Org and financial data

Org and financial data

[Memnon Anon]

Hi!

A new year has started and I try to get even more organized.
So, I think it is time to keep track of my financial data, and
I think orgmode is the way to go.

Yet, I am not sure how to keep the structure.
I started with something quite simple like using a date structure
and tables:

*2008
**January
***01
| What            |  Cost |
|-----------------+-------|
| Milk            |  0.50 |
| Apples          |  1.50 |
| Butter          |  0.89 |
|-----------------+-------|
| Sum             |  2.89 |
|-----------------+-------|
| Library Penalty | 13.50 |
| Library Copies  |  3.00 |
| Power Bill      | 35.00 |
|-----------------+-------|
| Sum Total       | xyz   |

But having a closer look at it, this does not seem that flexible.
Using ColumnView to display the sum of a day might be one idea,
adding tags like food, bill, wasted (Library Penalty :) etc. is 
another thing that comes to my mind.

Orgmode became so flexible and powerful, and I still have no clue about 
all its features. I am sure there are people out there doing what I am
planning to do.

So, what is your setup?
How do you use orgmode to keep a record of where your money goes and 
comes from?

I am sorry, this mail is a bit off topic.
But, as I said, my org knowledge is still quite limited and it would be
a colossal waste of time to enter data for weeks, just to find out that
a different format is more feasible and converting everything.

Thanks, have a nice day.

Re: Org and financial data

[Manish]

  On Tue, Jan 6, 2009 at 9:24 AM, Memnon Anon wrote:
  > Hi!
  >
  > A new year has started and I try to get even more organized.
  > So, I think it is time to keep track of my financial data, and
  > I think orgmode is the way to go.
  >
  > Yet, I am not sure how to keep the structure.
  > I started with something quite simple like using a date structure
  > and tables:
  >
  > *2008
  > **January
  > ***01
  > | What      | Cost |
  > |-----------------+-------|
  > | Milk      | 0.50 |
  > | Apples     | 1.50 |
  > | Butter     | 0.89 |
  > |-----------------+-------|
  > | Sum       | 2.89 |
  > |-----------------+-------|
  > | Library Penalty | 13.50 |
  > | Library Copies | 3.00 |
  > | Power Bill   | 35.00 |
  > |-----------------+-------|
  > | Sum Total    | xyz  |
  >
  > But having a closer look at it, this does not seem that flexible.
  > Using ColumnView to display the sum of a day might be one idea,
  > adding tags like food, bill, wasted (Library Penalty :) etc. is
  > another thing that comes to my mind.
  >
  > Orgmode became so flexible and powerful, and I still have no clue about
  > all its features. I am sure there are people out there doing what I am
  > planning to do.
  >
  > So, what is your setup?
  > How do you use orgmode to keep a record of where your money goes and
  > comes from?
  >
  > I am sorry, this mail is a bit off topic.
  > But, as I said, my org knowledge is still quite limited and it would be
  > a colossal waste of time to enter data for weeks, just to find out that
  > a different format is more feasible and converting everything.
  >
  > Thanks, have a nice day.


Have you considered (a more convenient and flexible approach, IMHO)
John Weigley's Ledger [1]

-- 
Manish
[1] http://www.newartisans.com/software/ledger.html

Re: Org and financial data

[Memnon Anon]

Hi!

Manish <mailtomanish.sharma@gmail.com> writes:

> Have you considered (a more convenient and flexible approach, IMHO)
> John Weigley's Ledger [1]

Well, I heard of it. But I am hesitating to learn another tool.
But hey, there is a Debian Package, so I will have a look at it.
This sentence from the info file looks promising:

,---- [Ledger Info File: 1. Introduction
|  As you keep your ledger, you are recording information about your
| life and habits, and sometimes that information can start telling you
| things you aren't aware of.  Such is the aim of all good accounting
| tools.
`----

I just thought this would be way too sophisticated for my simple needs.
Thanks for the tip, I am looking into it ...

Re: Org and financial data

[Matthew Lundin]

Hi Memnon,
Memnon Anon <gegendosenfleisch@googlemail.com> writes:

> Hi!
>
> A new year has started and I try to get even more organized.
> So, I think it is time to keep track of my financial data, and
> I think orgmode is the way to go.

