* Proposed key binding changes: archiving and attachments
@ 2009-10-30 6:54 Carsten Dominik
2009-10-30 9:54 ` Friedrich Delgado Friedrichs
` (2 more replies)
0 siblings, 3 replies; 21+ messages in thread
From: Carsten Dominik @ 2009-10-30 6:54 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: emacs-orgmode list
Hi everyone,
I would like to change some key bindings related to archiving,
and this change will also affect the access key for attachments.
The main reason is that I think there should be a single default key
for archiving, and that the user sets a variable to decide what the
default
archiving method should be. I would like this key to be `C-c C-a' which
is why the org-attach key would have to move as well.
Here is my proposal:
In Org-mode files
-----------------
C-c C-a archive default (setq by org-archive-default-command)
C-c C-x C-s org-archive-subtree (C-c $ remains valid as well)
C-c C-x a org-toggle-archive-tag
C-c C-x A org-archive-to-archive-sibling
C-c C-x C-a attach
In the agenda
-------------
a archive with org-archive-default-command
C-c C-a same as a
C-c C-x a org-toggle-archive-tag
C-c C-x A org-archive-to-archive-sibling
C-c C-x C-s org-archive-subtree ($ remains valid as well)
I am wondering how much resistance such a change would create.
Comments?
- Carsten
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 21+ messages in thread* Re: Proposed key binding changes: archiving and attachments 2009-10-30 6:54 Proposed key binding changes: archiving and attachments Carsten Dominik @ 2009-10-30 9:54 ` Friedrich Delgado Friedrichs 2009-10-30 10:31 ` Peter Frings 2009-10-31 9:13 ` Carsten Dominik 2009-10-30 11:36 ` Matt Lundin 2009-10-30 17:54 ` Leo 2 siblings, 2 replies; 21+ messages in thread From: Friedrich Delgado Friedrichs @ 2009-10-30 9:54 UTC (permalink / raw) To: emacs-orgmode Hi! Carsten Dominik schrieb: > The main reason is that I think there should be a single default key > for archiving, and that the user sets a variable to decide what the > default > archiving method should be. I would like this key to be `C-c C-a' which > is why the org-attach key would have to move as well. That seems like a good idea. > In Org-mode files > > C-c C-a archive default (setq by org-archive-default-command) > C-c C-x C-s org-archive-subtree (C-c $ remains valid as well) > C-c C-x a org-toggle-archive-tag > C-c C-x A org-archive-to-archive-sibling No problems here for me. The keys I use most often are still at their previous bindings. > In the agenda > a archive with org-archive-default-command If that hit me by surprise there would be some cussing involved, I guess. What's the planned default for org-archive-default-command? If I get a fair warning I'd set it to org-toggle-archive-tag. > I am wondering how much resistance such a change would create. ---Zitatende--- Not too much, I guess. -- Friedrich Delgado Friedrichs <friedel@nomaden.org> TauPan on Ircnet and Freenode ;) ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 21+ messages in thread
* Re: Proposed key binding changes: archiving and attachments 2009-10-30 9:54 ` Friedrich Delgado Friedrichs @ 2009-10-30 10:31 ` Peter Frings 2009-10-30 12:35 ` Bernt Hansen 2009-10-31 9:13 ` Carsten Dominik 1 sibling, 1 reply; 21+ messages in thread From: Peter Frings @ 2009-10-30 10:31 UTC (permalink / raw) To: org-mode Mailinglist On 30 Oct 2009, at 10:54, Friedrich Delgado Friedrichs wrote: > Carsten Dominik schrieb: >> The main reason is that I think there should be a single default key >> for archiving, and that the user sets a variable to decide what the >> default archiving method should be. I would like this key to be `C- >> c C-a' which >> is why the org-attach key would have to move as well. [snip] >> In the agenda >> a archive with org-archive-default-command > > If that hit me by surprise there would be some cussing involved, I > guess. What's the planned default for org-archive-default-command? If > I get a fair warning I'd set it to org-toggle-archive-tag. I kind of agree that one-letter commands should be `safe': they should not do anything that cannot be easily undone; it's just too easy to hit them by accident. If it cannot be undone, I prefer the C-x ... key sequence, or have the `a' prompt for something. Cheers, Peter. ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 21+ messages in thread
* Re: Proposed key binding changes: archiving and attachments 2009-10-30 10:31 ` Peter Frings @ 2009-10-30 12:35 ` Bernt Hansen 0 siblings, 0 replies; 21+ messages in thread From: Bernt Hansen @ 2009-10-30 12:35 UTC (permalink / raw) To: Peter Frings; +Cc: org-mode Mailinglist Peter Frings <peter.frings@agfa.com> writes: > On 30 Oct 2009, at 10:54, Friedrich Delgado Friedrichs wrote: > >> Carsten Dominik schrieb: >>> The main reason is that I think there should be a single default key >>> for archiving, and that the user sets a variable to decide what the >>> default archiving method should be. I would like this key to be >>> C- >>> c C-a' which >>> is why the org-attach key would have to move as well. > > [snip] > >>> In the agenda >>> a archive with org-archive-default-command >> >> If that hit me by surprise there would be some cussing involved, I >> guess. What's the planned default for org-archive-default-command? If >> I get a fair warning I'd set it to org-toggle-archive-tag. > > I kind of agree that one-letter commands should be `safe': they should > not do anything that cannot be easily undone; it's just too easy to > hit them by accident. If it cannot be undone, I prefer the C-x ... key > sequence, or have the `a' prompt for something. That's my initial reaction too. I archive using C-c C-x C-s but I bind it to a macro. I archive once a month in 'bunches' so I find a subtree to archive, then do C-x ( C-c C-x C-e (once) then C-x e e e e ... to do my archiving for a sequential set of subtrees. I can see hitting 'a' by accident would archive stuff when I don't intend to. Maybe if there was a configurable question to verify you want to archive then that would mitigate this potential problem. We would need the ability to toggle this safety question on and off. -Bernt ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 21+ messages in thread
* Re: Proposed key binding changes: archiving and attachments 2009-10-30 9:54 ` Friedrich Delgado Friedrichs 2009-10-30 10:31 ` Peter Frings @ 2009-10-31 9:13 ` Carsten Dominik 2009-10-31 13:23 ` Bernt Hansen 2009-10-31 14:56 ` Matt Lundin 1 sibling, 2 replies; 21+ messages in thread From: Carsten Dominik @ 2009-10-31 9:13 UTC (permalink / raw) To: friedel; +Cc: emacs-orgmode OK, here is what I have now settled for, effective immediately: The following keys now do archiving C-c C-x C-a archive using the command specified in `org-archive-default-command' This variable is by default set to `org-archive-subtree', which means arching to the archive file. The three specific archiving commands are available through C-c C-x C-s archive to archive file C-c C-x a toggle the archive tag C-c C-x A move to archive sibling These bindings work the same in an Org file, and in the agenda. In addition: - In the agenda you can also use `a' to call the default archiving command, but you need to confirm the command with `y' so that this cannot easily happen by accident. - For backward compatibility, `C-c $' in an org-mode file, and `$' in the agenda buffer continue to archive to archive file. Can we agree on this? - Carsten On Oct 30, 2009, at 10:54 AM, Friedrich Delgado Friedrichs wrote: > Hi! > > Carsten Dominik schrieb: >> The main reason is that I think there should be a single default key >> for archiving, and that the user sets a variable to decide what the >> default >> archiving method should be. I would like this key to be `C-c C-a' >> which >> is why the org-attach key would have to move as well. > > That seems like a good idea. > >> In Org-mode files >> >> C-c C-a archive default (setq by org-archive-default-command) >> C-c C-x C-s org-archive-subtree (C-c $ remains valid as well) >> C-c C-x a org-toggle-archive-tag >> C-c C-x A org-archive-to-archive-sibling > > No problems here for me. The keys I use most often are still at their > previous bindings. > >> In the agenda >> a archive with org-archive-default-command > > If that hit me by surprise there would be some cussing involved, I > guess. What's the planned default for org-archive-default-command? If > I get a fair warning I'd set it to org-toggle-archive-tag. > >> I am wondering how much resistance such a change would create. > ---Zitatende--- > > Not too much, I guess. > > -- > Friedrich Delgado Friedrichs <friedel@nomaden.org> > TauPan on Ircnet and Freenode ;) > > > _______________________________________________ > Emacs-orgmode mailing list > Remember: use `Reply All' to send replies to the list. > Emacs-orgmode@gnu.org > http://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/emacs-orgmode - Carsten ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 21+ messages in thread
* Re: Proposed key binding changes: archiving and attachments 2009-10-31 9:13 ` Carsten Dominik @ 2009-10-31 13:23 ` Bernt Hansen 2009-10-31 14:56 ` Matt Lundin 1 sibling, 0 replies; 21+ messages in thread From: Bernt Hansen @ 2009-10-31 13:23 UTC (permalink / raw) To: Carsten Dominik; +Cc: emacs-orgmode Carsten Dominik <carsten.dominik@gmail.com> writes: > OK, here is what I have now settled for, effective immediately: > > The following keys now do archiving > > C-c C-x C-a archive using the command specified in > `org-archive-default-command' > > This variable is by default set to `org-archive-subtree', which means > arching to the archive file. > > The three specific archiving commands are available through > > C-c C-x C-s archive to archive file > C-c C-x a toggle the archive tag > C-c C-x A move to archive sibling > > These bindings work the same in an Org file, and in the agenda. > > In addition: > > - In the agenda you can also use `a' to call the default archiving > command, but you need to confirm the command with `y' so that this > cannot easily happen by accident. > > - For backward compatibility, `C-c $' in an org-mode file, and `$' in > the agenda buffer continue to archive to archive file. > > Can we agree on this? Works for me :) Thanks, Bernt ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 21+ messages in thread
