From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from mp10.migadu.com ([2001:41d0:8:6d80::]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits)) by ms9.migadu.com with LMTPS id gD2pEfqyIWQ6tgAASxT56A (envelope-from ) for ; Mon, 27 Mar 2023 17:15:06 +0200 Received: from aspmx1.migadu.com ([2001:41d0:8:6d80::]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits)) by mp10.migadu.com with LMTPS id kEa0EPqyIWTWQQAAG6o9tA (envelope-from ) for ; Mon, 27 Mar 2023 17:15:06 +0200 Received: from lists.gnu.org (lists.gnu.org [209.51.188.17]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by aspmx1.migadu.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id C0CBF19666 for ; Mon, 27 Mar 2023 17:15:05 +0200 (CEST) Received: from localhost ([::1] helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1pgoYA-0002YW-7D; Mon, 27 Mar 2023 11:14:22 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1pgoY8-0002VC-J3 for emacs-orgmode@gnu.org; Mon, 27 Mar 2023 11:14:20 -0400 Received: from ciao.gmane.io ([116.202.254.214]) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1pgoY6-0007dS-OG for emacs-orgmode@gnu.org; Mon, 27 Mar 2023 11:14:20 -0400 Received: from list by ciao.gmane.io with local (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1pgoY3-00092Z-7Z for emacs-orgmode@gnu.org; Mon, 27 Mar 2023 17:14:15 +0200 X-Injected-Via-Gmane: http://gmane.org/ To: emacs-orgmode@gnu.org From: Max Nikulin Subject: Re: [POLL] Should we accept breaking changes to get rid of Org libraries that perform side effects when loading? Date: Mon, 27 Mar 2023 22:14:01 +0700 Message-ID: References: <87o7omg4ie.fsf@alphaville.usersys.redhat.com> <87pm91ngb8.fsf@localhost> <87jzz8f3re.fsf@alphaville.usersys.redhat.com> <87mt43agk6.fsf@localhost> <874jq8ohbr.fsf@localhost> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux x86_64; rv:102.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/102.8.0 Content-Language: en-US In-Reply-To: <874jq8ohbr.fsf@localhost> Received-SPF: pass client-ip=116.202.254.214; envelope-from=geo-emacs-orgmode@m.gmane-mx.org; helo=ciao.gmane.io X-Spam_score_int: 28 X-Spam_score: 2.8 X-Spam_bar: ++ X-Spam_report: (2.8 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_ADSP_CUSTOM_MED=0.001, FORGED_GMAIL_RCVD=1, FORGED_MUA_MOZILLA=2.309, FREEMAIL_FORGED_FROMDOMAIN=0.25, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HEADER_FROM_DIFFERENT_DOMAINS=0.25, NICE_REPLY_A=-0.001, NML_ADSP_CUSTOM_MED=0.9, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001 autolearn=no autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-BeenThere: emacs-orgmode@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: "General discussions about Org-mode." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-orgmode-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org Sender: emacs-orgmode-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org X-Migadu-Country: US X-Migadu-Flow: FLOW_IN ARC-Seal: i=1; s=key1; d=yhetil.org; t=1679930105; a=rsa-sha256; cv=none; b=V+7QuQS8esZ7tLBxRiAPK67VtByGTJ24rxN4RVlghIrHfygfgmPy8zNf53Bux4uNzdOcEF rYOTPU9cKwyhQ/el+N+O2p/sbN7Y25akDyyW6E/dvp5+y5LVOMeapjaioepLDr0vgmnli+ BvssI0lPlCL3rgpsUE4L5pCxDJvH94KzTjMQwAYoxy/BbTEWCNIxJJQ2uoykhzfhiCIrMD LwYTvyYmnbrlGGjxK3li0x1Y9xGBrbHLV8PO4rv35zX10pHGi+o4ht+pT3s6usIRaNMc8B MoH7PeGCcvk9YTvIrw6CldX6dl6bVlSpjSBdPgddQseM6HP050QKdD8IvssdkA== ARC-Authentication-Results: i=1; aspmx1.migadu.com; dkim=none; dmarc=fail reason="SPF not aligned (relaxed), No valid DKIM" header.from=gmail.com (policy=none); spf=pass (aspmx1.migadu.com: domain of "emacs-orgmode-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org" designates 209.51.188.17 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom="emacs-orgmode-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org" ARC-Message-Signature: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=yhetil.org; s=key1; t=1679930105; h=from:from:sender:sender:reply-to:subject:subject:date:date: message-id:message-id:to:to:cc:mime-version:mime-version: content-type:content-type: content-transfer-encoding:content-transfer-encoding: in-reply-to:in-reply-to:references:references:list-id:list-help: list-unsubscribe:list-subscribe:list-post; bh=QbtY2ohZHOcYJlPEqoVC+tbdsRlzVUaVpPSsxND18DA=; b=drERK+j7NzEpBHUrpHPfSaQbVhEkTiADjzAqSuajGZfgmKorPUbLiaVZLGF0US/K9d1pgM 9bBQhhohBoGXsL93SavXj8DwKmKSVKADFvr867wNO7RRM0COEMpE1NxBIZ4veeBVYwqhhK ezIVBOHYVYkRqMeM1DYcGZOp0HD1kLqy7pyL83scypygV9LYOgejwkEBRTWl1cO6jjq2Xx r1yBd54l80Leji68uLCmpDewTF2XGYv4goKcBrg7MmSW9wTxBgWMH9CDmqtiJHI3bROXlg u3n9vGIn3j4kytTozPm3BGWvLXRPKTgIfR3O1UIiwUQuvmIkc277s68uEsMa5Q== Authentication-Results: aspmx1.migadu.com; dkim=none; dmarc=fail reason="SPF not aligned (relaxed), No valid DKIM" header.from=gmail.com (policy=none); spf=pass (aspmx1.migadu.com: domain of "emacs-orgmode-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org" designates 209.51.188.17 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom="emacs-orgmode-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org" X-Migadu-Scanner: scn1.migadu.com X-Migadu-Spam-Score: -1.43 X-Spam-Score: -1.43 X-Migadu-Queue-Id: C0CBF19666 X-TUID: Q9GtRlYyy5z5 On 26/03/2023 00:45, Ihor Radchenko wrote: > I am then CCing Bastien, as, despite the Elisp convention, following it > will break https://bzg.fr/en/the-software-maintainers-pledge/ I hope, it may be mitigated to some degree, e.g. loading of `org-modules' and `org-babel-load-languages' may include their activation. Perhaps `org-require-package' should activate the loaded package as well. If it is possible to avoid user prompt in org-ctags then migration may be done in 2 steps separated by a year: add new require helper and do not activate by default. Unsure if it is possible to add some warnings on first step that activate function is not called. > (defun enable-feature (feature &optional filename noerror) > "Load and enable FEATURE. > FILENAME and NOERROR arguments are the same as in `require'." > (when (require feature filename noerror) > (let ((enabler-cmd (intern (format "%s-enable-function" feature)))) > (and (fboundp enabler-cmd) (funcall enabler-cmd))))) I would prefer activating on first call only, subsequent calls should be no op. > (defun disable-feature (feature) I had a hope that existing `unload-feature' is enough. My idea was something like `org-require' that is (require feature) and (feature-activate) or (feature-activate-function) *once*.