bug#44059: 28.0.50; Trash files cannot be deleted properly if delete-by-moving-to-trash is set

bug#44059: 28.0.50; Trash files cannot be deleted properly if delete-by-moving-to-trash is set

[Jean Louis]

If I set:

trash-directory and delete-by-moving-to-trash

then I cannot delete files in Trash, you can see what is happening,
files may get a backup in Trash directory, but they do not get deleted,
I need to invoke shell command or disable delete-by-moving-to-trash

Best would be when first file is placed into Trash, that Emacs places
there some directory local variable that would disable
delete-by-moving-to-trash when deleting in that directory


In GNU Emacs 28.0.50 (build 18, x86_64-pc-linux-gnu, GTK+ Version 3.22.12, cairo version 1.14.8)
 of 2020-10-14 built on protected.rcdrun.com
Repository revision: 423439b38067c4a428310edab24fba7da082027c
Repository branch: master
Windowing system distributor 'The X.Org Foundation', version 11.0.11907000
System Description: Hyperbola GNU/Linux-libre

Configured using:
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Configured features:
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INOTIFY ACL GNUTLS LIBXML2 FREETYPE HARFBUZZ M17N_FLT LIBOTF ZLIB
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Important settings:
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  value of $LANG: de_DE.UTF-8
  value of $XMODIFIERS: @im=exwm-xim
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Major mode: Lisp Interaction

Minor modes in effect:
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Load-path shadows:
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Memory information:
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 (buffers 992 20))

-- 
Thanks,
Jean Louis

bug#44059: Acknowledgement (28.0.50; Trash files cannot be deleted properly if delete-by-moving-to-trash is set)

[Jean Louis]

Maybe is better to set dir-locals-set-class-variables for the Trash
directory, so that delete-by-moving-to-trash is unset there, if that
is possible.

   Another method of specifying directory-local variables is to define a
group of variables/value pairs in a “directory class”, using the
‘dir-locals-set-class-variables’ function; then, tell Emacs which
directories correspond to the class by using the
‘dir-locals-set-directory-class’ function.  These function calls
normally go in your initialization file (*note Init File::).  This
method is useful when you can’t put ‘.dir-locals.el’ in a directory for
some reason.  For example, you could apply settings to an unwritable
directory this way:

bug#44059: 28.0.50; Trash files cannot be deleted properly if delete-by-moving-to-trash is set

[Lars Ingebrigtsen]

Jean Louis <bugs@gnu.support> writes:

> then I cannot delete files in Trash, you can see what is happening,
> files may get a backup in Trash directory, but they do not get deleted,
> I need to invoke shell command or disable delete-by-moving-to-trash

I'm not sure whether that's a malfeature or not -- if you've told Emacs
that everything you delete should go to the trash can, then even
deleting things in the trash can should perhaps go there?

Perhaps a new value to delete-by-moving-to-trash that would mean "delete
if we're trying to delete in the trash can"?

And... there doesn't seem to be any commands in Emacs for emptying the
trash can?  Shouldn't there be?

-- 
(domestic pets only, the antidote for overdose, milk.)
   bloggy blog: http://lars.ingebrigtsen.no

bug#44059: 28.0.50; Trash files cannot be deleted properly if delete-by-moving-to-trash is set

[Jean Louis]

* Lars Ingebrigtsen <larsi@gnus.org> [2020-10-19 12:55]:
> Jean Louis <bugs@gnu.support> writes:
> 
> > then I cannot delete files in Trash, you can see what is happening,
> > files may get a backup in Trash directory, but they do not get deleted,
> > I need to invoke shell command or disable delete-by-moving-to-trash
> 
> I'm not sure whether that's a malfeature or not -- if you've told Emacs
> that everything you delete should go to the trash can, then even
> deleting things in the trash can should perhaps go there?
> 
> Perhaps a new value to delete-by-moving-to-trash that would mean "delete
> if we're trying to delete in the trash can"?
> 
> And... there doesn't seem to be any commands in Emacs for emptying the
> trash can?  Shouldn't there be?