* Re: Proposed key binding changes: archiving and attachments 2009-10-31 9:13 ` Carsten Dominik 2009-10-31 13:23 ` Bernt Hansen @ 2009-10-31 14:56 ` Matt Lundin 1 sibling, 0 replies; 21+ messages in thread From: Matt Lundin @ 2009-10-31 14:56 UTC (permalink / raw) To: Carsten Dominik; +Cc: emacs-orgmode Carsten Dominik <carsten.dominik@gmail.com> writes: > OK, here is what I have now settled for, effective immediately: > > The following keys now do archiving > > C-c C-x C-a archive using the command specified in > `org-archive-default-command' > > This variable is by default set to `org-archive-subtree', which means > arching to the archive file. > > The three specific archiving commands are available through > > C-c C-x C-s archive to archive file > C-c C-x a toggle the archive tag > C-c C-x A move to archive sibling > > These bindings work the same in an Org file, and in the agenda. > > In addition: > > - In the agenda you can also use `a' to call the default archiving > command, but you need to confirm the command with `y' so that this > cannot easily happen by accident. > > - For backward compatibility, `C-c $' in an org-mode file, and `$' in > the agenda buffer continue to archive to archive file. > > Can we agree on this? > > - Carsten This looks good to me. - Matt ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 21+ messages in thread
* Re: Proposed key binding changes: archiving and attachments 2009-10-30 6:54 Proposed key binding changes: archiving and attachments Carsten Dominik 2009-10-30 9:54 ` Friedrich Delgado Friedrichs @ 2009-10-30 11:36 ` Matt Lundin 2009-10-30 13:33 ` Carsten Dominik 2009-10-30 13:58 ` Detlef Steuer 2009-10-30 17:54 ` Leo 2 siblings, 2 replies; 21+ messages in thread From: Matt Lundin @ 2009-10-30 11:36 UTC (permalink / raw) To: Carsten Dominik; +Cc: emacs-orgmode list Hi Carsten, Carsten Dominik <carsten.dominik@gmail.com> writes: > Hi everyone, > > I would like to change some key bindings related to archiving, > and this change will also affect the access key for attachments. > > The main reason is that I think there should be a single default key > for archiving, and that the user sets a variable to decide what the > default > archiving method should be. I would like this key to be `C-c C-a' which > is why the org-attach key would have to move as well. > > Here is my proposal: > > In Org-mode files > ----------------- > > C-c C-a archive default (setq by org-archive-default-command) > C-c C-x C-s org-archive-subtree (C-c $ remains valid as well) > C-c C-x a org-toggle-archive-tag > C-c C-x A org-archive-to-archive-sibling > > C-c C-x C-a attach Since I've taken to using attachments quite a bit, I would most likely restore the current keybindings in my own settings. My chief concern with mapping archiving to C-c C-a is that it is too close to the conventional keybinding for org-agenda (C-c a). With the proposed keybindings, I fear it might be too easy to introduce drastic changes in a file accidentally. (E.g., I sometimes hit C-c C-a when I intend to hit C-c a and vice versa.) > > In the agenda > ------------- > a archive with org-archive-default-command > C-c C-a same as a > C-c C-x a org-toggle-archive-tag > C-c C-x A org-archive-to-archive-sibling > C-c C-x C-s org-archive-subtree ($ remains valid as well) Again, I would prefer that C-c C-a remain bound to org-attach. I currently unbind "a" (org-toggle-archive-tag) in the agenda. In the past, items often mysteriously disappeared from my agenda view. I discovered the cause: I was occasionally hitting "a" by accident. I agree with Peter that commands with relatively destructive consequences (such as archiving) should not be bound to a single key. One wouldn't want to miss an appointment because one accidentally hits "a" in the agenda. :) Thanks for giving us the chance to provide feedback on these proposed changes. - Matt > > > I am wondering how much resistance such a change would create. > > Comments? > > - Carsten ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 21+ messages in thread
* Re: Proposed key binding changes: archiving and attachments 2009-10-30 11:36 ` Matt Lundin @ 2009-10-30 13:33 ` Carsten Dominik 2009-11-06 13:40 ` Friedrich Delgado Friedrichs 2009-10-30 13:58 ` Detlef Steuer 1 sibling, 1 reply; 21+ messages in thread From: Carsten Dominik @ 2009-10-30 13:33 UTC (permalink / raw) To: Matt Lundin; +Cc: emacs-orgmode list On Oct 30, 2009, at 12:36 PM, Matt Lundin wrote: > Hi Carsten, > > Carsten Dominik <carsten.dominik@gmail.com> writes: > >> Hi everyone, >> >> I would like to change some key bindings related to archiving, >> and this change will also affect the access key for attachments. >> >> The main reason is that I think there should be a single default key >> for archiving, and that the user sets a variable to decide what the >> default >> archiving method should be. I would like this key to be `C-c C-a' >> which >> is why the org-attach key would have to move as well. >> >> Here is my proposal: >> >> In Org-mode files >> ----------------- >> >> C-c C-a archive default (setq by org-archive-default-command) >> C-c C-x C-s org-archive-subtree (C-c $ remains valid as well) >> C-c C-x a org-toggle-archive-tag >> C-c C-x A org-archive-to-archive-sibling >> >> C-c C-x C-a attach > > Since I've taken to using attachments quite a bit, I would most likely > restore the current keybindings in my own settings. > > My chief concern with mapping archiving