From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from mp11.migadu.com ([2001:41d0:2:4a6f::]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits)) by ms5.migadu.com with LMTPS id eD2IMJFP8GKnQQAAbAwnHQ (envelope-from ) for ; Mon, 08 Aug 2022 01:49:37 +0200 Received: from aspmx1.migadu.com ([2001:41d0:2:4a6f::]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits)) by mp11.migadu.com with LMTPS id +M96MJFP8GLhaAEA9RJhRA (envelope-from ) for ; Mon, 08 Aug 2022 01:49:37 +0200 Received: from lists.gnu.org (lists.gnu.org [209.51.188.17]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by aspmx1.migadu.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 99990FD99 for ; Mon, 8 Aug 2022 01:49:36 +0200 (CEST) Received: from localhost ([::1]:38896 helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1oKq1X-0005ka-9U for larch@yhetil.org; Sun, 07 Aug 2022 19:49:35 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:39340) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1oKq0i-0005jq-OW for emacs-orgmode@gnu.org; Sun, 07 Aug 2022 19:48:44 -0400 Received: from [39.171.214.252] (port=14779 helo=Mac-mini.local) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1oKq0b-0001Zn-PV for emacs-orgmode@gnu.org; Sun, 07 Aug 2022 19:48:44 -0400 Received: by Mac-mini.local (Postfix, from userid 501) id 70F4B5DE999F; Mon, 8 Aug 2022 07:48:22 +0800 (CST) References: <878ro3phee.fsf@localhost> <7AB4F327-24D0-4BA5-BD20-B329D4CBBF0A@hoowl.se> <871qttn61p.fsf@localhost> User-agent: mu4e 1.8.6; emacs 28.1 From: "Christopher M. Miles" To: Ihor Radchenko Cc: Hanno , emacs-orgmode@gnu.org Subject: Re: Odd characters in the fast tags selection interface Date: Mon, 08 Aug 2022 07:47:04 +0800 In-reply-to: <871qttn61p.fsf@localhost> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; boundary="=-=-="; micalg=pgp-sha256; protocol="application/pgp-signature" X-Host-Lookup-Failed: Reverse DNS lookup failed for 39.171.214.252 (deferred) Received-SPF: softfail client-ip=39.171.214.252; envelope-from=numbchild@gmail.com; helo=Mac-mini.local X-Spam_score_int: 58 X-Spam_score: 5.8 X-Spam_bar: +++++ X-Spam_report: (5.8 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_ADSP_CUSTOM_MED=0.001, FORGED_GMAIL_RCVD=1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, MSGID_MULTIPLE_AT=1, NML_ADSP_CUSTOM_MED=0.9, RCVD_IN_PBL=3.335, RDNS_NONE=0.793, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_SOFTFAIL=0.665, SPOOFED_FREEMAIL_NO_RDNS=0.001, T_SCC_BODY_TEXT_LINE=-0.01 autolearn=no autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: reject X-BeenThere: emacs-orgmode@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: "General discussions about Org-mode." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Reply-To: numbchild@gmail.com Errors-To: emacs-orgmode-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org Sender: "Emacs-orgmode" X-Migadu-Flow: FLOW_IN X-Migadu-To: larch@yhetil.org X-Migadu-Country: US ARC-Message-Signature: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=yhetil.org; s=key1; t=1659916176; h=from:from:sender:sender:reply-to:reply-to:subject:subject:date:date: message-id:message-id:to:to:cc:cc:mime-version:mime-version: content-type:content-type:in-reply-to:in-reply-to: references:references:list-id:list-help:list-unsubscribe: list-subscribe:list-post; bh=Ms+o5VbUW0Exxj9TyGMPF8jHhGYkQihpazSLYe3gdz4=; b=XbnqCYi7TlN0jzmz1/AZWOVyi4GtF9f5we+OF5DMaUJCAmmDC49tF20SMYLo4AWUMvPufa ns8tHJWomTI/iviDUaQb+K2RdfdVkAYwwJ/VFKbcH93ZteYhqccTnG3jpDhj3E+hKGzq9w cqM+4hFBeL/q00JfgrWJTBVVUb1PMflc6aaQJHNzxaYUkH+G66+EdH40pZqvfB1bVTKjmF e0DTFSN+A+pYUHs8varkt46/SgWxSXe3KkqA8QJc1fjg9VrC0nq3Gll4xaPN3DHcT1qHSH 0TeUo24zXzlq7VbwW+c6q26LafUuoiPROqJ80Zq3NP5asFpGjHK96hydHdZ4aQ== ARC-Seal: i=1; s=key1; d=yhetil.org; t=1659916176; a=rsa-sha256; cv=none; b=tABR3a497twQn65kaNTAx4v07/M+84yadqyaq1n1lvDfEOL2BGeeRLE6+s21dBIqwOAg2/ usomJfd6+hikzKTktU2FECHsduns4HKVASKQCUbRa+IpdBUytNrl5Acdk79sxRnzPVL+Ty mvoO5UAdw4DCWHKHLC9kuG/rfzte0+vAp2m2a8u1UfZkR46IfCCznP4l1ELRgybvfe21/n NEW5NgrVfIcS+W75AkkCTPrqZdGYA37hvpybC9bZ72b6I2mOsRUeNvs9rpPiuOzVw2cME/ 3WMuBSnUd+RQ0twQfvA2XhQaDW8wLc0E6HsKesAA3dtYTNsH0aWMDEj0Ct8LXw== ARC-Authentication-Results: i=1; aspmx1.migadu.com; dkim=none; dmarc=fail reason="SPF not aligned (relaxed), No valid DKIM" header.from=gmail.com (policy=none); spf=pass (aspmx1.migadu.com: domain of "emacs-orgmode-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org" designates 209.51.188.17 