bug#36745: 27.0.50; completing-read with require-match nil does not accept spaces

bug#36745: 27.0.50; completing-read with require-match nil does not accept spaces

[Jean Louis]

completing-read is not accepting spaces when require-match is nil

I have discovered I could use C-q SPACE to enter space and get any input
such as "two words"

(completing-read "Hello: " '("Something here" "more here") nil nil)

The above function is accepting any input, not just completions, but
spaces cannot be entered.

I think that it is not logical if it says "any input" that spaces cannot
be entered and it is in that sense possible bug.

Further, if it is intended to be so, then there shall be documented that
spaces cannot be entered or otherwise only with C-q SPACE

The documentation says:

completing-read is a built-in function in
‘src/minibuf.c’.

(completing-read PROMPT COLLECTION &optional
PREDICATE REQUIRE-MATCH INITIAL-INPUT HIST DEF
INHERIT-INPUT-METHOD)

REQUIRE-MATCH can take the following values:
- nil means that the user can exit with any input.



In GNU Emacs 27.0.50 (build 11, x86_64-pc-linux-gnu, X toolkit, Xaw3d scroll bars)
 of 2019-07-18 built on protected.rcdrun.com
Repository revision: a4e57274cc3ad920d6113700ce6496e85eb66ebb
Repository branch: master
Windowing system distributor 'The X.Org Foundation', version 11.0.11906000
System Description: Hyperbola GNU/Linux-libre

Recent messages:
Mark set
Quit
Mark set
previous-line: Beginning of buffer [24 times]
Saved text until " exit if it
  does non-null completion.
"
Quit
Mark set
Making completion list...

Configured using:
 'configure --prefix=/package/text/emacs-2019-07-18 --with-modules
 --without-pop --with-mailutils --with-x-toolkit=lucid --without-gpm'

Configured features:
XAW3D XPM JPEG TIFF GIF PNG RSVG SOUND DBUS GSETTINGS GLIB NOTIFY
INOTIFY ACL GNUTLS LIBXML2 FREETYPE HARFBUZZ M17N_FLT LIBOTF XFT ZLIB
TOOLKIT_SCROLL_BARS LUCID X11 XDBE XIM MODULES THREADS JSON PDUMPER
LCMS2 GMP

Important settings:
  value of $LC_ALL: de_DE.UTF-8
  value of $LANG: de_DE.UTF-8
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Major mode: Help

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bug#36745: 27.0.50; completing-read with require-match nil does not accept spaces

[Drew Adams]

> completing-read is not accepting spaces when require-match is nil
> 
> I have discovered I could use C-q SPACE to enter space and get any
> input
> such as "two words"
> 
> (completing-read "Hello: " '("Something here" "more here") nil nil)
> 
> The above function is accepting any input, not just completions, but
> spaces cannot be entered.
> 
> I think that it is not logical if it says "any input" that spaces
> cannot be entered and it is in that sense possible bug.

FWIW: By default, both `?' and `SPC' are
self-inserting for completion in Icicles
(and have been since 2004).

But this is configurable, with option
`icicle-completion-key-bindings'.

https://www.emacswiki.org/emacs/Icicles_-_Key_Bindings#MinibufferBindings

bug#36745: 27.0.50; completing-read with require-match nil does not accept spaces

[Jean Louis]

* Drew Adams <drew.adams@oracle.com> [2019-07-20 22:17]:
> FWIW: By default, both `?' and `SPC' are
> self-inserting for completion in Icicles
> (and have been since 2004).
> 
> But this is configurable, with option
> `icicle-completion-key-bindings'.
> 
> https://www.emacswiki.org/emacs/Icicles_-_Key_Bindings#MinibufferBinding

That is interesting. Thank you.

I have found that various completion libraries are
re-using the completing-read when necessary, so I
have to stick with completing-read for now, to
keep it minimal, and later customizable.

bug#36745: 27.0.50; completing-read with require-match nil does not accept spaces

[Drew Adams]

> > FWIW: By default, both `?' and `SPC' are
> > self-inserting for completion in Icicles
> > (and have been since 2004).

(I should have said 2005.)

> > But this is configurable, with option
> > `icicle-completion-key-bindings'.
> 
> That is interesting. Thank you.
> 
> I have found that various completion libraries are
> re-using the completing-read when necessary, so I
> have to stick with completing-read for now, to
> keep it minimal, and later customizable.

(When global minor mode `icy-mode' is on, ordinary
`completing-read' automatically gives you Icicles
completion.  When the mode is off, it gives you
the vanilla Emacs behavior.)

