From: Drew Adams <drew.adams@oracle.com>
To: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@gnu.org>, Drew Adams <drew.adams@oracle.com>
Cc: michael_heerdegen@web.de, tomasn@posteo.net,
41097@debbugs.gnu.org, bugs@gnu.support, arthur.miller@live.com
Subject: bug#41097: 28.0.50; (dired-toggle-marks) not working after copy
Date: Sun, 10 May 2020 12:18:18 -0700 (PDT) [thread overview]
Message-ID: <744818d3-e904-43a1-a3c1-a0a4a550ada1@default> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <<83k11jd8bs.fsf@gnu.org>>
> > Please reconsider.
>
> Done.
>
> > Can you point to any other occurrence of referring
> > to some mark other than `D' as a "flag" - anywhere
> > in the Dired doc or code? All marks, including
> > `D', are marks. Only `D' is called "flag".
>
> "Flag" is just a word.
So is "mark". What is your point? Only `D' has
been called a flag by Emacs, until now.
Dired actions affect marks differently, depending
on the mark. There are 3 kinds of actions - 3
groups of marks:
1. Actions that affect only mark `*'.
2. Actions that affect only mark `D'.
3. Actions that affect all marks (including
`*' and `D').
By "affect" I mean either act on a file line that
has such a mark or add such a mark to a file line.
How to refer to these actions, these groups
of marks? Up until your change:
1. Emacs has always referred to #1 as "mark",
not making specific mention that only `*'
is affected. This is the most common kind of
action and the most common kind of mark used.
2. Emacs has always, everywhere, referred ONLY
to #2 as "flag", including the specific action
of UNflagging as "unflag". That said, see #3.
3. Emacs has always, for actions that affect ALL
marks or ANY mark (including `D' and `*'),
referred to #3 as "mark".
Could Emacs have spoken differently?
Yes, here's a possibility (not taken by Emacs):
1. Refer ONLY to #1 (`*') as "mark".
2. Refer to #2 as "flag `D'", "flag for deletion".
3. Refer to #3 as "marks and flags" and "mark
or flag", and point out specifically that `C',
`D', etc. are "flags", whereas `*' is the only
"mark".
Either of those approaches, the one Emacs has
used or the other, is doable, reasonable.
But what you've done is instead inconsistent.
In a single doc string you've changed the
terminology, to refer to `C' as a "flag". No
such change for other non-`*' marks.
That means that doc for #3 is not only wrong
but self-contradictory, as it still talks about
the existence of multiple kinds of "mark" -
different characters.
You say you've reconsidered. I'd ask that you
reconsider again. And please elaborate on your
"'Flag' is just a word" response to my question:
Can you point to any other occurrence of
referring to some mark other than `D' as a
"flag" - anywhere in the Dired doc or code?
That's not a rhetorical question. I know of
no such occurrence. Do you? I think what I've
said above is correct, regarding #1, #2, #3.
Words matter. I gave a reason why I think
Emacs chose to use "flag" for `D' - and only
for `D': to flag something is to draw special
attention to it.
Your change works against that. If `C' is now
referred to as a "flag" then `D' isn't special
in that regard. Users can conclude that all
marks except `*' are now "flags".
Note, BTW, that mark `R' is handled the way
mark `C' is handled. It comes from rename
operations. Likewise, `H' (new hard links)
and `Y' (new soft links).
And each of those cases (copy, rename, hard
link, soft link) has a user option that you
can set to `t' to cause the target to be
marked not with the default mark (`C' etc.)
but with whatever mark the source file had.
And the doc for each of those options talks
about "marks" and "marking", not "flags" and
"flagging". The doc for `dired-del-marker',
on the other hand, says "flag", exceptionally.