I think that is related to Dired and maybe some functions without
Dired.

I have solved the problem by adding in ~/tmp/Trash/.dir-locals.el

;;; Directory Local Variables
;;; For more information see (info "(emacs) Directory Variables")

((dired-mode . ((delete-by-moving-to-trash . nil))))

In my opinion, if the delete-by-moving-to-trash is true, that file
should be made there read-only and user should be informed in Info
manual or in the setting of that variable including setting of
variable for trash location.

Practical error case is that I was recording screen and deleting
various videos, screen recording was taking so much space, I lost all
space on hard disk. And I could not delete things inside of the
Trash. It was emergency already to do something, my solution was
above.

bug#44059: 28.0.50; Trash files cannot be deleted properly if delete-by-moving-to-trash is set

[Eli Zaretskii]

> From: Lars Ingebrigtsen <larsi@gnus.org>
> Date: Mon, 19 Oct 2020 11:54:30 +0200
> Cc: 44059@debbugs.gnu.org
> 
> And... there doesn't seem to be any commands in Emacs for emptying the
> trash can?  Shouldn't there be?

AFAIU, doing this for freedesktop-style trash isn't trivial.

bug#44059: 28.0.50; Trash files cannot be deleted properly if delete-by-moving-to-trash is set

[Stefan Kangas]

Eli Zaretskii <eliz@gnu.org> writes:

>> And... there doesn't seem to be any commands in Emacs for emptying the
>> trash can?  Shouldn't there be?
>
> AFAIU, doing this for freedesktop-style trash isn't trivial.

Isn't there some external command we could run?  From a quick look at my
system maybe "gio trash --empty"?

bug#44059: 28.0.50; Trash files cannot be deleted properly if delete-by-moving-to-trash is set

[Jean Louis]

* Eli Zaretskii <eliz@gnu.org> [2020-10-19 17:55]:
> > From: Lars Ingebrigtsen <larsi@gnus.org>
> > Date: Mon, 19 Oct 2020 11:54:30 +0200
> > Cc: 44059@debbugs.gnu.org
> > 
> > And... there doesn't seem to be any commands in Emacs for emptying the
> > trash can?  Shouldn't there be?
> 
> AFAIU, doing this for freedesktop-style trash isn't trivial.

Actually it says that Emacs already does that:

Hide Trash Directory: Value Menu Directory: /home/data1/protected/tmp/Trash/
    State : SAVED and set.
   Directory for ‘move-file-to-trash’ to move files and directories to. Hide
   This directory is used only when the function ‘system-move-file-to-trash’
   is not defined.
   Relative paths are interpreted relative to ‘default-directory’.
   If the value is nil, Emacs uses a freedesktop.org-style trashcan.

So if I set the variable: delete-by-moving-to-trash and not set
trash-directory it will use freedeskstop style. I did not verify, I
just assume it.

There is no big problem. If delete-by-moving-to-trash is set then
Tramp says it was trashed, which is confusing.

bug#44059: 28.0.50; Trash files cannot be deleted properly if delete-by-moving-to-trash is set

[Eli Zaretskii]

> Date: Mon, 26 Oct 2020 19:03:22 +0300
> From: Jean Louis <bugs@gnu.support>
> Cc: Lars Ingebrigtsen <larsi@gnus.org>, 44059@debbugs.gnu.org
> 
> * Eli Zaretskii <eliz@gnu.org> [2020-10-19 17:55]:
> > > From: Lars Ingebrigtsen <larsi@gnus.org>
> > > Date: Mon, 19 Oct 2020 11:54:30 +0200
> > > Cc: 44059@debbugs.gnu.org
> > > 
> > > And... there doesn't seem to be any commands in Emacs for emptying the
> > > trash can?  Shouldn't there be?
> > 
> > AFAIU, doing this for freedesktop-style trash isn't trivial.
> 
> Actually it says that Emacs already does that:

It does?

