnus-msg gnus-art mm-uu mml2015 mm-view mml-smime smime dig
mailcap nntp gnus-cache gnus-sum gnus-group gnus-undo gnus-start
gnus-cloud nnimap nnmail mail-source tls gnutls utf7 netrc nnoo
parse-time gnus-spec gnus-int gnus-range message rmc puny dired
dired-loaddefs format-spec rfc822 mml mml-sec epa derived epg mm-decode
mm-bodies mm-encode mail-parse rfc2231 mailabbrev gmm-utils mailheader
gnus-win gnus nnheader gnus-util rmail rmail-loaddefs rfc2047 rfc2045
ietf-drums mail-utils mm-util mail-prsvr wid-edit elec-pair finder-inf
tex-site kotl-autoloads edmacro kmacro org2blog-autoloads info package
easymenu epg-config url-handlers url-parse auth-source cl-seq eieio
eieio-core cl-macs eieio-loaddefs password-cache url-vars
misterioso-theme paren desktop frameset cus-start cus-load ido seq
byte-opt bytecomp byte-compile cconv htmlize cl gv cl-loaddefs cl-lib
time-date mule-util tooltip eldoc electric uniquify ediff-hook vc-hooks
lisp-float-type mwheel term/x-win x-win term/common-win x-dnd tool-bar
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bug#35261: 26.1; EBDB Documentation

[Eric Abrahamsen]

David Masterson <dsmasterson@outlook.com> writes:

> This is a documentation problem for EBDB.
>
> The documentation lacks clarity on how to setup EBDB for the first time
> in the case where you are *not* converting from BBDB or Org Contacts.
> More information is needed on how to create an EBDB database for the
> first time, how to setup the first record(s) that you put into the
> database, and (perhaps) an example session.  As it is, the documentation
> is too esoteric for someone unfamiliar with EBDB (or BBDB) concepts to
> make heads or tails of it and get their feet wet.

Thanks for this report. Here's what the docs have now:

Assuming you have no records you want to migrate from other contact
management software, it is enough to call the top-level ~ebdb~ command.
This will create a new database at the location specified by
~ebdb-sources~ (see [The EBDB Database]), prompt you for a search
string, fail to find anything (because you don't have any records yet),
and finally open a EBDB buffer where you can start to make new records
(see [Creating Records]).

This is correct, though admittedly terse! I suppose I could break this
out more specifically: you should set `ebdb-sources' in advance. Then
you can create your new database either by calling the `ebdb' command,
or by associating EBDB with a mail user agent, and letting that agent
create records for you.

Or perhaps, if you have no records, the `ebdb' command could simply open
an *EBDB* buffer and then tell you, "you have no records, use 'c' to
create one"?

WDYT?

bug#35261: 26.1; EBDB Documentation

[David Masterson]

Eric Abrahamsen <eric@ericabrahamsen.net> writes:

> David Masterson <dsmasterson@outlook.com> writes:

>> This is a documentation problem for EBDB.
>>
>> The documentation lacks clarity on how to setup EBDB for the first time
>> in the case where you are *not* converting from BBDB or Org Contacts.
>> More information is needed on how to create an EBDB database for the
>> first time, how to setup the first record(s) that you put into the
>> database, and (perhaps) an example session.  As it is, the documentation
>> is too esoteric for someone unfamiliar with EBDB (or BBDB) concepts to
>> make heads or tails of it and get their feet wet.
>
> Thanks for this report. Here's what the docs have now:
>
> Assuming you have no records you want to migrate from other contact
> management software, it is enough to call the top-level ~ebdb~ command.
> This will create a new database at the location specified by
> ~ebdb-sources~ (see [The EBDB Database]), prompt you for a search
> string, fail to find anything (because you don't have any records yet),
> and finally open a EBDB buffer where you can start to make new records
> (see [Creating Records]).
>
> This is correct, though admittedly terse! I suppose I could break this
> out more specifically: you should set `ebdb-sources' in advance. Then
> you can create your new database either by calling the `ebdb' command,
> or by associating EBDB with a mail user agent, and letting that agent
> create records for you.
>
> Or perhaps, if you have no records, the `ebdb' command could simply open
> an *EBDB* buffer and then tell you, "you have no records, use 'c' to
> create one"?
>
> WDYT?