to C-c C-a is that it is too > close to the conventional keybinding for org-agenda (C-c a). With the > proposed keybindings, I fear it might be too easy to introduce drastic > changes in a file accidentally. (E.g., I sometimes hit C-c C-a when I > intend to hit C-c a and vice versa.) > >> >> In the agenda >> ------------- >> a archive with org-archive-default-command >> C-c C-a same as a >> C-c C-x a org-toggle-archive-tag >> C-c C-x A org-archive-to-archive-sibling >> C-c C-x C-s org-archive-subtree ($ remains valid as well) > > Again, I would prefer that C-c C-a remain bound to org-attach. > > I currently unbind "a" (org-toggle-archive-tag) in the agenda. In the > past, items often mysteriously disappeared from my agenda view. I > discovered the cause: I was occasionally hitting "a" by accident. > > I agree with Peter that commands with relatively destructive > consequences (such as archiving) should not be bound to a single key. > One wouldn't want to miss an appointment because one accidentally hits > "a" in the agenda. :) These are convincing arguments from you all, so I will leave things as they are, except that I will make "a" in the agenda prompt for [y]es and then do the archiving, using the default archiving command. So archiving from the agenda will then be `a y'. - Carsten > > Thanks for giving us the chance to provide feedback on these proposed > changes. Well, I just learned again how important this is. Thanks for chiming in > > - Matt > >> >> >> I am wondering how much resistance such a change would create. >> >> Comments? >> >> - Carsten - Carsten ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 21+ messages in thread
* Re: Re: Proposed key binding changes: archiving and attachments 2009-10-30 13:33 ` Carsten Dominik @ 2009-11-06 13:40 ` Friedrich Delgado Friedrichs 2009-11-06 15:42 ` Carsten Dominik 0 siblings, 1 reply; 21+ messages in thread From: Friedrich Delgado Friedrichs @ 2009-11-06 13:40 UTC (permalink / raw) To: emacs-orgmode Now that I've hit the update, I've noticed two things: C-c C-x C-a unexpectedly moved a tree to an archive file. Seems I didn't really pay a lot attention to the discussion, so I simply set org-archive-default-command to my preferred value org-toggle-archive-tag. Now in the agenda 'a' asked for confirmation, which is as discussed, but I'm not really happy with this, because I had to remap "a" in org-agenda-keymap (and then I learned that it's different from org-agenda-mode-map, which I didn't know) to org-agenda-archive-default. If someone upgrades to the next release of org-mode, wouldn't it offer a smoother migration path to: - set org-archive-default-command to something that asks for confirmation and reminds the user that he can set it to another value, to get rid of the question - and then use this command for both C-c C-x C-a in files and 'a' in the agenda? That way the user gets reminded before he breaks something, but only has to customise things once. Just an idea. (Sorry for the long lines, I'm writing this in vi, because emacs on homebox isn't running... long story.) Carsten Dominik schrieb: > These are convincing arguments from you all, so I will leave things > as they > are, except that I will make "a" in the agenda prompt for [y]es and > then do the archiving, using the default archiving command. So > archiving from the agenda will then be `a y'. -- Friedrich Delgado Friedrichs <friedel@nomaden.org> TauPan on Ircnet and Freenode ;) ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 21+ messages in thread
* Re: Re: Proposed key binding changes: archiving and attachments 2009-11-06 13:40 ` Friedrich Delgado Friedrichs @ 2009-11-06 15:42 ` Carsten Dominik 2009-11-06 15:56 ` Carsten Dominik 0 siblings, 1 reply; 21+ messages in thread From: Carsten Dominik @ 2009-11-06 15:42 UTC (permalink / raw) To: friedel; +Cc: emacs-orgmode On Nov 6, 2009, at 2:40 PM, Friedrich Delgado Friedrichs wrote: > Now that I've hit the update, I've noticed two things: > > C-c C-x C-a unexpectedly moved a tree to an archive file. Seems I > didn't really pay a lot attention to the discussion, so I simply set > org-archive-default-command to my preferred value org-toggle-archive- > tag. > > Now in the agenda 'a' asked for confirmation, which is as discussed, > but I'm not really happy with this, because I had to remap "a" in > org-agenda-keymap (and then I learned that it's different from org- > agenda-mode-map, which I didn't know) to org-agenda-archive-default. > > If someone upgrades to the next release of org-mode, wouldn't it > offer a smoother migration path to: > > - set org-archive-default-command to something that asks for > confirmation and reminds the user that he can set it to another > value, to get rid of the question > - and then use this command for both C-c C-x C-a in files and 'a' in > the agenda? > > That way the user gets reminded before he breaks something, but only > has to customise things once. > > Just an idea. That is an idea, but with the fast update schedule of Org, this would quickly lead to a big mess in prompts and settings to be made, so I do not think this is practical. The issue with org-agenda-keymap and org-agenda-mode-map has to do with the mouse - maybe this is not really necessary - I made this when