bug#3833: 23.0.96; Default for desktop-buffers-not-to-save omits files

bug#3833: 23.0.96; Default for desktop-buffers-not-to-save omits files

[Eli Zaretskii]

I restarted Emacs today on one of my machines (because I built a new
version), and suddenly some of the files I worked on in the previous
session were not visited by Emacs.  It took time for me to find which
files I was working on, because I don't keep records of all of the
files I have in my session: I trust desktop.el to do that.

Looking in desktop.el, I see that desktop-buffers-not-to-save
intentionally omits buffers whose names end in ".log" and a couple
others.  Sure thing, the files that were not visited after restarting
ended in ".log".

I think that variable's default should be nil.  I think it is up to
the user to decide that she doesn't want to record some of the
buffers/files.  It is no business of desktop.el to decide for the
user.  Especially since there is no way of telling desktop.el to
override the value of desktop-buffers-not-to-save for some specific
buffer, short of renaming the buffer.

Similarly with desktop-files-not-to-save: its default should be nil,
IMO.


In GNU Emacs 23.0.96.1 (i386-mingw-nt5.1.2600)
 of 2009-07-11 on HOME-C4E4A596F7
Windowing system distributor `Microsoft Corp.', version 5.1.2600
configured using `configure --with-gcc (3.4)'

Important settings:
  value of $LC_ALL: nil
  value of $LC_COLLATE: nil
  value of $LC_CTYPE: nil
  value of $LC_MESSAGES: nil
  value of $LC_MONETARY: nil
  value of $LC_NUMERIC: nil
  value of $LC_TIME: nil
  value of $LANG: ENU
  value of $XMODIFIERS: nil
  locale-coding-system: cp1255
  default-enable-multibyte-characters: t

Major mode: Mail

Minor modes in effect:
  flyspell-mode: t
  desktop-save-mode: t
  show-paren-mode: t
  display-time-mode: t
  tooltip-mode: t
  tool-bar-mode: t
  mouse-wheel-mode: t
  menu-bar-mode: t
  file-name-shadow-mode: t
  global-font-lock-mode: t
  font-lock-mode: t
  blink-cursor-mode: t
  global-auto-composition-mode: t
  auto-composition-mode: t
  auto-encryption-mode: t
  auto-compression-mode: t
  temp-buffer-resize-mode: t
  line-number-mode: t
  abbrev-mode: t

bug#3833: marked as done (23.0.96; Default for desktop-buffers-not-to-save omits files)

[Emacs bug Tracking System]

[-- Attachment #1: Type: text/plain, Size: 912 bytes --]


Your message dated Sat, 18 Jul 2009 14:59:32 +0300
with message-id <83y6qmp5gb.fsf@gnu.org>
and subject line Re: bug#3833: 23.0.96;	Default for desktop-buffers-not-to-save omits files
has caused the Emacs bug report #3833,
regarding 23.0.96; Default for desktop-buffers-not-to-save omits files
to be marked as done.

This means that you claim that the problem has been dealt with.
If this is not the case it is now your responsibility to reopen the
bug report if necessary, and/or fix the problem forthwith.

(NB: If you are a system administrator and have no idea what this
message is talking about, this may indicate a serious mail system
misconfiguration somewhere. Please contact owner@emacsbugs.donarmstrong.com
immediately.)


-- 
3833: http://emacsbugs.donarmstrong.com/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=3833
Emacs Bug Tracking System
Contact owner@emacsbugs.donarmstrong.com with problems

[-- Attachment #2: Type: message/rfc822, Size: 4122 bytes --]

From: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@gnu.org>
To: emacs-pretest-bug@gnu.org
Subject: 23.0.96; Default for desktop-buffers-not-to-save omits files
Date: Sun, 12 Jul 2009 21:06:34 +0300
Message-ID: <83bpnpsrmd.fsf@gnu.org>

I restarted Emacs today on one of my machines (because I built a new
version), and suddenly some of the files I worked on in the previous
session were not visited by Emacs.  It took time for me to find which
files I was working on, because I don't keep records of all of the
files I have in my session: I trust desktop.el to do that.

Looking in desktop.el, I see that desktop-buffers-not-to-save
intentionally omits buffers whose names end in ".log" and a couple
others.  Sure thing, the files that were not visited after restarting
ended in ".log".

I think that variable's default should be nil.  I think it is up to
the user to decide that she doesn't want to record some of the
buffers/files.  It is no business of desktop.el to decide for the
user.  Especially since there is no way of telling desktop.el to
override the value of desktop-buffers-not-to-save for some specific
buffer, short of renaming the buffer.