First, in the "Getting Started" section, there are the two subsections
on migration.  At first glance, I assumed (incorrectly) that those were
the ways to get started and missed the rest of what was said at the top
level.  Therefore, I might suggest that the top level "Getting Started"
section be an short intro to EBDB with (perhaps) references to key
variables for setup.  Then have three subsections (or more) where the
first in creating the database from scratch, second is migration from
BBDB, and third is migration from Org Contacts.

Second, the top-level should probably reference where to find the
internal details of the database structure and record structure(s).
This should also be in the subsections to some degree.  Perhaps the
top-level should simply reference the details in the sub-levels.

Third, the creation process should probably have an example script to
show the user what to expect.  In particular, I get an error when I try
to create my first record in EBDB using 'c'.  I'm not sure if it is a
problem with not having setup a database variable, record variable,
record structure variable, or what.  I'm just beginning to experiment
with EBDB, but I'm familiar with the concepts.  Emacs/EBDB and its
extensive variables can make it difficult to determine where to start to
configure things if the Info page doesn't lead through it.

Fourth, having 'c' tell you that "you have no records" is not to helpful
in that what you need is how to setup to create records.

Fifth, there is no EBDB mailing list to ask questions on??

--
David

bug#35261: 26.1; EBDB Documentation

[Eric Abrahamsen]

On 04/15/19 03:50 AM, David Masterson wrote:
> Eric Abrahamsen <eric@ericabrahamsen.net> writes:
>
>> David Masterson <dsmasterson@outlook.com> writes:
>
>>> This is a documentation problem for EBDB.
>>>
>>> The documentation lacks clarity on how to setup EBDB for the first time
>>> in the case where you are *not* converting from BBDB or Org Contacts.
>>> More information is needed on how to create an EBDB database for the
>>> first time, how to setup the first record(s) that you put into the
>>> database, and (perhaps) an example session.  As it is, the documentation
>>> is too esoteric for someone unfamiliar with EBDB (or BBDB) concepts to
>>> make heads or tails of it and get their feet wet.
>>
>> Thanks for this report. Here's what the docs have now:
>>
>> Assuming you have no records you want to migrate from other contact
>> management software, it is enough to call the top-level ~ebdb~ command.
>> This will create a new database at the location specified by
>> ~ebdb-sources~ (see [The EBDB Database]), prompt you for a search
>> string, fail to find anything (because you don't have any records yet),
>> and finally open a EBDB buffer where you can start to make new records
>> (see [Creating Records]).
>>
>> This is correct, though admittedly terse! I suppose I could break this
>> out more specifically: you should set `ebdb-sources' in advance. Then
>> you can create your new database either by calling the `ebdb' command,
>> or by associating EBDB with a mail user agent, and letting that agent
>> create records for you.
>>
>> Or perhaps, if you have no records, the `ebdb' command could simply open
>> an *EBDB* buffer and then tell you, "you have no records, use 'c' to
>> create one"?
>>
>> WDYT?
>
> First, in the "Getting Started" section, there are the two subsections
> on migration.  At first glance, I assumed (incorrectly) that those were
> the ways to get started and missed the rest of what was said at the top
> level.  Therefore, I might suggest that the top level "Getting Started"
> section be an short intro to EBDB with (perhaps) references to key
> variables for setup.  Then have three subsections (or more) where the
> first in creating the database from scratch, second is migration from
> BBDB, and third is migration from Org Contacts.

That makes sense.

> Second, the top-level should probably reference where to find the
> internal details of the database structure and record structure(s).
> This should also be in the subsections to some degree.  Perhaps the
> top-level should simply reference the details in the sub-levels.

Ditto.

> Third, the creation process should probably have an example script to
> show the user what to expect.  In particular, I get an error when I try
> to create my first record in EBDB using 'c'.  I'm not sure if it is a
> problem with not having setup a database variable, record variable,
> record structure variable, or what.  I'm just beginning to experiment
> with EBDB, but I'm familiar with the concepts.  Emacs/EBDB and its
> extensive variables can make it difficult to determine where to start to
> configure things if the Info page doesn't lead through it.
>
> Fourth, having 'c' tell you that "you have no records" is not to helpful
> in that what you need is how to setup to create records.