I did not really understand keymaps very well, a looong time ago. I'll take another look. - Carsten > > (Sorry for the long lines, I'm writing this in vi, because emacs on > homebox isn't running... long story.) > > Carsten Dominik schrieb: >> These are convincing arguments from you all, so I will leave things >> as they >> are, except that I will make "a" in the agenda prompt for [y]es and >> then do the archiving, using the default archiving command. So >> archiving from the agenda will then be `a y'. > -- > Friedrich Delgado Friedrichs <friedel@nomaden.org> > TauPan on Ircnet and Freenode ;) > > > _______________________________________________ > Emacs-orgmode mailing list > Remember: use `Reply All' to send replies to the list. > Emacs-orgmode@gnu.org > http://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/emacs-orgmode - Carsten ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 21+ messages in thread
* Re: Re: Proposed key binding changes: archiving and attachments 2009-11-06 15:42 ` Carsten Dominik @ 2009-11-06 15:56 ` Carsten Dominik 2009-11-07 1:11 ` Daniel Martins 0 siblings, 1 reply; 21+ messages in thread From: Carsten Dominik @ 2009-11-06 15:56 UTC (permalink / raw) To: Carsten Dominik; +Cc: emacs-orgmode On Nov 6, 2009, at 4:42 PM, Carsten Dominik wrote: > > On Nov 6, 2009, at 2:40 PM, Friedrich Delgado Friedrichs wrote: > >> Now that I've hit the update, I've noticed two things: >> >> C-c C-x C-a unexpectedly moved a tree to an archive file. Seems I >> didn't really pay a lot attention to the discussion, so I simply >> set org-archive-default-command to my preferred value org-toggle- >> archive-tag. >> >> Now in the agenda 'a' asked for confirmation, which is as >> discussed, but I'm not really happy with this, because I had to >> remap "a" in org-agenda-keymap (and then I learned that it's >> different from org-agenda-mode-map, which I didn't know) to org- >> agenda-archive-default. >> >> If someone upgrades to the next release of org-mode, wouldn't it >> offer a smoother migration path to: >> >> - set org-archive-default-command to something that asks for >> confirmation and reminds the user that he can set it to another >> value, to get rid of the question >> - and then use this command for both C-c C-x C-a in files and 'a' >> in the agenda? >> >> That way the user gets reminded before he breaks something, but >> only has to customise things once. >> >> Just an idea. > > That is an idea, but with the fast update schedule of Org, this would > quickly lead to a big mess in prompts and settings to be made, so I > do not think this is practical. > > The issue with org-agenda-keymap and org-agenda-mode-map has to > do with the mouse - maybe this is not really necessary - I made this > when I did not really understand keymaps very well, a looong time > ago. I'll take another look. I think I can get rid of this variable, and I just did, so now there is only org-agenda-mode-map (org-agenda-keymap remains as an alias, so that bindings in this map will still work.) I am pushing it out, we will see if it breaks something. But I do not expect problems. - Carsten > > - Carsten > >> >> (Sorry for the long lines, I'm writing this in vi, because emacs on >> homebox isn't running... long story.) >> >> Carsten Dominik schrieb: >>> These are convincing arguments from you all, so I will leave things >>> as they >>> are, except that I will make "a" in the agenda prompt for [y]es and >>> then do the archiving, using the default archiving command. So >>> archiving from the agenda will then be `a y'. >> -- >> Friedrich Delgado Friedrichs <friedel@nomaden.org> >> TauPan on Ircnet and Freenode ;) >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Emacs-orgmode mailing list >> Remember: use `Reply All' to send replies to the list. >> Emacs-orgmode@gnu.org >> http://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/emacs-orgmode > > - Carsten > > > - Carsten ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 21+ messages in thread
* Re: Re: Proposed key binding changes: archiving and attachments 2009-11-06 15:56 ` Carsten Dominik @ 2009-11-07 1:11 ` Daniel Martins 2009-11-07 6:33 ` Carsten Dominik 0 siblings, 1 reply; 21+ messages in thread From: Daniel Martins @ 2009-11-07 1:11 UTC (permalink / raw) To: Carsten Dominik; +Cc: emacs-orgmode, Carsten Dominik Why not a single A e.g. A org-archive-to-archive-sibling instead of C-c C-x A org-archive-to-archive-sibling I use org-archive-to-archive-sibling alot to diminish my organizer.org and a silge and simple key A (or Shift-a) it would be good. Daniel 2009/11/6 Carsten Dominik <dominik@uva.nl>: > > On Nov 6, 2009, at 4:42 PM, Carsten Dominik wrote: > >> >> On Nov 6, 2009, at 2:40 PM, Friedrich Delgado Friedrichs wrote: >> >>> Now that I've hit the update, I've noticed two things: >>> >>> C-c C-x C-a unexpectedly moved a tree to an archive file. Seems I didn't >>> really pay a lot attention to the discussion, so I simply set >>> org-archive-default-command to my preferred value org-toggle-archive-tag. >>> >>> Now in the agenda 'a' asked for confirmation, which is as discussed, but >>> I'm not really happy with this, because I had to remap "a" in >>> org-agenda-keymap (and then I learned that it's different from >>> org-agenda-mode-map, which