Similarly with desktop-files-not-to-save: its default should be nil,
IMO.


In GNU Emacs 23.0.96.1 (i386-mingw-nt5.1.2600)
 of 2009-07-11 on HOME-C4E4A596F7
Windowing system distributor `Microsoft Corp.', version 5.1.2600
configured using `configure --with-gcc (3.4)'

Important settings:
  value of $LC_ALL: nil
  value of $LC_COLLATE: nil
  value of $LC_CTYPE: nil
  value of $LC_MESSAGES: nil
  value of $LC_MONETARY: nil
  value of $LC_NUMERIC: nil
  value of $LC_TIME: nil
  value of $LANG: ENU
  value of $XMODIFIERS: nil
  locale-coding-system: cp1255
  default-enable-multibyte-characters: t

Major mode: Mail

Minor modes in effect:
  flyspell-mode: t
  desktop-save-mode: t
  show-paren-mode: t
  display-time-mode: t
  tooltip-mode: t
  tool-bar-mode: t
  mouse-wheel-mode: t
  menu-bar-mode: t
  file-name-shadow-mode: t
  global-font-lock-mode: t
  font-lock-mode: t
  blink-cursor-mode: t
  global-auto-composition-mode: t
  auto-composition-mode: t
  auto-encryption-mode: t
  auto-compression-mode: t
  temp-buffer-resize-mode: t
  line-number-mode: t
  abbrev-mode: t




[-- Attachment #3: Type: message/rfc822, Size: 2875 bytes --]

From: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@gnu.org>
To: 3833-done@emacsbugs.donarmstrong.com
Cc: cyd@stupidchicken.com
Subject: Re: bug#3833: 23.0.96;	Default for desktop-buffers-not-to-save omits files
Date: Sat, 18 Jul 2009 14:59:32 +0300
Message-ID: <83y6qmp5gb.fsf@gnu.org>

> Date: Thu, 16 Jul 2009 21:24:37 +0300
> From: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@gnu.org>
> Cc: cyd@stupidchicken.com
> 
> > Date: Mon, 13 Jul 2009 21:48:02 +0300
> > From: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@gnu.org>
> > Cc: 3833@emacsbugs.donarmstrong.com
> > 
> > > >> > BTW, I can't find a place in Gnus that creates buffers matching
> > > >> > "^nn\\.a[0-9]+".
> > > >>
> > > >> I guess I was mistaken.  No idea what those buffers match.
> > > >
> > > > OK to remove that as well?
> > > 
> > > This is the original ChangeLog entry.  Ring any bells to you?
> > 
> > No, but we can ask Morten.
> > 
> > Morten, do you remember anything about why you added "^nn\\.a[0-9]+"
> > to desktop-buffers-not-to-save?  Here's the log entry:
> > 
> > >   1994-02-04  Morten Welinder  (terra@tyr.diku.dk)
> > > 
> > >     * desktop.el (desktop-buffers-not-to-save): Add regexp for "nn"
> > >     temporary files.
> > > 
> > > If not, it's probably historical baggage, so let's delete it.
> 
> Morten replied (in a private email) that this goes back to the "No
> News" newsreader, which is now RIP.
> 
> So unless someone hollers, I will remove the "^nn\\.a[0-9]+" pattern
> from desktop-buffers-not-to-save.

Done.

bug#3833: 23.0.96; Default for desktop-buffers-not-to-save omits files

[Chong Yidong]

> Looking in desktop.el, I see that desktop-buffers-not-to-save
> intentionally omits buffers whose names end in ".log" and a couple
> others.  Sure thing, the files that were not visited after restarting
> ended in ".log".
>
> I think that variable's default should be nil.  I think it is up to
> the user to decide that she doesn't want to record some of the
> buffers/files.  It is no business of desktop.el to decide for the
> user.  Especially since there is no way of telling desktop.el to
> override the value of desktop-buffers-not-to-save for some specific
> buffer, short of renaming the buffer.

I agree that .log should be removed.  However, the two other items seem
to make sense: Gnus and FTP sessions, because desktop.el can't recreate
those.  If you'd like to remove .log, please go ahead and do so on the
trunk.

> Similarly with desktop-files-not-to-save: its default should be nil,
> IMO.

