From: Philip Kaludercic <philipk@posteo.net>
To: Lynn Winebarger <owinebar@gmail.com>
Cc: Yuan Fu <casouri@gmail.com>, emacs-devel <emacs-devel@gnu.org>
Subject: Re: Unboxed package manager
Date: Mon, 20 Mar 2023 16:53:24 +0000 [thread overview]
Message-ID: <87ilev9xff.fsf@posteo.net> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <CAM=F=bDgmSUu+G3nMfZzE53R7sn544A6Kbn8kR++qjqC1ap+xw@mail.gmail.com> (Lynn Winebarger's message of "Mon, 20 Mar 2023 12:12:34 -0400")
Lynn Winebarger <owinebar@gmail.com> writes:
> On Mon, Mar 20, 2023, 11:25 AM Philip Kaludercic <philipk@posteo.net> wrote:
>
>> Lynn Winebarger <owinebar@gmail.com> writes:
>>
>> > On Mon, Mar 20, 2023, 4:55 AM Lynn Winebarger <owinebar@gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>> >
>> >> On Mon, Mar 20, 2023, 2:31 AM Yuan Fu <casouri@gmail.com> wrote:
>> >>
>> >>> > On Mar 19, 2023, at 6:18 PM, Lynn Winebarger <owinebar@gmail.com>
>> >>> wrote:
>> >>> >
>> >>> > I've
>> >>> > done this manually on various systems I use with a significant
>> >>> > improvement in startup performance.
>> >>>
>> >>> It'll be interesting to see the numbers on the improvement. How much
>> does
>> >>> it improve startup time if there is x packages and y are loaded at
>> startup
>> >>> time?
>> >>
>> >> Good question. The systems I've done this manually on are one-off builds
>> >> of 28.x on sandboxed systems where the system emacs is 24.3. So, I
>> didn't
>> >> have to worry about managing package updates with any frequency.
>> >
>> > I don't have any hard measurements, but my recollection is that
>> installing
>> > ~1200 packages on those systems and "loading the world" took something
>> like
>> > 5 minutes, while a similar set of packages installed in a unified
>> directory
>> > takes about 1.5 minutes.
>>
>> I just skimmed through the initial message, and when reading this my
>> initial thought is does the the advantage justify effort/complexity,
>> considering that most users have an order of magnitude fewer packages
>> installed (of which a few are installed using package-vc which IIUC
>> would explicitly not want to make use of this feature).
>>
>
> I have no idea. There's a bit of a chicken and egg problem when installing
> packages is slow (even with a local mirror of the elpas) and having a lot
> of packages loaded slows down startup.
What is the chicken and the egg in this situation?
> I think I'm going to hack something together starting with advice on the
> existing package management and taking some inspiration from the design of
> Jonas Bernoulli's epkg and emir packages for tracking installed packages
> and component files in a SQLite database.
I'd be interested to see how this looks like. As I said, I am sceptical
of the need to optimise these extreme cases for everyone, but perhaps we
can also open package.el to be extended externally in ways that your
work could plug into.
> Lynn
(Also, could you leave an empty line between paragraphs in your
messages? It would make it easier to read them)
--
Philip Kaludercic
next prev parent reply other threads:[~2023-03-20 16:53 UTC|newest]
Thread overview: 36+ messages / expand[flat|nested] mbox.gz Atom feed top
2023-03-20 1:18 Unboxed package manager Lynn Winebarger
2023-03-20 6:30 ` Yuan Fu
2023-03-20 8:55 ` Lynn Winebarger
2023-03-20 9:09 ` Lynn Winebarger
2023-03-20 15:25 ` Philip Kaludercic
2023-03-20 16:12 ` Lynn Winebarger
2023-03-20 16:53 ` Philip Kaludercic [this message]
2023-03-20 18:11 ` Jonas Bernoulli
2023-03-21 1:40 ` Lynn Winebarger
2023-03-22 11:17 ` Jonas Bernoulli
2023-03-22 14:31 ` Lynn Winebarger
2023-03-22 23:39 ` Lynn Winebarger
2023-03-21 19:06 ` Augusto Stoffel
2023-03-21 19:10 ` Philip Kaludercic
2023-03-21 19:57 ` Augusto Stoffel
2023-03-21 20:06 ` Philip Kaludercic
2023-03-21 0:23 ` Gregory Heytings
2023-03-21 0:25 ` Gregory Heytings
2023-03-21 1:55 ` Lynn Winebarger
2023-03-21 10:36 ` Lynn Winebarger
2023-03-21 10:52 ` Gregory Heytings
2023-03-21 13:23 ` Eli Zaretskii
2023-03-21 13:33 ` Gregory Heytings
2023-03-21 14:13 ` Eli Zaretskii
2023-03-21 14:20 ` Gregory Heytings
2023-03-21 17:29 ` Eli Zaretskii
2023-03-22 0:48 ` Lynn Winebarger
2023-03-22 14:42 ` Eli Zaretskii
2023-03-22 22:22 ` Lynn Winebarger
2023-03-23 6:46 ` Eli Zaretskii
2023-03-23 13:30 ` Lynn Winebarger
2023-03-24 17:54 ` chad
2023-03-26 1:51 ` Lynn Winebarger
2023-03-23 1:44 ` David Masterson
2023-03-23 7:02 ` Eli Zaretskii
2023-03-22 7:29 ` tomas
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