If your needs are simple (i.e., just tracking discretionary spending)
you might consider using properties and column views to keep track of
where your money is going. I find that this creates a nice way to sum
up weekly, monthly, and yearly expenditures. I described my admittedly
simple setup in this post:

http://article.gmane.org/gmane.emacs.orgmode/9827

I create a tree for each year, a subtree for each month, and a subtree
for each week, such as:

---begin org file---

#+COLUMNS: %30ITEM(Item) %15spendtype(Category) %10amount(Amount){$} %10goal(Goal){$} 
#+PROPERTY: spendtype_all food office household entertainment

* 2008
** December 
   :PROPERTIES:
   :END:
*** Week One (November 29-December 6)
    :PROPERTIES:
    :goal:     #fill in your own goal here#
    :END:
**** Post Office[2008-12-02 Tue]
     :PROPERTIES:
     :amount:   14.40
     :spendtype: office
     :END:
**** Grocery store[2008-12-04 Thu]
     :PROPERTIES:
     :amount:   18.86
     :spendtype: food
     :END:
     
# More entries can go here.

---end property---

With this setup, column views provides a nice summary of weekly and
monthly spending. If you like, you can also add weekly goals to the
headline for the week and compare yearly, monthly, weekly sums to your
goals.

To search for a type of spending you easily do a tag search (e.g, C-a
m +spendtype="food"), optionally restricting the search to a
particular subtree. You could then use columns view in the agenda to
see the total.

Warning: property searches will be really slow if you don't restrict
them to your spending file. If you prefer, you could easily use tags
to keep track of types of spending.

Finally, Eric Schulte's org-collector.el is great for creating
filtered tables of results. See this thread for more information:
http://thread.gmane.org/gmane.emacs.orgmode/9908

For more sophisticated financial tracking, I'd probably recommend a
tool devoted to that purpose.

Best,
Matt

Re: Org and financial data

[Matthew Lundin]

Matthew Lundin <mdl@imapmail.org> writes:
>
> To search for a type of spending you easily do a tag search (e.g, C-a
> m +spendtype="food"), optionally restricting the search to a
> particular subtree. You could then use columns view in the agenda to
> see the total.

Sorry, I always goof up the keybindings. The "C-a m" above should read
C-c a m.

- Matt

Re: Org and financial data

[Memnon Anon]

Hey!
Matthew Lundin <mdl@imapmail.org> writes:

>> I think orgmode is the way to go.
>
> If your needs are simple (i.e., just tracking discretionary spending)
> you might consider using properties and column views to keep track of
> where your money is going. I find that this creates a nice way to sum
> up weekly, monthly, and yearly expenditures. I described my admittedly
> simple setup in this post:

Well, for now, my needs are simple. This may change, but keeping a
double-entry accounting system seems overkill for my very limited
budget as a student. Your setup is great, I played with it a while,
and I think I will test and adopt/extend it to my needs.

> For more sophisticated financial tracking, I'd probably recommend a
> tool devoted to that purpose.

Well, ledger is still installed. 
Some day, I will have a closer look at this. But for now, I have
other things to do ...

Thank you *very* much for this basic setup!

memnon

P.S.: btw.: It seems that cc is widely used on this mailinglist.
            So I use it even if I know the person is subscribed.
            Is this the preferred way? Every list has its own conventions :(

Re: Re: Org and financial data

[Charles Philip Chan]

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Memnon Anon <gegendosenfleisch@googlemail.com> writes:

> Well, ledger is still installed. 
> Some day, I will have a closer look at this. But for now, I have
> other things to do ...

Ledger might sound scary, but it is actually very easy to use,
especially with the Emacs interface.

Charles

-- 
"If you want to travel around the world and be invited to speak at a lot
of different places, just write a Unix operating system."
(By Linus Torvalds)

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Re: Org and financial data

[Bernt Hansen]

Memnon Anon <gegendosenfleisch@googlemail.com> writes:

> P.S.: btw.: It seems that cc is widely used on this mailinglist.
>             So I use it even if I know the person is subscribed.
>             Is this the preferred way? Every list has its own conventions :(
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Emacs-orgmode mailing list
> Remember: use `Reply All' to send replies to the list.
> Emacs-orgmode@gnu.org
> http://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/emacs-orgmode

I think that's the right convention.

On high-traffic lists it's easy to miss messages to topics you replied
to if followup emails are sent only to the list.  The discussion also
proceeds at a faster rate for people not subscribed to the list since
they get direct email.

I read mail much more often than I read the news groups.  I follow the
list through the gmane interface so I'm not subscribed.

The footer on the post also states to use 'Reply All' so the
conversation doesn't accidentally end up off-list.

Just my 2 cents :)

-Bernt