These are remote (Tramp/ange-ftp) files.  Again, I think the rationale
is that desktop.el can't recreate them properly.

bug#3833: 23.0.96; Default for desktop-buffers-not-to-save omits files

[Eli Zaretskii]

> From: Chong Yidong <cyd@stupidchicken.com>
> Cc: 3833@emacsbugs.donarmstrong.com
> Date: Sun, 12 Jul 2009 14:44:27 -0400
> 
> I agree that .log should be removed.  However, the two other items seem
> to make sense: Gnus and FTP sessions, because desktop.el can't recreate
> those.

The fact that Gnus makes buffers named nn.a7 does not mean there
cannot be a file or buffer by that name that has nothing to do with
Gnus.  Likewise, there can legitimately be a file or buffer named
literally "(ftp)".

If these are names of buffers that many users would like to omit, we
can make them one of the choices we offer, but I don't think we should
make them the default.

Also, I think desktop.el should check that buffers mentioned in
desktop-buffers-not-to-save don't have an associated file.  Files
should be mentioned in desktop-files-not-to-save.

> If you'd like to remove .log, please go ahead and do so on the
> trunk.

Done.

> > Similarly with desktop-files-not-to-save: its default should be nil,
> > IMO.
> 
> These are remote (Tramp/ange-ftp) files.

Only mostly so.  They can be regular files as well.

> Again, I think the rationale is that desktop.el can't recreate them
> properly.

Why not?  If they exist on the remote host, I think it can.

bug#3833: 23.0.96; Default for desktop-buffers-not-to-save omits files

[Reiner Steib]

On Sun, Jul 12 2009, Eli Zaretskii wrote:

>> From: Chong Yidong <cyd@stupidchicken.com>

[ desktop-buffers-not-to-save ] 
>> I agree that .log should be removed.  However, the two other items seem
>> to make sense: Gnus and FTP sessions, because desktop.el can't recreate
>> those.
>
> The fact that Gnus makes buffers named nn.a7 does not mean there
> cannot be a file or buffer by that name that has nothing to do with
> Gnus.  

BTW, I can't find a place in Gnus that creates buffers matching
"^nn\\.a[0-9]+".

Bye, Reiner.
-- 
       ,,,
      (o o)
---ooO-(_)-Ooo---  |  PGP key available  |  http://rsteib.home.pages.de/

bug#3833: 23.0.96; Default for desktop-buffers-not-to-save omits files

[Chong Yidong]

Reiner Steib <reinersteib+gmane@imap.cc> writes:

> BTW, I can't find a place in Gnus that creates buffers matching
> "^nn\\.a[0-9]+".

I guess I was mistaken.  No idea what those buffers match.

bug#3833: 23.0.96; Default for desktop-buffers-not-to-save omits files

[Eli Zaretskii]

> From: Chong Yidong <cyd@stupidchicken.com>
> Cc: 3833@emacsbugs.donarmstrong.com
> Date: Sun, 12 Jul 2009 22:06:10 -0400
> 
> Reiner Steib <reinersteib+gmane@imap.cc> writes:
> 
> > BTW, I can't find a place in Gnus that creates buffers matching
> > "^nn\\.a[0-9]+".
> 
> I guess I was mistaken.  No idea what those buffers match.

OK to remove that as well?

bug#3833: 23.0.96; Default for desktop-buffers-not-to-save omits files

[Chong Yidong]

Eli Zaretskii <eliz@gnu.org> writes:

>> From: Chong Yidong <cyd@stupidchicken.com>
>> Cc: 3833@emacsbugs.donarmstrong.com
>> Date: Sun, 12 Jul 2009 22:06:10 -0400
>>
>> Reiner Steib <reinersteib+gmane@imap.cc> writes:
>>
>> > BTW, I can't find a place in Gnus that creates buffers matching
>> > "^nn\\.a[0-9]+".
>>
>> I guess I was mistaken.  No idea what those buffers match.
>
> OK to remove that as well?

This is the original ChangeLog entry.  Ring any bells to you?

  1994-02-04  Morten Welinder  (terra@tyr.diku.dk)

    * desktop.el (desktop-buffers-not-to-save): Add regexp for "nn"
    temporary files.

If not, it's probably historical baggage, so let's delete it.

bug#3833: 23.0.96; Default for desktop-buffers-not-to-save omits files

[Eli Zaretskii]

> From: Chong Yidong <cyd@stupidchicken.com>
> Cc: 3833@emacsbugs.donarmstrong.com
> Date: Mon, 13 Jul 2009 00:30:00 -0400
> 
> Eli Zaretskii <eliz@gnu.org> writes:
> 
> >> From: Chong Yidong <cyd@stupidchicken.com>
> >> Cc: 3833@emacsbugs.donarmstrong.com
> >> Date: Sun, 12 Jul 2009 22:06:10 -0400
> >>
> >> Reiner Steib <reinersteib+gmane@imap.cc> writes:
> >>
> >> > BTW, I can't find a place in Gnus that creates buffers matching
> >> > "^nn\\.a[0-9]+".
> >>
> >> I guess I was mistaken.  No idea what those buffers match.
> >
> > OK to remove that as well?
> 
> This is the original ChangeLog entry.  Ring any bells to you?