next parent reply other threads:[~2020-05-10 19:18 UTC|newest]
Thread overview: 43+ messages / expand[flat|nested] mbox.gz Atom feed top
[not found] <<<20200506144423.GW24998@protected.rcdrun.com>
[not found] ` <<<VI1PR06MB452640273F3311C283C50B5F96A20@VI1PR06MB4526.eurprd06.prod.outlook.com>
[not found] ` <<<20200508132924.GI14650@protected.rcdrun.com>
[not found] ` <<<87r1vukl86.fsf@web.de>
[not found] ` <<<20200509042353.GA15309@protected.rcdrun.com>
[not found] ` <<<87h7wonnuh.fsf@fliptop.i-did-not-set--mail-host-address--so-tickle-me>
[not found] ` <<<20200510095646.GA22962@protected.rcdrun.com>
[not found] ` <<<83y2pzdgt7.fsf@gnu.org>
[not found] ` <<<20200510145503.GE28606@protected.rcdrun.com>
[not found] ` <<<83sgg7ddtz.fsf@gnu.org>
[not found] ` <<<20200510153311.GH28606@protected.rcdrun.com>
[not found] ` <<<83r1vrdbc0.fsf@gnu.org>
[not found] ` <<<6bc132d3-2d2d-4eb3-86dd-b818c1b856a2@default>
[not found] ` <<<83mu6fd9q6.fsf@gnu.org>
[not found] ` <<af1d7797-47c1-4330-a767-7b4a2773fbac@default>
[not found] ` <<83k11jd8bs.fsf@gnu.org>
2020-05-10 19:18 ` Drew Adams [this message]
2020-05-10 19:54 ` bug#41097: 28.0.50; (dired-toggle-marks) not working after copy Jean Louis
2020-05-10 21:13 ` Drew Adams
2020-05-11 5:26 ` Jean Louis
2020-05-11 16:03 ` Drew Adams
2020-05-11 16:58 ` Jean Louis
2020-05-11 17:45 ` Drew Adams
2020-05-20 6:37 ` Jean Louis
2020-05-20 16:52 ` Drew Adams
2020-05-20 17:08 ` Robert Pluim
2020-05-12 3:21 ` Richard Stallman
[not found] <<20200506144423.GW24998@protected.rcdrun.com>
[not found] ` <<VI1PR06MB452640273F3311C283C50B5F96A20@VI1PR06MB4526.eurprd06.prod.outlook.com>
[not found] ` <<20200508132924.GI14650@protected.rcdrun.com>
[not found] ` <<87r1vukl86.fsf@web.de>
[not found] ` <<20200509042353.GA15309@protected.rcdrun.com>
[not found] ` <<87h7wonnuh.fsf@fliptop.i-did-not-set--mail-host-address--so-tickle-me>
[not found] ` <<20200510095646.GA22962@protected.rcdrun.com>
[not found] ` <<83y2pzdgt7.fsf@gnu.org>
[not found] ` <<20200510145503.GE28606@protected.rcdrun.com>
[not found] ` <<83sgg7ddtz.fsf@gnu.org>
[not found] ` <<20200510153311.GH28606@protected.rcdrun.com>
[not found] ` <<83r1vrdbc0.fsf@gnu.org>
[not found] ` <<6bc132d3-2d2d-4eb3-86dd-b818c1b856a2@default>
[not found] ` <<83mu6fd9q6.fsf@gnu.org>
2020-05-10 16:46 ` Drew Adams
2020-05-10 17:10 ` Eli Zaretskii
2020-05-05 15:01 Jean Louis
2020-05-06 14:05 ` Arthur Miller
2020-05-06 14:44 ` Jean Louis
2020-05-08 9:05 ` Arthur Miller
2020-05-08 13:29 ` Jean Louis
2020-05-09 0:25 ` Michael Heerdegen
2020-05-09 1:50 ` Drew Adams
2020-05-09 5:22 ` Michael Heerdegen
2020-05-09 4:23 ` Jean Louis
2020-05-10 1:11 ` Michael Heerdegen
2020-05-10 5:00 ` Jean Louis
2020-05-10 9:25 ` Tomas Nordin
2020-05-10 9:56 ` Jean Louis
2020-05-10 14:07 ` Eli Zaretskii
2020-05-10 14:55 ` Jean Louis
2020-05-10 15:11 ` Eli Zaretskii
2020-05-10 15:33 ` Jean Louis
2020-05-10 16:05 ` Eli Zaretskii
2020-05-10 16:29 ` Drew Adams
2020-05-10 16:40 ` Eli Zaretskii
2020-05-10 17:17 ` Jean Louis
2020-05-10 17:19 ` Eli Zaretskii
2020-05-10 16:26 ` Drew Adams
2020-05-10 17:32 ` Jean Louis
2020-05-11 0:36 ` Michael Heerdegen
2020-05-11 2:33 ` Drew Adams
2020-05-11 5:34 ` Michael Heerdegen
2020-05-11 16:18 ` Drew Adams
2020-05-11 13:15 ` Arthur Miller
2020-05-11 16:41 ` Drew Adams
Reply instructions:
You may reply publicly to this message via plain-text email
using any one of the following methods:
* Save the following mbox file, import it into your mail client,
and reply-to-all from there: mbox
Avoid top-posting and favor interleaved quoting:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Posting_style#Interleaved_style
List information: https://www.gnu.org/software/emacs/
* Reply using the --to, --cc, and --in-reply-to
switches of git-send-email(1):
git send-email \
--in-reply-to=744818d3-e904-43a1-a3c1-a0a4a550ada1@default \
--to=drew.adams@oracle.com \
--cc=41097@debbugs.gnu.org \
--cc=arthur.miller@live.com \
--cc=bugs@gnu.support \
--cc=eliz@gnu.org \
--cc=michael_heerdegen@web.de \
--cc=tomasn@posteo.net \
/path/to/YOUR_REPLY
https://kernel.org/pub/software/scm/git/docs/git-send-email.html
* If your mail client supports setting the In-Reply-To header
via mailto: links, try the mailto: link
Be sure your reply has a Subject: header at the top and a blank line
before the message body.
Code repositories for project(s) associated with this public inbox
https://git.savannah.gnu.org/cgit/emacs.git
This is a public inbox, see mirroring instructions
for how to clone and mirror all data and code used for this inbox;
as well as URLs for read-only IMAP folder(s) and NNTP newsgroup(s).