This doesn't seem right: it's the `ebdb' command that tells you the
database is empty (and that message should include a mention of 'c').
'c' prompts for the creation of a record. Do you remember what sort of
error you got during record creation? There shouldn't be anything you
have to do in advance, except maybe confirm that you want to create a
new database at the default location.

> Fifth, there is no EBDB mailing list to ask questions on??

I don't think new mailing lists are made for specific packages very
often any more. In the case of EBDB, you can open an issue on the github
page, email me directly, or do what you've done here, which is just
fine (so long as you cc me). There's been some talk in the past about
having the bug reporter prompt for specific packages to report bugs
against, but that hasn't gone anywhere yet.

Yours,
Eric

bug#35261: 26.1; EBDB Documentation

[David Masterson]

Eric Abrahamsen <eric@ericabrahamsen.net> writes:

> On 04/15/19 03:50 AM, David Masterson wrote:
>> Eric Abrahamsen <eric@ericabrahamsen.net> writes:
>>
>>> David Masterson <dsmasterson@outlook.com> writes:
>>
>>>> This is a documentation problem for EBDB.
>>
>> First, in the "Getting Started" section, there are the two subsections
>> on migration.  At first glance, I assumed (incorrectly) that those were
>> the ways to get started and missed the rest of what was said at the top
>> level.  Therefore, I might suggest that the top level "Getting Started"
>> section be an short intro to EBDB with (perhaps) references to key
>> variables for setup.  Then have three subsections (or more) where the
>> first in creating the database from scratch, second is migration from
>> BBDB, and third is migration from Org Contacts.
>
> That makes sense.
>
>> Second, the top-level should probably reference where to find the
>> internal details of the database structure and record structure(s).
>> This should also be in the subsections to some degree.  Perhaps the
>> top-level should simply reference the details in the sub-levels.
>
> Ditto.
>
>> Third, the creation process should probably have an example script to
>> show the user what to expect.  In particular, I get an error when I try
>> to create my first record in EBDB using 'c'.  I'm not sure if it is a
>> problem with not having setup a database variable, record variable,
>> record structure variable, or what.  I'm just beginning to experiment
>> with EBDB, but I'm familiar with the concepts.  Emacs/EBDB and its
>> extensive variables can make it difficult to determine where to start to
>> configure things if the Info page doesn't lead through it.
>>
>> Fourth, having 'c' tell you that "you have no records" is not to helpful
>> in that what you need is how to setup to create records.
>
> This doesn't seem right: it's the `ebdb' command that tells you the
> database is empty (and that message should include a mention of 'c').

Actually, the first thing that the 'ebdb' seems to do is ask for a
search string which is a little surprising on an empty database.  I can
see that people might want a quick command to find something in their
database, but you shouldn't overload the 'ebdb' command that way.  Have
one command (ebdb) to startup EBDB and another command to start it up
and find a record.  Or, perhaps, two separate commands which people
could always script together.

> 'c' prompts for the creation of a record. Do you remember what sort of
> error you got during record creation? There shouldn't be anything you
> have to do in advance, except maybe confirm that you want to create a
> new database at the default location.

Good point.  I kind of messed up that statement.  The error I got was an
error that basically is that I was putting in data for a field that was
improper for the field.  In this case, it was looking for an *email*
address and I was assuming that any old text string would do.  The error
did not give the clue that it was specifically looking for a string that
was formatted for "name@machine.com".  So, there should be a clue in the
documentation on how to read the error -- basically that the error is
pointing out that the input doesn't fit the defined structure and (most
importantly) how to find out what the defined structure is.  On that, it
seems that the documentation is still evolving in that area.  For
instance, looking at the documentation of ebdb-field-* variables says
that they are obsolete as of 25.1 and the documentation is relatively
low, so the error above would be confusing in that you'd wonder if you
were looking at the right variable.

--
David

bug#35261: 26.1; EBDB Documentation

[Eric Abrahamsen]

On 04/15/19 20:56 PM, David Masterson wrote:
> Eric Abrahamsen <eric@ericabrahamsen.net> writes:

[...]

