Re: Guix Goals: One Hackable Developer Tool To Rule Them All

[jgart <jgart@dismail.de>]

On Sun, 16 Oct 2022 20:50:47 +0200 Liliana Marie Prikler <liliana.prikler@gmail.com> wrote:

> makes your goal a somewhat stupid one if you don't actually specify
> what it has to do on a per-project basis.

hi lilyp,

That's a bit harsh to say that my idea is "stupid" even in light of
your qualifier.

If you read the previous thread you can see some of my proposals on a
per language basis.

There's absolutely no requirement for me to work out the whole solution
just yet on this email thread or to offer per project details. I'm not at
the stage of proposing per-project ideas. I'm just casually brainstorming
with those colleagues who want to. If that's too stressful to do then
anyone is free to opt out of the conversation. There's no need to call it
"stupid". Instead, ask me to expound on it in a friendly way instead if
something is not clear or not yet stated.

> I don't think it'd be that.  Note that you have the full power of
> Guix/Guile at your disposal, so you can encapsulate much of it in
> channels.  Is it a good idea to do so?  Hell, no.    

If Guix channels don't give users enough freedom/hackability/extensibility
to do what they want then maybe that's something that should be looked
into. I would consider it a bug, and a limitation of the system. There
should be enough trust in our community to allow users to hack channels
the way they want and to contribute back to GNU Guix proper if they
so choose.  Restrictions shouldn't be built into the system to prevent
users from doing x, y, z with regards to extending it.  There should
only be trust regarding extensibility. That's what made Guix stand out
to me from the start. If that is not the case going forward then I will
lose hope in Guix and would rather invest my time chasing that dream
elsewhere. The extensibility thesis that Guix subscribes to (atleast
to my understanding) involves trust in its users instead of giving them
a limiting DSL and telling them what they are and are not allowed to do
with it.

I came to GNU Guix because of this freedom of extensibility and these
ideals that I perceived in channels and in the system as a whole.
Contributing back to upstream not a limiting feature that is "designed in"
to Guix in order to enforce it. I don't want to be limited that way. This
trust has to exist if it wants to cooperate with the Schemer spirit.

> Refusing to use the tools your colleagues are using to instead hack on your own is not a
> recipe for success.

I'm currently using my colleagues tools extensively. Not sure what you
mean here...