I didn't know) to org-agenda-archive-default. >>> >>> If someone upgrades to the next release of org-mode, wouldn't it offer a >>> smoother migration path to: >>> >>> - set org-archive-default-command to something that asks for confirmation >>> and reminds the user that he can set it to another value, to get rid of the >>> question >>> - and then use this command for both C-c C-x C-a in files and 'a' in the >>> agenda? >>> >>> That way the user gets reminded before he breaks something, but only has >>> to customise things once. >>> >>> Just an idea. >> >> That is an idea, but with the fast update schedule of Org, this would >> quickly lead to a big mess in prompts and settings to be made, so I >> do not think this is practical. >> >> The issue with org-agenda-keymap and org-agenda-mode-map has to >> do with the mouse - maybe this is not really necessary - I made this when >> I did not really understand keymaps very well, a looong time ago. I'll take >> another look. > > I think I can get rid of this variable, and I just did, so now there is only > org-agenda-mode-map (org-agenda-keymap remains as an alias, so that bindings > in this map will still work.) > > I am pushing it out, we will see if it breaks something. But I do not > expect problems. > > - Carsten > >> >> - Carsten >> >>> >>> (Sorry for the long lines, I'm writing this in vi, because emacs on >>> homebox isn't running... long story.) >>> >>> Carsten Dominik schrieb: >>>> >>>> These are convincing arguments from you all, so I will leave things >>>> as they >>>> are, except that I will make "a" in the agenda prompt for [y]es and >>>> then do the archiving, using the default archiving command. So >>>> archiving from the agenda will then be `a y'. >>> >>> -- >>> Friedrich Delgado Friedrichs <friedel@nomaden.org> >>> TauPan on Ircnet and Freenode ;) >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Emacs-orgmode mailing list >>> Remember: use `Reply All' to send replies to the list. >>> Emacs-orgmode@gnu.org >>> http://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/emacs-orgmode >> >> - Carsten >> >> >> > > - Carsten > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > Emacs-orgmode mailing list > Remember: use `Reply All' to send replies to the list. > Emacs-orgmode@gnu.org > http://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/emacs-orgmode > ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 21+ messages in thread
* Re: Re: Proposed key binding changes: archiving and attachments 2009-11-07 1:11 ` Daniel Martins @ 2009-11-07 6:33 ` Carsten Dominik 2009-11-07 7:11 ` David Bremner 2009-11-08 18:24 ` Paul Mead 0 siblings, 2 replies; 21+ messages in thread From: Carsten Dominik @ 2009-11-07 6:33 UTC (permalink / raw) To: Daniel Martins; +Cc: emacs-orgmode On Nov 7, 2009, at 2:11 AM, Daniel Martins wrote: > Why not a single A e.g. > > A org-archive-to-archive-sibling > > instead of > C-c C-x A org-archive-to-archive-sibling > > > I use org-archive-to-archive-sibling > alot to diminish my organizer.org and a silge and simple key A (or > Shift-a) it would be good. If this is your default archiving method, the idea would be that you set (setq org-archive-default-command 'org-archive-to-archive-sibling) and then use `a y' to do the archiving. I actually think that few people use archiving to sibling. Am I wrong about this? The reason why I don't have single letter commands for archiving in the agenda without confirmation is that archiving i potentially destructive. - Carsten > > Daniel > > > 2009/11/6 Carsten Dominik <dominik@uva.nl>: >> >> On Nov 6, 2009, at 4:42 PM, Carsten Dominik wrote: >> >>> >>> On Nov 6, 2009, at 2:40 PM, Friedrich Delgado Friedrichs wrote: >>> >>>> Now that I've hit the update, I've noticed two things: >>>> >>>> C-c C-x C-a unexpectedly moved a tree to an archive file. Seems I >>>> didn't >>>> really pay a lot attention to the discussion, so I simply set >>>> org-archive-default-command to my preferred value org-toggle- >>>> archive-tag. >>>> >>>> Now in the agenda 'a' asked for confirmation, which is as >>>> discussed, but >>>> I'm not really happy with this, because I had to remap "a" in >>>> org-agenda-keymap (and then I learned that it's different from >>>> org-agenda-mode-map, which I didn't know) to org-agenda-archive- >>>> default. >>>> >>>> If someone upgrades to the next release of org-mode, wouldn't it >>>> offer a >>>> smoother migration path to: >>>> >>>> - set org-archive-default-command to something that asks for >>>> confirmation >>>> and reminds the user that he can set it to another value, to get >>>> rid of the >>>> question >>>> - and then use this command for both C-c C-x C-a in files and 'a' >>>> in the >>>> agenda? >>>> >>>> That way the user gets reminded before he breaks something, but >>>> only has >>>> to customise things once. >>>> >>>> Just an idea. >>> >>> That is an idea, but with the fast update schedule of Org, this >>> would >>> quickly lead to a big mess in prompts and settings to be made, so I >>> do not think this is practical. >>> >>> The issue with org-agenda-keymap and org-agenda-mode-map has to >>> do with the mouse - maybe this is not really necessary - I made >>> this when >>> I did not really understand keymaps very well, a