>> This doesn't seem right: it's the `ebdb' command that tells you the
>> database is empty (and that message should include a mention of 'c').
>
> Actually, the first thing that the 'ebdb' seems to do is ask for a
> search string which is a little surprising on an empty database. I can
> see that people might want a quick command to find something in their
> database, but you shouldn't overload the 'ebdb' command that way. Have
> one command (ebdb) to startup EBDB and another command to start it up
> and find a record. Or, perhaps, two separate commands which people
> could always script together.

Okay, it would make sense to have an `ebdb-start' command that just
opens an *EBDB* buffer.

>> 'c' prompts for the creation of a record. Do you remember what sort of
>> error you got during record creation? There shouldn't be anything you
>> have to do in advance, except maybe confirm that you want to create a
>> new database at the default location.
>
> Good point. I kind of messed up that statement. The error I got was an
> error that basically is that I was putting in data for a field that was
> improper for the field. In this case, it was looking for an *email*
> address and I was assuming that any old text string would do. The error
> did not give the clue that it was specifically looking for a string that
> was formatted for "name@machine.com". So, there should be a clue in the
> documentation on how to read the error -- basically that the error is
> pointing out that the input doesn't fit the defined structure and (most
> importantly) how to find out what the defined structure is. 

Sure, I can add this as well. Actually I'm on the fence about requiring
a "@" in mail fields at all, as it's possible someone might want to note
a machine-local address for someone. I can't decide. But there are a few
other fields (like the url field) that also do a bit of validation, and
it would be good to explain that.

> On that, it seems that the documentation is still evolving in that
> area. For instance, looking at the documentation of ebdb-field-*
> variables says that they are obsolete as of 25.1 and the documentation
> is relatively low, so the error above would be confusing in that you'd
> wonder if you were looking at the right variable.

Unfortunately this doesn't have to do with EBDB, but rather with a weird
interaction between the help system and EIEIO. Class names apparently
once functioned as variables, but no longer do, and so Emacs complains
when you try to treat one as a variable. You'll have better luck using
help to look up the *function* definitions of the class names, not the
variable definition.

Eric

bug#35261: 26.1; EBDB Documentation

[Eric Abrahamsen]

On 04/15/19 20:56 PM, David Masterson wrote:
> Eric Abrahamsen <eric@ericabrahamsen.net> writes:
>
>> On 04/15/19 03:50 AM, David Masterson wrote:
>>> Eric Abrahamsen <eric@ericabrahamsen.net> writes:
>>>
>>>> David Masterson <dsmasterson@outlook.com> writes:
>>>
>>>>> This is a documentation problem for EBDB.
>>>
>>> First, in the "Getting Started" section, there are the two subsections
>>> on migration.  At first glance, I assumed (incorrectly) that those were
>>> the ways to get started and missed the rest of what was said at the top
>>> level.  Therefore, I might suggest that the top level "Getting Started"
>>> section be an short intro to EBDB with (perhaps) references to key
>>> variables for setup.  Then have three subsections (or more) where the
>>> first in creating the database from scratch, second is migration from
>>> BBDB, and third is migration from Org Contacts.
>>
>> That makes sense.
>>
>>> Second, the top-level should probably reference where to find the
>>> internal details of the database structure and record structure(s).
>>> This should also be in the subsections to some degree.  Perhaps the
>>> top-level should simply reference the details in the sub-levels.
>>
>> Ditto.
>>
>>> Third, the creation process should probably have an example script to
>>> show the user what to expect.  In particular, I get an error when I try
>>> to create my first record in EBDB using 'c'.  I'm not sure if it is a
>>> problem with not having setup a database variable, record variable,
>>> record structure variable, or what.  I'm just beginning to experiment
>>> with EBDB, but I'm familiar with the concepts.  Emacs/EBDB and its
>>> extensive variables can make it difficult to determine where to start to
>>> configure things if the Info page doesn't lead through it.
>>>
>>> Fourth, having 'c' tell you that "you have no records" is not to helpful
>>> in that what you need is how to setup to create records.
>>
>> This doesn't seem right: it's the `ebdb' command that tells you the
>> database is empty (and that message should include a mention of 'c').
>
> Actually, the first thing that the 'ebdb' seems to do is ask for a
> search string which is a little surprising on an empty database.  I can
> see that people might want a quick command to find something in their
> database, but you shouldn't overload the 'ebdb' command that way.  Have
> one command (ebdb) to startup EBDB and another command to start it up
> and find a record.  Or, perhaps, two separate commands which people
> could always script together.