> Hide Trash Directory: Value Menu Directory: /home/data1/protected/tmp/Trash/
>     State : SAVED and set.
>    Directory for ‘move-file-to-trash’ to move files and directories to. Hide
>    This directory is used only when the function ‘system-move-file-to-trash’
>    is not defined.
>    Relative paths are interpreted relative to ‘default-directory’.
>    If the value is nil, Emacs uses a freedesktop.org-style trashcan.
> 
> So if I set the variable: delete-by-moving-to-trash and not set
> trash-directory it will use freedeskstop style.

Look above: we were talking about _emptying_ the trashcan, not about
_using_ it to move deleted files there.

> There is no big problem. If delete-by-moving-to-trash is set then
> Tramp says it was trashed, which is confusing.

And this is yet another, almost unrelated, issue.

Can we please stay focused in each thread on the topic of that thread,
and nothing more?

bug#44059: 28.0.50; Trash files cannot be deleted properly if delete-by-moving-to-trash is set

[Michael Albinus]

Jean Louis <bugs@gnu.support> writes:

> There is no big problem. If delete-by-moving-to-trash is set then
> Tramp says it was trashed, which is confusing.

No. Tramp doesn't say this. This message comes from dired.

Best regards, Michael.

bug#44059: 28.0.50; Trash files cannot be deleted properly if delete-by-moving-to-trash is set

[Jean Louis]

* Eli Zaretskii <eliz@gnu.org> [2020-10-26 22:44]:
> > There is no big problem. If delete-by-moving-to-trash is set then
> > Tramp says it was trashed, which is confusing.
> 
> And this is yet another, almost unrelated, issue.
> 
> Can we please stay focused in each thread on the topic of that thread,
> and nothing more?

Actually exactly that was my intended original message for this
bug. That variable should not affect remote systems and Tramp should
not assume neither seek remote trash if that variable is set, it
should remain local.

bug#44059: 28.0.50; Trash files cannot be deleted properly if delete-by-moving-to-trash is set

[Eli Zaretskii]

> Date: Wed, 28 Oct 2020 14:42:49 +0300
> From: Jean Louis <bugs@gnu.support>
> Cc: larsi@gnus.org, 44059@debbugs.gnu.org
> 
> Actually exactly that was my intended original message for this
> bug. That variable should not affect remote systems and Tramp should
> not assume neither seek remote trash if that variable is set, it
> should remain local.

I don't think I agree with your categorical opinion on tis.

bug#44059: 28.0.50; Trash files cannot be deleted properly if delete-by-moving-to-trash is set

[Jean Louis]

* Eli Zaretskii <eliz@gnu.org> [2020-10-28 18:36]:
> > Date: Wed, 28 Oct 2020 14:42:49 +0300
> > From: Jean Louis <bugs@gnu.support>
> > Cc: larsi@gnus.org, 44059@debbugs.gnu.org
> > 
> > Actually exactly that was my intended original message for this
> > bug. That variable should not affect remote systems and Tramp should
> > not assume neither seek remote trash if that variable is set, it
> > should remain local.
> 
> I don't think I agree with your categorical opinion on tis.

Maybe it sounds too strict. I am always fine with whatever final
decisions you as group make in Emacs.

bug#44059: 28.0.50; Trash files cannot be deleted properly if delete-by-moving-to-trash is set

[Lars Ingebrigtsen]

Jean Louis <bugs@gnu.support> writes:

> I have solved the problem by adding in ~/tmp/Trash/.dir-locals.el
>
> ;;; Directory Local Variables
> ;;; For more information see (info "(emacs) Directory Variables")
>
> ((dired-mode . ((delete-by-moving-to-trash . nil))))

I've now added this to the manual in Emacs 29, and I think that should
be sufficient.

-- 
(domestic pets only, the antidote for overdose, milk.)
   bloggy blog: http://lars.ingebrigtsen.no