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom="emacs-orgmode-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org" X-Migadu-Spam-Score: 1.21 Authentication-Results: aspmx1.migadu.com; dkim=none; dmarc=fail reason="SPF not aligned (relaxed), No valid DKIM" header.from=gmail.com (policy=none); spf=pass (aspmx1.migadu.com: domain of "emacs-orgmode-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org" designates 209.51.188.17 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom="emacs-orgmode-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org" X-Migadu-Queue-Id: 99990FD99 X-Spam-Score: 1.21 X-Migadu-Scanner: scn1.migadu.com X-TUID: KSqFaoER0Y3Y --=-=-= Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Ihor Radchenko writes: > Hanno writes: > >>>> - after "a..z" runs out, '{', '|' and '}' are being used which seems >>>> reasonable -- but after that, I get '\200' and similar before reachi= ng >>>> '=C2=A9'... >>> >>>This is indeed true, but what can we do? There are only that many >>>characters in the keyboard. We may instead start using two-key >>>combinations for tags beyond #26, similar to org-capture. Patches are >>>welcome! >> >> Thanks for the fast reply and fully agreed! I would indeed argue that au= tomatically generated keys >> are not useful beyond a certain number (N=3D26?) as they could change wi= th new tags and thus are >> hard to memorize. And taking in >N random choices every time is hardly "= fast select" anymore. >> >> In fact, the docstring for =3Dorg-fast-tag-selection=3D says that only a= -z would be automatically >> assigned. That sounds reasonable to me (otherwise one can define more ke= ys via >> =3Dorg-tag-persistent-alist=3D). Maybe this is a bug after all? If more = than 26 choices are desired, >> maybe A-Z (i.e. capital letters) could extend the list before more unusu= al characters? >> >> What do you think? >> >> I am not at my computer right now but could try to come up with a patch = later. > > I am not sure. Omitting (random) part of the tags sounds awkward - some > tags will be assigned keys and some not. I guess something that will > improve the current situation would be simply not printing chars beyond > a-z, while still listing all the tags - it will be less awkward compared > to current situation when a key is printed but cannot be used anyway. > > Or we may provide "paging" approach that will re-assign a-z keys when > user presses C-n/C-p. Though I do not like this idea too much because we > have a more universal menu backend in works at > https://orgmode.org/list/87zgisvuu5.fsf@localhost Adding new feature to > tag menu does not feel like a good direction to go. If we decide to go > this way at the end, we may, at least, also need to update > org-fast-todo-selection along similar lines. I prefer this second way, currently I don't know how to scroll tag selection buffer. By using "paging" can solve the assigned keys problem. Also used for other tags. > > Finally, we may simply not list tags with keys beyond "z" at all only > indicating that there are more by showing some text at the end of the > menu. > >>>> - when defining my own keys, they are not displayed in the top; instead >>>> their characters are missing in the 'a'..'z' range leaving more room >>>> for odd and very difficult-to-type characters >>>I think that it would make sense to have `org-tag-persistent-alist` >>>staff being shown on top. Unless there are objections I can merge this >>>trivial change. >> >> Thanks, that already improves the usability a lot! > > Done on main via a0b21e3f1. > https://git.savannah.gnu.org/cgit/emacs/org-mode.git/commit/?id=3Da0b21e3= f1c131bc6ee6398e2d3dda20944d6b358 =2D-=20 [ stardiviner ] I try to make every word tell the meaning that I want to express. Blog: https://stardiviner.github.io/ IRC(freenode): stardiviner, Matrix: stardiviner GPG: F09F650D7D674819892591401B5DF1C95AE89AC3 --=-=-= Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name="signature.asc" -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- iQEzBAEBCAAdFiEE8J9lDX1nSBmJJZFAG13xyVromsMFAmLwT0YACgkQG13xyVro msOCsgf+J+Zix6ry2greFTuYTfwfycfKRQ6z0ryn/Avmbw0QxzkjMa1F2+qqCx4Q TSajxMHK78+sGvU4oUYaHVC3wAXFx3cYpO/ZtFEyV1lzePYArQFUhfNnAxD4LeNa xjAQrwKm1oTHEcSsNK80JMEhd1r5QsfSKKEeYQmbbw8gN2kygaCbXr1G3Vd+GIH9 6hRZIDfMtC1n7KET/A9sYz3ePbswREq8Pz7uLMIr2sdhBaJFyxcgcJQbA2sbO7CH psSxze4UuiX+V8f7OykrvNGrYJ1lOk07apJ8ZNo3N98E0H3KIKaSp4sLh/JNKSpJ A95mLE1UDMipHz3hIEROQHVw7IE/4g== =QH35 -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --=-=-=--