Here's what the new version looks like:

* Getting Started
EBDB is a contact management package: it records information about
people and organizations, and integrates with other Emacs software
packages, mostly those concerned with sending and reading mail.  The
principle parts of EBDB are records, which represent people and
organizations; fields, representing detailed data about records; and
databases, which hold and persist records.

There are a large number of configuration options listed in this
manual, but the only one you might want to tweak in advance is
~ebdb-sources~ (see [The EBDB Database]), which controls where EBDB
stores its records.

** Starting a New Database
If you have no records you want to migrate from other contact
management software, start by calling the command ~ebdb-open~.  This
will open a new buffer in ~ebdb-mode~, and prompt you to create a
database, if one doesn't already exist.  From there, you can use
{{{kbd(c)}}} to make new records (see [Creating Records]).

bug#35261: 26.1; EBDB Documentation

[David Masterson]

Eric Abrahamsen <eric@ericabrahamsen.net> writes:

> On 04/15/19 20:56 PM, David Masterson wrote:

>> On that, it seems that the documentation is still evolving in that
>> area. For instance, looking at the documentation of ebdb-field-*
>> variables says that they are obsolete as of 25.1 and the documentation
>> is relatively low, so the error above would be confusing in that you'd
>> wonder if you were looking at the right variable.

> Unfortunately this doesn't have to do with EBDB, but rather with a weird
> interaction between the help system and EIEIO. Class names apparently
> once functioned as variables, but no longer do, and so Emacs complains
> when you try to treat one as a variable. You'll have better luck using
> help to look up the *function* definitions of the class names, not the
> variable definition.

Ouch!  That's not logical and will need some explanation somewhere.  The
logical assumption would be that the function that is asking for input
is using some variable (structure) as a reference for what it expects as
input, so, when the error reports a name in the error, the first thought
would be that that is the structure to look at to get the clue as to
what it's looking for.  It's a little confusing (to say the least) for
the lay person to see functions and variables with the same name.

Something to lay out a little more as a primer in the Info docs?

--
David

bug#35261: 26.1; EBDB Documentation

[David Masterson]

Eric Abrahamsen <eric@ericabrahamsen.net> writes:

> Here's what the new version looks like:
>
> * Getting Started
> EBDB is a contact management package: it records information about
> people and organizations, and integrates with other Emacs software
> packages, mostly those concerned with sending and reading mail.  The
> principle parts of EBDB are records, which represent people and
> organizations; fields, representing detailed data about records; and
> databases, which hold and persist records.
>
> There are a large number of configuration options listed in this
> manual, but the only one you might want to tweak in advance is
> ~ebdb-sources~ (see [The EBDB Database]), which controls where EBDB
> stores its records.
>
> ** Starting a New Database
> If you have no records you want to migrate from other contact
> management software, start by calling the command ~ebdb-open~.  This
> will open a new buffer in ~ebdb-mode~, and prompt you to create a
> database, if one doesn't already exist.  From there, you can use
> {{{kbd(c)}}} to make new records (see [Creating Records]).

Otherwise, you'll want to migrate your data from other contact
management software as described in the sections below.  Currently, EBDB
only knows about migrating from BBDB and Org Contacts.

====

Beyond this, I can see that lots of documentation (and, I assume,
functionality) is still needed:

1. Installation details of EBDB and related tools.
2. Details on what type of records a database is composed of.
3. Details on the fields of a record.
4. Details on the type of a field.
5. Import/Export functionality
6. Hooks for add-ons

* By 'details', I mean some Emacs Elisp and not just English to give us
  real reference information.