But the point was not that you should use Icicles
to get this behavior.  The point was that vanilla
Emacs should offer it also.

I suggested this long ago.  After some time, at
least file-name completion was changed to let
`SPC' self-insert.

One can hope that at some point users will get
similar behavior, by default, for other completion
keymaps, not just for file names.

While waiting, you can bind `SPC' yourself to
`self-insert-command' or whatever else you want,
in any of the minibuffer keymaps.  For example,
bind it in `minibuffer-local-completion-map' and
`minibuffer-local-must-match-map'.
____


Some old mails about letting `SPC', `?', and `C-j'
self-insert by default during completion:

https://lists.gnu.org/archive/html/emacs-devel/2014-04/msg00246.html

https://lists.gnu.org/archive/html/emacs-devel/2014-11/msg01521.html

https://lists.gnu.org/archive/html/emacs-devel/2009-11/msg01045.html

https://lists.gnu.org/archive/html/emacs-devel/2007-06/msg01810.html

https://lists.gnu.org/archive/html/emacs-devel/2005-11/msg00245.html

bug#36745: 27.0.50; completing-read with require-match nil does not accept spaces

[Jean Louis]

* Drew Adams <drew.adams@oracle.com> [2019-07-20 23:53]:
> > > FWIW: By default, both `?' and `SPC' are
> > > self-inserting for completion in Icicles
> > > (and have been since 2004).
> 
> (I should have said 2005.)
> 
> > > But this is configurable, with option
> > > `icicle-completion-key-bindings'.

So far I understand, icicle is some external
library?

I still think it is bug, either in documentation
because it is not "any input" allowed, or in the
function, as if any input would be allowed, then
spaces should be accepted.

My example is that I am giving a prefix to the
subject of email, so completing-read is offering
like: TASK, EXPENSES UPDATED, READ THIS

Subject becomes:

TASK: Do this

or EXPENSES UPDATED: 2019-07-19 for Gabriel

then if I wish to enter "NEWS FROM EUROPE" I
cannot, as space is not accepted as such.

So it makes no sense logically, to accept
"EXPENSES UPDATED" as one option to complete, but
not to limit me or the user to one word "any
input".

Thus any input shall be named "one word" with C-q
SPC option in the description of the function or
spaces shall be allowed, one of those.

bug#36745: 27.0.50; completing-read with require-match nil does not accept spaces

[Michael Heerdegen]

Jean Louis <bugs@gnu.support> writes:

> I think that it is not logical if it says "any input" that spaces
> cannot be entered and it is in that sense possible bug.

I think you should read it as "any (given) input string" (is accepted).
As distinguished from REQUIRE-MATCH t where RET doesn't let you exit
with non matching input.

So I don't see any bug in the strict sense.  OTOH I think it would be
good to speak out that SPC is special, and mention the C-q SPC
workaround, at least in the manual (if we don't do this already - do
we?).

Michael.

bug#36745: 27.0.50; completing-read with require-match nil does not accept spaces

[Drew Adams]

> So far I understand, icicle is some external
> library?

Yes, but it's not important to my point about
the subject of this bug.  I mentioned it to
say that (1) the behavior you said you're
looking for (a) is easily made available and
(b) has existed for a long time in external
libraries, and (2) has already been suggested
for vanilla Emacs, several times in the past,
to no avail.

I'm glad you've filed the bug, to bring up
the question again, but don't necessarily
expect more success now.  (I hope the request
does succeed.)

But you're apparently also OK with having the
doc just remind users that they can input a
space char using `C-q SPC'.

My suggestion is rather that Emacs completion
be "fixed" (enhanced), to - by default - let
`SPC' itself insert a space char, i.e., be
bound to `self-insert-command' or similar.

Users can always change the key binding,
regardless of the default behavior, but many
will not think to do so, even if they might
prefer to have `SPC' self-insert rather than
perform a particular kind of completion
(`minibuffer-complete-word').

As for having the doc for `completing-read'
mention using `C-q' to insert a space char:
OK, but (1) that behavior of `C-q' is general;
it may be particularly helpful during
completion but its use is not limited to that,
and (2) it's not just `SPC'; it's also `?' and
`C-j' (newline).

