From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from mp10.migadu.com ([2001:41d0:2:4a6f::]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits)) by ms9.migadu.com with LMTPS id +HIWJB+LR2RM5wAASxT56A (envelope-from ) for ; Tue, 25 Apr 2023 10:11:11 +0200 Received: from aspmx1.migadu.com ([2001:41d0:2:4a6f::]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits)) by mp10.migadu.com with LMTPS id iDY3Ix+LR2Q5QQEAG6o9tA (envelope-from ) for ; Tue, 25 Apr 2023 10:11:11 +0200 Received: from lists.gnu.org (lists.gnu.org [209.51.188.17]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by aspmx1.migadu.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 10DE1166F8 for ; Tue, 25 Apr 2023 10:11:11 +0200 (CEST) Received: from localhost ([::1] helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1prDko-00053I-M0; Tue, 25 Apr 2023 04:10:26 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1prDkl-000530-J5 for emacs-orgmode@gnu.org; Tue, 25 Apr 2023 04:10:24 -0400 Received: from mout01.posteo.de ([185.67.36.65]) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1prDkh-0002MA-Or for emacs-orgmode@gnu.org; Tue, 25 Apr 2023 04:10:23 -0400 Received: from submission (posteo.de [185.67.36.169]) by mout01.posteo.de (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 9C7032402A3 for ; Tue, 25 Apr 2023 10:10:15 +0200 (CEST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=posteo.net; s=2017; t=1682410215; bh=Idm6JkjQ1j4osx9/xqwDM4ZGwLlnBTI4voXVneG2UMs=; h=From:To:Cc:Subject:Date:From; b=rs/qZJoaQdjtR+QP9xGQqB0y+CPFG6I41lPaiTsxbeP2Hz8ENHXPCDKQuAd8LNgBY 2q5yvod27AHGw7rj2ulRzGxzQxb46RcdGf3Itd32Lzo0mBO8sx5cH87bbI6xiHPi2x wvfBLBb4m+eL9YiO35nowx/FB6AzhtbfpRgBuKqmQ2kzR7syzDiM6TciBYsWYY3ChA +wy7ihSLYHtpB2JvkZ3xau7w7sJLghQCm+s5gjvPlkEE44ePTxV/5IVeUzclNJUINM r1e+txNReye1E/vRg/MgwcRNFXRsXfW0IvigbzpJ6SlXiHSm56CDA+KWtEWzIsJ3BP qBD3axGLnC25Q== Received: from customer (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by submission (posteo.de) with ESMTPSA id 4Q5F6b0PH3z6tvc; Tue, 25 Apr 2023 10:10:15 +0200 (CEST) From: Ihor Radchenko To: lin Sun Cc: "emacs-orgmode@gnu.org" , Timothy , Bastien Guerry Subject: Re: [PATCH] before emit an error message, try to load the babel language In-Reply-To: References: <388850760.3644614.1634354740816.ref@mail.yahoo.com> <388850760.3644614.1634354740816@mail.yahoo.com> <87k0h5gbad.fsf@gmail.com> <1410400175.3014347.1637221629433@mail.yahoo.com> <147485378.6546620.1638236479358@mail.yahoo.com> <87czmiqnmh.fsf@gmail.com> <115088871.6596146.1638252307206@mail.yahoo.com> <877d5sszc2.fsf@localhost> <87354suluu.fsf@localhost> <87cz3vhwj7.fsf@localhost> Date: Tue, 25 Apr 2023 08:12:57 +0000 Message-ID: <87zg6ws7li.fsf@localhost> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Received-SPF: pass client-ip=185.67.36.65; envelope-from=yantar92@posteo.net; helo=mout01.posteo.de X-Spam_score_int: -43 X-Spam_score: -4.4 X-Spam_bar: ---- X-Spam_report: (-4.4 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-2.3, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H2=-0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, T_SCC_BODY_TEXT_LINE=-0.01 autolearn=unavailable autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-BeenThere: emacs-orgmode@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: "General discussions about Org-mode." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-orgmode-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org Sender: emacs-orgmode-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org X-Migadu-Country: US X-Migadu-Flow: FLOW_IN ARC-Seal: i=1; s=key1; d=yhetil.org; t=1682410271; a=rsa-sha256; cv=none; b=rCM1xrz8hr8ytgfQiOYN5PoCpC3AHnKWPDfStLy8unOM4VU0wulWiW+FFVZrYYwZF9+c08 fuKnPPzY9HnPsS5TWn6/pjN2jK9jQn8zmpk9/APHJLIeMOllJWH/DXCy19pYB43gN2VtQp HPMFa1kju0MhzS73lmk164GpA2ACHIl05YjabGprqZ+gKJibMFRmYtQGCu1uvcoLmt1r75 MtDcQqZpRa7Wg1Klo8NUbTqrnLD/lKhem9BMVvIb3QvmGt3sKNH23Eej/F83rV/8y9whSL 0k5jhJEY2XUJZPhKnHhzmoslHCaduzRcInKq0RdXc3hTnH408c6n8+yUwJHJew== ARC-Authentication-Results: i=1; aspmx1.migadu.com; dkim=pass header.d=posteo.net header.s=2017 header.b="rs/qZJoa"; dmarc=pass (policy=none) header.from=posteo.net; spf=pass (aspmx1.migadu.com: domain of "emacs-orgmode-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org" designates 209.51.188.17 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom="emacs-orgmode-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org" ARC-Message-Signature: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=yhetil.org; s=key1; t=1682410271; h=from:from:sender:sender:reply-to:subject:subject:date:date: message-id:message-id:to:to:cc:cc:mime-version:mime-version: content-type:content-type:in-reply-to:in-reply-to: references:references:list-id:list-help:list-unsubscribe: list-subscribe:list-post:dkim-signature; bh=B9+DgqNl9tdUDI6xmU7dLkT66tsx3hy0/H2T7huJJQg=; b=GMlcL0EwCuCyAQj1XS4Wge9Bz/7RI13ad9AhBLlV/BdUVF7Namv2KgFfoTUD/AOuLZpBOa aRnOrkwTWNFv0FfdFESLOiSMRjMkSsJJBe7CQIJrgy5aDKe3QyaHk/EiBBqFahlqjmM+f+ Sms5w1DI5zUmO+D36iFIWUFv+TJlojhLPuHdharVKSoMcFZxU8Fo6q3tgQn+P3R9TQodvg Lbpds3kPxARKILVBW9ZwRP7/CnJkQG8Y2FkrWjlEhkwXc4Pkjdrz69/NHxUUkdtFrs67fF stA666R2NDQFiqFVIvIhw8lBlRgtls/1uQ5vXjz7IFR9zlrI/qzqvMhEPrg4XQ== X-Migadu-Spam-Score: -4.70 X-Spam-Score: -4.70 X-Migadu-Queue-Id: 10DE1166F8 X-Migadu-Scanner: scn0.migadu.com Authentication-Results: aspmx1.migadu.com; dkim=pass header.d=posteo.net header.s=2017 header.b="rs/qZJoa"; dmarc=pass (policy=none) header.from=posteo.net; spf=pass (aspmx1.migadu.com: domain of "emacs-orgmode-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org" designates 209.51.188.17 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom="emacs-orgmode-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org" X-TUID: 2eTcBtSDhE/5 lin Sun writes: > Thanks for the comment. > If we switch to the `add-variable-watcher', it seems we'll load the > ob-LANG in the callback immediately. > The previous change can lazyly load the babel languages until the user > tries to evaluate the source block. Is there any advantage doing the loading lazily? I can only see disadvantages: 1. `setopt' already triggers loading when variable is set. It is just `setq', often used in place of `setopt', that does not trigger loading/unloading. 2. Lazy loading like you proposed will have to be added in a number of places, not just when executing src block: `org-edit-special', `org-src-associate-babel-session', `org-edit-src-code', `pcomplete/org-mode/block-option/src', org-lint, `org-babel-tangle-single-block', `org-babel-exp-src-block', `org-babel-exp-results', and others. 3. We will also have to monitor newly added babel functions to take care about lazy loading. Not to mention third-party code. Admittedly, (2) can be solved by abstracting babel backend queries to API. (I have a WIP code doing exactly this). However, I still see no good reason to make `setq' different from what `setopt' does now. Most people treat them interchangeably and then get surprised by the differences. -- Ihor Radchenko // yantar92, Org mode contributor, Learn more about Org mode at . Support Org development at , or support my work at