--
David

bug#35261: 26.1; EBDB Documentation

[Eric Abrahamsen]

On 04/17/19 03:14 AM, David Masterson wrote:
> Eric Abrahamsen <eric@ericabrahamsen.net> writes:
>
>> On 04/15/19 20:56 PM, David Masterson wrote:
>
>>> On that, it seems that the documentation is still evolving in that
>>> area. For instance, looking at the documentation of ebdb-field-*
>>> variables says that they are obsolete as of 25.1 and the documentation
>>> is relatively low, so the error above would be confusing in that you'd
>>> wonder if you were looking at the right variable.
>
>> Unfortunately this doesn't have to do with EBDB, but rather with a weird
>> interaction between the help system and EIEIO. Class names apparently
>> once functioned as variables, but no longer do, and so Emacs complains
>> when you try to treat one as a variable. You'll have better luck using
>> help to look up the *function* definitions of the class names, not the
>> variable definition.
>
> Ouch!  That's not logical and will need some explanation somewhere.  The
> logical assumption would be that the function that is asking for input
> is using some variable (structure) as a reference for what it expects as
> input, so, when the error reports a name in the error, the first thought
> would be that that is the structure to look at to get the clue as to
> what it's looking for.  It's a little confusing (to say the least) for
> the lay person to see functions and variables with the same name.
>
> Something to lay out a little more as a primer in the Info docs?

Mmm, I'm not really inclined to spend a lot of time explaining the
weirdnesses of Emacs help system in the EBDB manual, but maybe a pointer
to the function docstrings of the class symbols would be okay.

bug#35261: 26.1; EBDB Documentation

[Eric Abrahamsen]

On 04/17/19 03:41 AM, David Masterson wrote:
> Eric Abrahamsen <eric@ericabrahamsen.net> writes:
>
>> Here's what the new version looks like:
>>
>> * Getting Started
>> EBDB is a contact management package: it records information about
>> people and organizations, and integrates with other Emacs software
>> packages, mostly those concerned with sending and reading mail.  The
>> principle parts of EBDB are records, which represent people and
>> organizations; fields, representing detailed data about records; and
>> databases, which hold and persist records.
>>
>> There are a large number of configuration options listed in this
>> manual, but the only one you might want to tweak in advance is
>> ~ebdb-sources~ (see [The EBDB Database]), which controls where EBDB
>> stores its records.
>>
>> ** Starting a New Database
>> If you have no records you want to migrate from other contact
>> management software, start by calling the command ~ebdb-open~.  This
>> will open a new buffer in ~ebdb-mode~, and prompt you to create a
>> database, if one doesn't already exist.  From there, you can use
>> {{{kbd(c)}}} to make new records (see [Creating Records]).
>
> Otherwise, you'll want to migrate your data from other contact
> management software as described in the sections below.  Currently, EBDB
> only knows about migrating from BBDB and Org Contacts.

Okay, sounds good.

> ====
>
> Beyond this, I can see that lots of documentation (and, I assume,
> functionality) is still needed:
>
> 1. Installation details of EBDB and related tools.
> 2. Details on what type of records a database is composed of.
> 3. Details on the fields of a record.
> 4. Details on the type of a field.
> 5. Import/Export functionality
> 6. Hooks for add-ons
>
> * By 'details', I mean some Emacs Elisp and not just English to give us
>   real reference information.

EBDB is only just stabilizing (the export stuff went through some big
refactoring just recently) and I'm a little hesitant to lay all this
stuff out in the manual. One of the long-term goals is definitely to
make EBDB programmable and integratable with other packages, but I'm
dragging my feet a little bit until I'm more confident that the API
won't change. It'll get there, though.

