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Wed, 28 Sep 2022 13:44:00 -0400 (EDT) From: Timothy To: emacs-orgmode@gnu.org Cc: Timothy , Jude DaShiell , Ihor Radchenko , emacs-orgmode@gnu.org Subject: Re: org exported pdf files Date: Thu, 29 Sep 2022 01:39:08 +0800 References: <87a66lpm5p.fsf@localhost> <8735cdpkiz.fsf@localhost> <87y1u5o1ko.fsf@localhost> <87a66k2j5y.fsf@tec.tecosaur.net> <7edd911f-b74-6521-634e-7f30acdb5fad@panix.com> <867d1nj1yn.fsf@gmail.com> <877d1n3ky0.fsf@tec.tecosaur.net> <86tu4ro11c.fsf@gmail.com> User-agent: mu4e 1.8.8; emacs 28.1.50 In-reply-to: <86tu4ro11c.fsf@gmail.com> Message-ID: <875yh72y3n.fsf@tec.tecosaur.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="=-=-=" Received-SPF: none client-ip=64.147.123.19; envelope-from=orgmode@tec.tecosaur.net; helo=wout3-smtp.messagingengine.com X-Spam_score_int: -19 X-Spam_score: -2.0 X-Spam_bar: -- X-Spam_report: (-2.0 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, SPF_HELO_PASS=-0.001, SPF_NONE=0.001 autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-BeenThere: emacs-orgmode@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: "General discussions about Org-mode." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-orgmode-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org Sender: "Emacs-orgmode" X-Migadu-Flow: FLOW_IN X-Migadu-Country: US ARC-Message-Signature: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=yhetil.org; s=key1; t=1664388272; h=from:from:sender:sender:reply-to:subject:subject:date:date: message-id:message-id:to:to:cc:cc:mime-version:mime-version: content-type:content-type:in-reply-to:in-reply-to: references:references:list-id:list-help:list-unsubscribe: list-subscribe:list-post:dkim-signature; bh=B7mhbeFhxRyd//fHCBwlMQusr0fmPJM2xa5awJ43SLM=; b=tObvZXUtAp8StYbMdnfD+8ljyDbu3kOuQpC/o3iAFCDsIC0tO47SMQkajS6wJJtmhYYgS2 Asn8KqzubCC3HBDFyeBOsbButa2d3OPPtwI9wMPcY8I2WQMOaWlwfmyyVy3OOf6rqsk/s/ 0rlRxvbRYa05UaN2uSvwvbzzSlnlmmiVmyAuHe2hVCZPMPWLyQasO1N2pf91IYDtBfo/vp OV8DSo5c6HuHdmYSnD8SrgsKjvJZUBvrKHUFJpR1DXCXut6VeZzuwPK6mw7k/I/7Hvx7AB U6IRrXcSBPUbG4YAxNBX2AvKcBC2QzC+s73pRfIj6dnvaCbSbMqgH61VxgQ5CA== ARC-Seal: i=1; s=key1; d=yhetil.org; t=1664388272; a=rsa-sha256; cv=none; b=LKLYX843OMsUNQddUMssoytccGq1kRALmsePH+ti+9j8r0A10j78zzzsj8NJAtB3wTtCg5 BdWirk0NcI1mVY07Txsz6jsGbvFE1jALPSJEvMm7Qqcrovqiw4Cloy/7qwlZjeKxLSB4Su bOPB/DayGKnSlUf0GO/sfRbi3NNmminh3mV49EWLSGdj2J2/xqYhdYHSUUUbWPWpskIysr sJDEP7LJ6VJYMJqfro9+RNvVTp0WSynjSWlfGn7Yk7luVpU2nyPVom4DKix2IUZ+GYIt6y v3iDsdY9/CXf6iUtIO5BQ9zVJiiQJ/Fq57MvMmmTGH6TOOu1vkNU5UGShRjt2Q== ARC-Authentication-Results: i=1; aspmx1.migadu.com; dkim=fail ("headers rsa verify failed") header.d=tecosaur.net header.s=fm1 header.b=j1lEe9Oz; dkim=fail ("headers rsa verify failed") header.d=messagingengine.com header.s=fm2 header.b=Brzfdy6i; dmarc=none; spf=pass (aspmx1.migadu.com: domain of "emacs-orgmode-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org" designates 209.51.188.17 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom="emacs-orgmode-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org" X-Migadu-Spam-Score: 1.55 Authentication-Results: aspmx1.migadu.com; dkim=fail ("headers rsa verify failed") header.d=tecosaur.net header.s=fm1 header.b=j1lEe9Oz; dkim=fail ("headers rsa verify failed") header.d=messagingengine.com header.s=fm2 header.b=Brzfdy6i; dmarc=none; spf=pass (aspmx1.migadu.com: domain of "emacs-orgmode-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org" designates 209.51.188.17 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom="emacs-orgmode-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org" X-Migadu-Queue-Id: 0D01315951 X-Spam-Score: 1.55 X-Migadu-Scanner: scn0.migadu.com X-TUID: bSBAHpWhoBt7 --=-=-= Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hi Tim, > None of what yuo wrote is a surprise. Unfortunately, it does mean two > things > > 1. Org mode cannot be used to create accessible PDF documents as long as > it depends on the latex environment to generate those documents. It means that Org mode cannot /currently/ be used=E2=80=A6 I have hope that in 1-2y this will change. > 2. Technically, Org mode cannot be used in any organisation (specifically= government Can=E2=80=99t comment on this. > I don=E2=80=99t know if other document processors, like perhaps pandoc, c= an > create PDF files which contain the tagging and other structural > metadatra necessary to make PDFs accessible. Pandoc=E2=80=99s PDFs via LaTeX will have exactly the same problem. > Note that org also lacks any accessibility support for HTML generated > documents as well. However, this is less problematic as authors do have > some ability to add the necessary attributes that can improve > accessibility - an option not available with Latex. HTML has more inherent structure, so this situation is already much better. > An unfortunate situation really - especially given Emacs has one of the > most powerful and advanced accessibility options available via > emacspeak. Well, Emacs is a bit divorced from this problem. > I also won=E2=80=99t hold my breath for a new latgex core. THe latex3 ini= tiative > seems to have failed or at least appears to be slower to be realised than= perl6! Hmm? LaTeX3 switched gear, and arguably is working nicely. I expect you=E2= =80=99re currently using quite a few bits of LaTeX3, even if you don=E2=80=99t know = it. The accessibility effort was started ~2y ago, seems to be making progress (stalled a bit with covid), and is funded with a roadmap. I see good reason= to think the current situation will change. All the best, Timothy --=-=-=--