looong time ago. >>> I'll take >>> another look. >> >> I think I can get rid of this variable, and I just did, so now >> there is only >> org-agenda-mode-map (org-agenda-keymap remains as an alias, so that >> bindings >> in this map will still work.) >> >> I am pushing it out, we will see if it breaks something. But I do >> not >> expect problems. >> >> - Carsten >> >>> >>> - Carsten >>> >>>> >>>> (Sorry for the long lines, I'm writing this in vi, because emacs on >>>> homebox isn't running... long story.) >>>> >>>> Carsten Dominik schrieb: >>>>> >>>>> These are convincing arguments from you all, so I will leave >>>>> things >>>>> as they >>>>> are, except that I will make "a" in the agenda prompt for [y]es >>>>> and >>>>> then do the archiving, using the default archiving command. So >>>>> archiving from the agenda will then be `a y'. >>>> >>>> -- >>>> Friedrich Delgado Friedrichs <friedel@nomaden.org> >>>> TauPan on Ircnet and Freenode ;) >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> Emacs-orgmode mailing list >>>> Remember: use `Reply All' to send replies to the list. >>>> Emacs-orgmode@gnu.org >>>> http://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/emacs-orgmode >>> >>> - Carsten >>> >>> >>> >> >> - Carsten >> >> >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Emacs-orgmode mailing list >> Remember: use `Reply All' to send replies to the list. >> Emacs-orgmode@gnu.org >> http://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/emacs-orgmode >> - Carsten ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 21+ messages in thread
* Re: Re: Proposed key binding changes: archiving and attachments 2009-11-07 6:33 ` Carsten Dominik @ 2009-11-07 7:11 ` David Bremner 2009-11-07 20:50 ` Daniel Martins 2009-11-08 18:24 ` Paul Mead 1 sibling, 1 reply; 21+ messages in thread From: David Bremner @ 2009-11-07 7:11 UTC (permalink / raw) To: Carsten Dominik; +Cc: emacs-orgmode At Sat, 7 Nov 2009 07:33:30 +0100, Carsten Dominik wrote: > I actually think that few people use archiving to sibling. Am I > wrong about this? For what it is worth, I have started to use archive to sibling quite a lot in the last month or so. I also like to tidy up my org files, but I need to keep the structure for monthly and tri-monthly clock tables. d ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 21+ messages in thread
* Re: Re: Proposed key binding changes: archiving and attachments 2009-11-07 7:11 ` David Bremner @ 2009-11-07 20:50 ` Daniel Martins 0 siblings, 0 replies; 21+ messages in thread From: Daniel Martins @ 2009-11-07 20:50 UTC (permalink / raw) To: David Bremner; +Cc: Carsten Dominik, emacs-orgmode I use both short topic in a still ongoing section I use simple archive But when I finish a section or it is something I will not use for a while I use archive to sibling. Therefore setting (setq org-archive-default-command 'org-archive-to-archive-sibling) to use the "a" string is not interesting. However , I aggree that archiving should have a confirmation y-or-n Daniel 2009/11/7 David Bremner <bremner@unb.ca>: > At Sat, 7 Nov 2009 07:33:30 +0100, > Carsten Dominik wrote: > >> I actually think that few people use archiving to sibling. Am I >> wrong about this? > > For what it is worth, I have started to use archive to sibling quite a > lot in the last month or so. I also like to tidy up my org files, but > I need to keep the structure for monthly and tri-monthly clock tables. > > d > > > > _______________________________________________ > Emacs-orgmode mailing list > Remember: use `Reply All' to send replies to the list. > Emacs-orgmode@gnu.org > http://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/emacs-orgmode > ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 21+ messages in thread
* Re: Proposed key binding changes: archiving and attachments 2009-11-07 6:33 ` Carsten Dominik 2009-11-07 7:11 ` David Bremner @ 2009-11-08 18:24 ` Paul Mead 2009-11-09 10:46 ` Friedrich Delgado Friedrichs 2009-11-09 21:07 ` Carsten Dominik 1 sibling, 2 replies; 21+ messages in thread From: Paul Mead @ 2009-11-08 18:24 UTC (permalink / raw) To: Carsten Dominik; +Cc: emacs-orgmode Carsten Dominik <dominik@uva.nl> writes: > I actually think that few people use archiving to sibling. Am I wrong about > this? I use archiving to sibling for sub-headings in projects that are still current, to tidy things up, then archive the whole project subtree to the archive file when it's finished. I'd prefer to have archive to sibling as the default option with the fewest keystrokes. (FWIW!) Paul ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 21+ messages in thread