No, but we can ask Morten.

Morten, do you remember anything about why you added "^nn\\.a[0-9]+"
to desktop-buffers-not-to-save?  Here's the log entry:

>   1994-02-04  Morten Welinder  (terra@tyr.diku.dk)
> 
>     * desktop.el (desktop-buffers-not-to-save): Add regexp for "nn"
>     temporary files.
> 
> If not, it's probably historical baggage, so let's delete it.

bug#3833: 23.0.96; Default for desktop-buffers-not-to-save omits files

[Eli Zaretskii]

> Date: Mon, 13 Jul 2009 21:48:02 +0300
> From: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@gnu.org>
> Cc: 3833@emacsbugs.donarmstrong.com
> 
> > >> > BTW, I can't find a place in Gnus that creates buffers matching
> > >> > "^nn\\.a[0-9]+".
> > >>
> > >> I guess I was mistaken.  No idea what those buffers match.
> > >
> > > OK to remove that as well?
> > 
> > This is the original ChangeLog entry.  Ring any bells to you?
> 
> No, but we can ask Morten.
> 
> Morten, do you remember anything about why you added "^nn\\.a[0-9]+"
> to desktop-buffers-not-to-save?  Here's the log entry:
> 
> >   1994-02-04  Morten Welinder  (terra@tyr.diku.dk)
> > 
> >     * desktop.el (desktop-buffers-not-to-save): Add regexp for "nn"
> >     temporary files.
> > 
> > If not, it's probably historical baggage, so let's delete it.

Morten replied (in a private email) that this goes back to the "No
News" newsreader, which is now RIP.

So unless someone hollers, I will remove the "^nn\\.a[0-9]+" pattern
from desktop-buffers-not-to-save.

bug#3833: 23.0.96; Default for desktop-buffers-not-to-save omits files

[Stefan Monnier]

> Also, I think desktop.el should check that buffers mentioned in
> desktop-buffers-not-to-save don't have an associated file.  Files
> should be mentioned in desktop-files-not-to-save.

That's the actually bug to fix, yes.


        Stefan

bug#3833: 23.0.96; Default for desktop-buffers-not-to-save omits files

[Eli Zaretskii]

> From: Stefan Monnier <monnier@iro.umontreal.ca>
> Cc: 3833@emacsbugs.donarmstrong.com,  Chong Yidong <cyd@stupidchicken.com>
> Date: Tue, 14 Jul 2009 16:03:45 -0400
> 
> > Also, I think desktop.el should check that buffers mentioned in
> > desktop-buffers-not-to-save don't have an associated file.  Files
> > should be mentioned in desktop-files-not-to-save.
> 
> That's the actually bug to fix, yes.

Done.

bug#3833: 23.0.96; Default for desktop-buffers-not-to-save omits files

[Juri Linkov]

>> I think that variable's default should be nil.  I think it is up to
>> the user to decide that she doesn't want to record some of the
>> buffers/files.  It is no business of desktop.el to decide for the
>> user.  Especially since there is no way of telling desktop.el to
>> override the value of desktop-buffers-not-to-save for some specific
>> buffer, short of renaming the buffer.
>
> I agree that .log should be removed.  However, the two other items seem
> to make sense: Gnus and FTP sessions, because desktop.el can't recreate
> those.  If you'd like to remove .log, please go ahead and do so on the
> trunk.

I find the value ".log" useful because it helps not to load usually
large log files, but I agree that this should be a personal preference
because it is natural to expect that desktop.el will restore all files
it can recreate.

As for Gnus and FTP sessions, we could try to ignore them using
`desktop-modes-not-to-save' or `desktop-buffer-mode-handlers'
if they have a non-default mode.

>> Similarly with desktop-files-not-to-save: its default should be nil,
>> IMO.
>
> These are remote (Tramp/ange-ftp) files.  Again, I think the rationale
> is that desktop.el can't recreate them properly.

recentf.el uses two predicates `file-remote-p' and `file-readable-p' to
decide which files should be kept.  Maybe desktop.el should do the same?

-- 
Juri Linkov
http://www.jurta.org/emacs/