Eric

bug#35261: 26.1; EBDB Documentation

[David Masterson]

Eric Abrahamsen <eric@ericabrahamsen.net> writes:

> On 04/17/19 03:14 AM, David Masterson wrote:
>> Eric Abrahamsen <eric@ericabrahamsen.net> writes:
>>
>>> On 04/15/19 20:56 PM, David Masterson wrote:
>>
>>>> On that, it seems that the documentation is still evolving in that
>>>> area. For instance, looking at the documentation of ebdb-field-*
>>>> variables says that they are obsolete as of 25.1 and the documentation
>>>> is relatively low, so the error above would be confusing in that you'd
>>>> wonder if you were looking at the right variable.
>>
>>> Unfortunately this doesn't have to do with EBDB, but rather with a weird
>>> interaction between the help system and EIEIO. Class names apparently
>>> once functioned as variables, but no longer do, and so Emacs complains
>>> when you try to treat one as a variable. You'll have better luck using
>>> help to look up the *function* definitions of the class names, not the
>>> variable definition.
>>
>> Ouch!  That's not logical and will need some explanation somewhere.  The
>> logical assumption would be that the function that is asking for input
>> is using some variable (structure) as a reference for what it expects as
>> input, so, when the error reports a name in the error, the first thought
>> would be that that is the structure to look at to get the clue as to
>> what it's looking for.  It's a little confusing (to say the least) for
>> the lay person to see functions and variables with the same name.
>>
>> Something to lay out a little more as a primer in the Info docs?
>
> Mmm, I'm not really inclined to spend a lot of time explaining the
> weirdnesses of Emacs help system in the EBDB manual, but maybe a pointer
> to the function docstrings of the class symbols would be okay.

Yeah, something to point you in the right direction.  Try not to make it
too 'lispy' for the newbies...

--
David

bug#35261: 26.1; EBDB Documentation

[David Masterson]

Eric Abrahamsen <eric@ericabrahamsen.net> writes:

> On 04/17/19 03:41 AM, David Masterson wrote:

>> Beyond this, I can see that lots of documentation (and, I assume,
>> functionality) is still needed:
>>
>> 1. Installation details of EBDB and related tools.
>> 2. Details on what type of records a database is composed of.
>> 3. Details on the fields of a record.
>> 4. Details on the type of a field.
>> 5. Import/Export functionality
>> 6. Hooks for add-ons
>>
>> * By 'details', I mean some Emacs Elisp and not just English to give us
>>   real reference information.
>
> EBDB is only just stabilizing (the export stuff went through some big
> refactoring just recently) and I'm a little hesitant to lay all this
> stuff out in the manual. One of the long-term goals is definitely to
> make EBDB programmable and integratable with other packages, but I'm
> dragging my feet a little bit until I'm more confident that the API
> won't change. It'll get there, though.

Okay.  Mostly consider #1 with:

* Installation as a package (and via savanah?)
* How to get help if needed (bug reports)
* Other packages to install/Use (Org and Gnus)

A primer as applies to EBDB for #2, #3, and #4 would be nice.

bug#35261: 26.1; EBDB Documentation

[Eric Abrahamsen]

On 04/19/19 22:31 PM, David Masterson wrote:
> Eric Abrahamsen <eric@ericabrahamsen.net> writes:
>
>> On 04/17/19 03:41 AM, David Masterson wrote:
>
>>> Beyond this, I can see that lots of documentation (and, I assume,
>>> functionality) is still needed:
>>>
>>> 1. Installation details of EBDB and related tools.
>>> 2. Details on what type of records a database is composed of.
>>> 3. Details on the fields of a record.
>>> 4. Details on the type of a field.
>>> 5. Import/Export functionality
>>> 6. Hooks for add-ons
>>>
>>> * By 'details', I mean some Emacs Elisp and not just English to give us
>>>   real reference information.
>>
>> EBDB is only just stabilizing (the export stuff went through some big
>> refactoring just recently) and I'm a little hesitant to lay all this
>> stuff out in the manual. One of the long-term goals is definitely to
>> make EBDB programmable and integratable with other packages, but I'm
>> dragging my feet a little bit until I'm more confident that the API
>> won't change. It'll get there, though.
>
> Okay.  Mostly consider #1 with:
>
> * Installation as a package (and via savanah?)
> * How to get help if needed (bug reports)
> * Other packages to install/Use (Org and Gnus)
>
> A primer as applies to EBDB for #2, #3, and #4 would be nice.

Done! Thanks for all the suggestions.

Eric

bug#35261: 26.1; EBDB Documentation

[David Masterson]

Eric Abrahamsen <eric@ericabrahamsen.net> writes:

> Done! Thanks for all the suggestions.

:-)