unofficial mirror of guile-devel@gnu.org 
 help / color / mirror / Atom feed
From: Mikael Djurfeldt <mikael@djurfeldt.com>
To: guile-devel <guile-devel@gnu.org>
Subject: FOSDEM 2019
Date: Sun, 3 Feb 2019 22:34:55 +0100	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <CAA2Xvw+5X=Tt08m3aOmMzerPtO+dVDjYXDGnxGLOhx8dAkQxMA@mail.gmail.com> (raw)

[-- Attachment #1: Type: text/plain, Size: 2586 bytes --]

It was a great experience and joy for me to meet some of you at FOSDEM
2019. Thank you all!

Now a piece of advice.

Everyone who works with Guile knows that it's crap and look with envy at
projects like Chez and Racket, right? Jim Blandy thinks that GNU should use
Python as its scripting language. Chris Webber (probably rightly) thinks
"look how much you can accomplish with Racket so quickly".

I've been there also. I have to confess that I have now and again regarded
Guile as crap since perhaps 1995 and there has been multiple occasions
where I have thought that basing the community effort on some other scheme
would make much more sense, and I have also always looked with envy on Chez
and mzscheme/Racket.

Yet, it is *amazing* to me how much progress Guile has made since I left.
I, for example, *love* the new language and compiler infrastructure.

But note now that Racket looks with envy on Chez and intends to base Racket
on Chez while Andy Wingo thinks that he can beat Chez performance.

My advice is this:

Idiots go around thinking that their own code is the best thing around.
Sensible people have a natural, and actually productive, tendency to be
critical about their own work. That is all good, unless it hurts the sense
of meaning and joy in your work.

Remember now first that we are all irrational creatures. We maybe *think*
sometimes that we are rational, because what we think looks rational in our
view. The problem is that the view is usually very limited, with, for
example, a limited set of presumptions.

For example: Guile is a piece of software, right? Wrong! It is a plant,
growing over time. Now, if we look over the fence into the other garden,
the plants there look much greener. But what will determine the ultimate
fate is not only the shape of it in the present moment, but also the genes
it carries, the quality of the soil, the amount of sunlight and the skills
of its gard[i]ners. We could have quit before we got GOOPS, or before we
got the native threading, or before the compiler tower, without which there
would be no chance to beat Chez.

If you look at one combination of some Guile features:

* easy embedding in applications
* support for multiple languages
* the compiler tower
* OO system with polymorphic dispatch and metaobject protocol
* nice, friendly and open community

I think it is pretty strong and impressive, and I wouldn't like to live
without it. It's especially important to look at Guile as a good breeding
ground for new amazing work.

That said, we should steal and collaborate all we can!

All the best,
Mikael

[-- Attachment #2: Type: text/html, Size: 3169 bytes --]

             reply	other threads:[~2019-02-03 21:34 UTC|newest]

Thread overview: 32+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
2019-02-03 21:34 Mikael Djurfeldt [this message]
2019-02-03 23:13 ` FOSDEM 2019 Arne Babenhauserheide
2019-02-04  5:21   ` Nala Ginrut
2019-02-05 21:25   ` Christopher Lemmer Webber
2019-02-06 13:46     ` Alex Sassmannshausen
2019-02-06 15:22       ` Amirouche Boubekki
2019-02-06 15:33         ` Amirouche Boubekki
2019-02-06 15:42         ` Alex Sassmannshausen
2019-02-06 21:03           ` Ricardo Wurmus
2019-02-06 22:09             ` Alex Sassmannshausen
2019-02-26  8:57             ` swedebugia
2019-02-06 20:40         ` Arne Babenhauserheide
2019-02-05 21:26   ` Christopher Lemmer Webber
2019-02-04 13:06 ` Amirouche Boubekki
2019-02-04 14:44 ` Ludovic Courtès
2019-02-04 18:01   ` Jan Nieuwenhuizen
2019-02-05 11:09   ` Amirouche Boubekki
2019-02-05 16:58     ` Ludovic Courtès
2019-02-06  0:31       ` Nala Ginrut
2019-02-06 12:59         ` Ludovic Courtès
2019-02-06 19:09           ` Amirouche Boubekki
2019-02-06  0:37       ` Matt Wette
2019-02-06  0:56         ` Nala Ginrut
2019-02-06  1:40       ` Amirouche Boubekki
2019-02-05  2:30 ` Matt Wette
  -- strict thread matches above, loose matches on Subject: below --
2018-08-21 13:33 Manolis Ragkousis
2018-08-21 17:57 ` Ricardo Wurmus
2018-08-22 16:27   ` Andy Wingo
2018-08-22  2:33 ` Mike Gran
2018-08-23  0:08 ` Mike Gran
2018-08-24 12:23 ` Christopher Lemmer Webber
2018-08-29 21:08   ` Ludovic Courtès

Reply instructions:

You may reply publicly to this message via plain-text email
using any one of the following methods:

* Save the following mbox file, import it into your mail client,
  and reply-to-all from there: mbox

  Avoid top-posting and favor interleaved quoting:
  https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Posting_style#Interleaved_style

  List information: https://www.gnu.org/software/guile/

* Reply using the --to, --cc, and --in-reply-to
  switches of git-send-email(1):

  git send-email \
    --in-reply-to='CAA2Xvw+5X=Tt08m3aOmMzerPtO+dVDjYXDGnxGLOhx8dAkQxMA@mail.gmail.com' \
    --to=mikael@djurfeldt.com \
    --cc=guile-devel@gnu.org \
    /path/to/YOUR_REPLY

  https://kernel.org/pub/software/scm/git/docs/git-send-email.html

* If your mail client supports setting the In-Reply-To header
  via mailto: links, try the mailto: link
Be sure your reply has a Subject: header at the top and a blank line before the message body.
This is a public inbox, see mirroring instructions
for how to clone and mirror all data and code used for this inbox;
as well as URLs for read-only IMAP folder(s) and NNTP newsgroup(s).