Certainly the need to insert a newline char
during completion is less common than the need
to insert a space char or a `?' char.  But
those 3 are in the same boat, IMO: They are
keys that normally insert printable chars, and
they are the only such that do not, by default,
self-insert during completion.

bug#36745: 27.0.50; completing-read with require-match nil does not accept spaces

[Jean Louis]

* Michael Heerdegen <michael_heerdegen@web.de> [2019-07-21 01:41]:
> Jean Louis <bugs@gnu.support> writes:
> 
> > I think that it is not logical if it says any input that spaces
> > cannot be entered and it is in that sense possible bug.
> 
> I think you should read it as any (given) input
> string (is accepted).

That is why it is bug. Either it has to be
documented in the function documentation or it
should be "any". One of those.

> So I don't see any bug in the strict sense.  OTOH I think it would be
> good to speak out that SPC is special, and mention the C-q SPC
> workaround, at least in the manual (if we don't do this already - do
> we?).

I see that it is documented for SPC to be
completion of the word. And I think if many people
are used to it, then SPC cannot be used as SPC.

There is option to change the completion key map
so users who can program they can do it easily,
and I am fine too.

I think function shall be described better with at
least some reference within the function
description to the minibuffer-local-completion-map
for example as I found it there that SPC does
minibuffer-complete-word

However, logic is missing and function is in that
sense also not doing it as promised:

(let ((completion-ignore-case t))
  (completing-read "Choice: " '("EXPENSES LIST" "WORK") nil nil))

Now do this:

expSPCsomethingENTER

and you will get

"EXPENSES something"

So I can add the word with spaces to those words
which already exist.

But I cannot enter first unknown word with space
and I get message [no match].

The message [no match] disappears after some time.

Maybe it would be logical to enter the space
before this message appears and then to say [no
match] in the same manner.

I think space shall be allowed in that sense and
in that particular situation when require-match is
nil to allow "any input":

- for reason that it does allow space after first
  matching word

- but it does not allow space after first
  non-matching word

- and it would not hurt any body that space is
  added after first non-matching word after the
  message [no match] have been shown

- as it is logical if there is no match, but user
  can enter any input, to allow the user to enter
  space

and in that sense the
minibuffer-local-completion-map need not be
changed at all

The only change would be that after after first
non-matching word if space is used, the space is
added even though completion did not match.

Jean

bug#36745: 27.0.50; completing-read with require-match nil does not accept spaces

[Jean Louis]

* Drew Adams <drew.adams@oracle.com> [2019-07-21 02:07]:
> > So far I understand, icicle is some external
> > library?
> 
> Yes, but it's not important to my point about the subject
> of this bug.  I mentioned it to say that (1) the behavior
> you said you're looking for (a) is easily made available
> and (b) has existed for a long time in external libraries,
> and (2) has already been suggested for vanilla Emacs,
> several times in the past, to no avail.

Sure, thank you. However, I am looking into built-in way of
completing it, so that it has less dependencies, and that
later those completing libraries can take over. That is how
I understood how various completing libraries are working,
like helm. So the completion I would leave to future choice.

> But you're apparently also OK with having the doc just
> remind users that they can input a space char using `C-q
> SPC'.

Now I found more references in Emacs Lisp manual, so there
is the minibuffer-local-completion-map and I think function
shall be described better with references to it.

And in my previous email on this bug, you can see my
proposal, which sounds logical, and which is when user is
entering first non-matching word and press SPC which should
complete the word by minibuffer-local-completion-map, then
there is message [No match] for short time, so in case of
require-match being nil, then space could be added without
hurting any other behavior of the function.

Because SPC can be added after first matching word. And
additional non-matching word can be added to first matching
word without warnings that it is no match.

So I think the function could be perfected that space can be
added also after first non-matching word in which case it is
even more logical to allow it when require-match is nil.

bug#36745: 27.0.50; completing-read with require-match nil does not accept spaces

[Basil L. Contovounesios]

Michael Heerdegen <michael_heerdegen@web.de> writes:

> So I don't see any bug in the strict sense.  OTOH I think it would be
> good to speak out that SPC is special, and mention the C-q SPC
> workaround, at least in the manual (if we don't do this already - do
> we?).

We do, see (info "(emacs) Minibuffer Edit"):

     Inside a minibuffer, the keys <TAB>, <SPC>, and ‘?’ are often bound
  to “completion commands”, which allow you to easily fill in the desired
  text without typing all of it.  *Note Completion.  As with <RET>, you
  can use ‘C-q’ to insert a <TAB>, <SPC>, or ‘?’ character.

and (info "(emacs) Completion Commands").