* Re: Re: Proposed key binding changes: archiving and attachments 2009-11-08 18:24 ` Paul Mead @ 2009-11-09 10:46 ` Friedrich Delgado Friedrichs 2009-11-09 21:07 ` Carsten Dominik 1 sibling, 0 replies; 21+ messages in thread From: Friedrich Delgado Friedrichs @ 2009-11-09 10:46 UTC (permalink / raw) To: emacs-orgmode Hm... Paul Mead schrieb: > Carsten Dominik <dominik@uva.nl> writes: > > I actually think that few people use archiving to sibling. Am I wrong about > > this? I've never used archiving to sibling on purpose. After using it accidentaly once, I was a bit annoyed at having to clean up the structure of my project. > I use archiving to sibling for sub-headings in projects that are still > current, to tidy things up, then archive the whole project subtree to > the archive file when it's finished. I'd prefer to have archive to > sibling as the default option with the fewest keystrokes. ---Zitatende--- Hm, I use the archive tag for exactly that purpose. I prefer to see the original structure in the tree, but with the dead branches (i.e. already resolved subprojects). But don't get me wrong, I don't want to proselytise or something. It's a good thing, that org offers so many ways of organising our "stuff". ;) -- Friedrich Delgado Friedrichs <friedel@nomaden.org> TauPan on Ircnet and Freenode ;) ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 21+ messages in thread
* Re: Proposed key binding changes: archiving and attachments 2009-11-08 18:24 ` Paul Mead 2009-11-09 10:46 ` Friedrich Delgado Friedrichs @ 2009-11-09 21:07 ` Carsten Dominik 1 sibling, 0 replies; 21+ messages in thread From: Carsten Dominik @ 2009-11-09 21:07 UTC (permalink / raw) To: Paul Mead; +Cc: emacs-orgmode On Nov 8, 2009, at 7:24 PM, Paul Mead wrote: > Carsten Dominik <dominik@uva.nl> writes: > >> I actually think that few people use archiving to sibling. Am I >> wrong about >> this? > > I use archiving to sibling for sub-headings in projects that are still > current, to tidy things up, then archive the whole project subtree to > the archive file when it's finished. I'd prefer to have archive to > sibling as the default option with the fewest keystrokes. Well, you can configure it now like this. - Carsten ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 21+ messages in thread
* Re: Proposed key binding changes: archiving and attachments 2009-10-30 11:36 ` Matt Lundin 2009-10-30 13:33 ` Carsten Dominik @ 2009-10-30 13:58 ` Detlef Steuer 1 sibling, 0 replies; 21+ messages in thread From: Detlef Steuer @ 2009-10-30 13:58 UTC (permalink / raw) To: emacs-orgmode On Fri, 30 Oct 2009 07:36:43 -0400 Matt Lundin <mdl@imapmail.org> wrote: > My chief concern with mapping archiving to C-c C-a is that it is too > close to the conventional keybinding for org-agenda (C-c a). With the > proposed keybindings, I fear it might be too easy to introduce drastic > changes in a file accidentally. (E.g., I sometimes hit C-c C-a when I > intend to hit C-c a and vice versa.) That was my fear, too. If you don't use the archive on a regular basis you'll be very surprised, when your entry vanishes ... :-) It is _very_ close to C-c a. Detlef ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 21+ messages in thread
* Re: Proposed key binding changes: archiving and attachments 2009-10-30 6:54 Proposed key binding changes: archiving and attachments Carsten Dominik 2009-10-30 9:54 ` Friedrich Delgado Friedrichs 2009-10-30 11:36 ` Matt Lundin @ 2009-10-30 17:54 ` Leo 2 siblings, 0 replies; 21+ messages in thread From: Leo @ 2009-10-30 17:54 UTC (permalink / raw) To: Carsten Dominik; +Cc: emacs-orgmode list On 2009-10-30 06:54 +0000, Carsten Dominik wrote: > I would like to change some key bindings related to archiving, and > this change will also affect the access key for attachments. > > The main reason is that I think there should be a single default key > for archiving, and that the user sets a variable to decide what the > default archiving method should be. I would like this key to be `C-c > C-a' which is why the org-attach key would have to move as well. I think one of these days we could take a look at the whole of the key bindings in org mode. It is violating some conventions. For example, 'Alt' usually means something slightly different in actions in both Emacs and other applications on the system: `C-f' -> forward-char `C-M-f' -> forward-sexp On OS X, Cmd + H -> Hide <APP> Cmd + Option(Alt) + H -> Hide others But in org, it seems the Shift key is taking this role: M-RET M-S-RET ...... And usually Shift is not a modifier on terminals so another set of keys are provided. Another problem is the C-c C-x prefix. It makes the keys look long. And I always fear I might type C-x C-c instead which exits Emacs. Best wishes, Leo -- Emacs uptime: 38 days, 8 hours, 42 minutes, 15 seconds ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 21+ messages in thread
end of thread, other threads:[~2009-11-09 21:08 UTC | newest] Thread overview: 21+ messages (download: mbox.gz / follow: Atom feed) -- links below jump to the message on this page -- 2009-10-30 6:54 Proposed key binding changes: archiving and attachments Carsten Dominik 2009-10-30 9:54 ` Friedrich Delgado Friedrichs 2009-10-30 10:31 ` Peter Frings 2009-10-30 12:35 ` Bernt Hansen 2009-10-31 9:13 ` Carsten Dominik 2009-10-31 13:23 ` Bernt Hansen 2009-10-31 14:56 ` Matt Lundin 2009-10-30 11:36 ` Matt Lundin 2009-10-30 13:33 ` Carsten Dominik 2009-11-06 13:40 ` Friedrich Delgado Friedrichs 2009-11-06 15:42 ` Carsten Dominik 2009-11-06 15:56 ` Carsten Dominik 2009-11-07 1:11 ` Daniel Martins 2009-11-07 6:33 ` Carsten Dominik 2009-11-07 7:11 ` David Bremner 2009-11-07 20:50 ` Daniel Martins 2009-11-08 18:24 ` Paul Mead 2009-11-09 10:46 ` Friedrich Delgado Friedrichs 2009-11-09 21:07 ` Carsten Dominik 2009-10-30 13:58 ` Detlef Steuer 2009-10-30 17:54 ` Leo
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