-- 
Basil

bug#36745: 27.0.50; completing-read with require-match nil does not accept spaces

[Basil L. Contovounesios]

Jean Louis <bugs@gnu.support> writes:

> * Michael Heerdegen <michael_heerdegen@web.de> [2019-07-21 01:41]:
>> Jean Louis <bugs@gnu.support> writes:
>> 
>> > I think that it is not logical if it says any input that spaces
>> > cannot be entered and it is in that sense possible bug.
>> 
>> I think you should read it as any (given) input
>> string (is accepted).
>
> That is why it is bug. Either it has to be
> documented in the function documentation or it
> should be "any". One of those.

Indeed, this could probably be clarified.

-- 
Basil

bug#36745: 27.0.50; completing-read with require-match nil does not accept spaces

[Michael Heerdegen]

Jean Louis <bugs@gnu.support> writes:

> That is why it is bug. Either it has to be documented in the function
> documentation or it should be "any". One of those.

I still think you don't get the intended meaning.  "Input" here is a bit
ambiguous.  It could either mean "the keys you type", which AFAIU you
read it, and "the contents of the minibuffer", which is how I read it:
any contents are accepted.  This is not wrong.  It still can be
clarified to be less ambiguous, of course.

Michael.

bug#36745: 27.0.50; completing-read with require-match nil does not accept spaces

[Michael Heerdegen]

Jean Louis <bugs@gnu.support> writes:

> The only change would be that after after first non-matching word if
> space is used, the space is added even though completion did not
> match.

It could still be confusing if SPC sometimes works as
insert-a-space-char key and sometimes not.  You still couldn't rely on
it inserting a space, and your brain would still have to remember that
it could mean trouble.

Anyway, my opinion doesn't matter much.  I don't like the behavior of
space not just inserting a space - I get angry every time this happens.
I wonder what others do think about it.

Michael.

bug#36745: 27.0.50; completing-read with require-match nil does not accept spaces

[Drew Adams]

> I don't like the behavior of space not just inserting
> a space - I get angry every time this happens.
> I wonder what others do think about it.

+1.  (I've already stated my agreement on that.)

bug#36745: 27.0.50; completing-read with require-match nil does not accept spaces

[Lars Ingebrigtsen]

Michael Heerdegen <michael_heerdegen@web.de> writes:

> Anyway, my opinion doesn't matter much.  I don't like the behavior of
> space not just inserting a space - I get angry every time this happens.
> I wonder what others do think about it.

I absolutely loathe it, so I have:

(keymap-set minibuffer-local-completion-map "SPC" #'self-insert-command)
(keymap-set minibuffer-local-completion-map "?" #'self-insert-command)

But I don't think this is something we can change at this point.

But I've now added this to the Minibuffer Edit node in the Emacs manual.
I don't think there's anything more to do in this bug report, and I'm
therefore closing it.

-- 
(domestic pets only, the antidote for overdose, milk.)
   bloggy blog: http://lars.ingebrigtsen.no

bug#36745: [External] : bug#36745: 27.0.50; completing-read with require-match nil does not accept spaces

[Drew Adams]

> > Anyway, my opinion doesn't matter much.  I don't like the behavior of
> > space not just inserting a space - I get angry every time this happens.
> > I wonder what others do think about it.
> 
> I absolutely loathe it, so I have:
> 
> (keymap-set minibuffer-local-completion-map "SPC" #'self-insert-command)
> (keymap-set minibuffer-local-completion-map "?" #'self-insert-command)
> 
> But I don't think this is something we can change at this point.

Why not?  You seem to change lots of things "at
this point", whatever the point.

I requested this changed decades ago.  And I may
have filed it as an enhancement-request bug.

It took years for SPC to become self-inserting
for (only) file-name completion.  Many more
years have passed since then.  Courage!

> But I've now added this to the Minibuffer Edit node in the Emacs manual.

What did you add?  Telling users that if they
want sane behavior they can add such bindings
themselves?  Did you tell them Emacs still
doesn't dare do that by default?

How about proposing it in emacs-devel, or
taking a user poll, to see how many users
really don't want such keys to self-insert?

> I don't think there's anything more to do in this bug report, and I'm
> therefore closing it.

All of these keys should be self-inserting during
completion: SPC, ?, C-j.  (Not just SPC and ?.)

It's long past time to do this.  There's no good
reason not to do it.

If you want, add an option for a list of keys to
bind to word completion.

[I do that in Icicles, to give users who still
want word completion an alternative to SPC (and
an easy way to get back SPC if they really want
that to word-complete).  By default, option
`icicle-word-completion-keys' is the singleton
list with key `M-SPC'.]

Or just bind `M-SPC' to `minibuffer-complete-word'
by default.