From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from mp10.migadu.com ([2001:41d0:2:4a6f::]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits)) by ms5.migadu.com with LMTPS id QNKhN+Aq42KbjQAAbAwnHQ (envelope-from ) for ; Fri, 29 Jul 2022 02:33:37 +0200 Received: from aspmx1.migadu.com ([2001:41d0:2:4a6f::]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits)) by mp10.migadu.com with LMTPS id gFGYNuAq42KeEAAAG6o9tA (envelope-from ) for ; Fri, 29 Jul 2022 02:33:36 +0200 Received: from lists.gnu.org (lists.gnu.org [209.51.188.17]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by aspmx1.migadu.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 62E80C855 for ; Fri, 29 Jul 2022 02:33:36 +0200 (CEST) Received: from localhost ([::1]:56188 helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1oHDwd-00054l-0B for larch@yhetil.org; Thu, 28 Jul 2022 20:33:35 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:41078) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1oHDw1-00054R-Db for emacs-orgmode@gnu.org; Thu, 28 Jul 2022 20:32:57 -0400 Received: from mout01.posteo.de ([185.67.36.65]:37367) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1oHDvz-0006hb-1G for emacs-orgmode@gnu.org; Thu, 28 Jul 2022 20:32:57 -0400 Received: from submission (posteo.de [185.67.36.169]) by mout01.posteo.de (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 93F7024002B for ; Fri, 29 Jul 2022 02:32:50 +0200 (CEST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=posteo.net; s=2017; t=1659054770; bh=xcrCouPqz5Fq7wMp08TnFXpkdS9TEfMctzQhqWSgvp8=; h=From:To:Cc:Subject:Date:From; b=n1NicRZQIbz3XC5B0pgyIDRNLNvGyb1XpYG4I8UYMu2kbDb8xFBR0GBVvEeEOHWc9 s/+kmm99e1Txt+6gmPKk7G+jyceTBn5UEzgnhG+jMWo18QLbhV2QeDIt5kcuBTJwL3 n7pZ1C5SvDWqHN4yUNJFL0eqXRdNkUSlDxfWlnJLWX8SZ237zQ8XC/Wkr6rqOoBt0Q hxy4x/cx+webYvP4U8M0eECp6bSKBxgeOBPD3LpzIiSWPW2RmrFkPsZeJgIPtloIzR yLKShAhIhqRl5epHPiA0xv1E2ITLDbQhOY3PxcU4HjntC9ics6RDs329Sxye/W5VHR g3t/ESEM9FJFw== Received: from customer (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by submission (posteo.de) with ESMTPSA id 4Lv7lP63GXz9rxK; Fri, 29 Jul 2022 02:32:49 +0200 (CEST) From: =?utf-8?Q?Juan_Manuel_Mac=C3=ADas?= To: Ihor Radchenko Cc: orgmode Subject: Re: [PATCH] Add new entity \-- serving as markup separator/escape symbol References: <87r128d5pp.fsf@localhost> <80f0990042a564556cc6b047a94f7e9dddf5a280.camel@outlook.com> <87v8rkav2x.fsf@localhost> <87mtct9y1f.fsf@localhost> Date: Fri, 29 Jul 2022 00:32:49 +0000 In-Reply-To: <87mtct9y1f.fsf@localhost> (Ihor Radchenko's message of "Thu, 28 Jul 2022 21:17:32 +0800") Message-ID: <871qu4lpvy.fsf@posteo.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Received-SPF: pass client-ip=185.67.36.65; envelope-from=maciaschain@posteo.net; helo=mout01.posteo.de X-Spam_score_int: -43 X-Spam_score: -4.4 X-Spam_bar: ---- X-Spam_report: (-4.4 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-2.3, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, T_SCC_BODY_TEXT_LINE=-0.01 autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-BeenThere: emacs-orgmode@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: "General discussions about Org-mode." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-orgmode-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org Sender: "Emacs-orgmode" X-Migadu-Flow: FLOW_IN X-Migadu-To: larch@yhetil.org X-Migadu-Country: US ARC-Message-Signature: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=yhetil.org; s=key1; t=1659054816; h=from:from:sender:sender:reply-to:subject:subject:date:date: message-id:message-id:to:to:cc:cc:mime-version:mime-version: content-type:content-type: content-transfer-encoding:content-transfer-encoding: in-reply-to:in-reply-to:references:references:list-id:list-help: list-unsubscribe:list-subscribe:list-post:dkim-signature; bh=xcrCouPqz5Fq7wMp08TnFXpkdS9TEfMctzQhqWSgvp8=; b=p9Pzlcar9TBeK0bCdrEkvFMwXwuR+AUGpjVK4I5kZ15RMJVXJnoep+69c1Cgc2kGUE8yKy yaoUUjrTltfkgB9h0H/y6DqJqSJZarkbNBFOFGZuf75LpSRzYFjfn6pV+kyENogiu+eEaJ Z6Sigmaa0a47C06CNt55wF4/xxcVvQLkHXc5tQZCfLDzO3EvzHur4OLe6erAUOC5kiSGnc sO/5QziEWZuHME/ZjxlLlwDeQpA6DqiDYQb1Kzr4Pdzahl7rUrvgdy0jPoWlHJziGPrld7 2DNeCuiEd3yXYWPjSEzIWGdHBe7J950Iv70/UXoPWzTk91iQAb+vkT6lS/1MaA== ARC-Seal: i=1; s=key1; d=yhetil.org; t=1659054816; a=rsa-sha256; cv=none; b=QW6tWABmh2JYcwkx5Ccii0StjdWawax6DjdELLY1OvUjAC96sKAKpPDTDQsqT+2izKB3qB JA8/RHrvgLiFJptbwoNc2hAFu8LWtZlmrIVaFq9inlCQYzQJbimCVU8+WIkEo/GgJoP92c ODQnfrYYErxxB5cDqdRSYzsC/5UH3+WO3QO3pK3PjJeWOmfj3tHqRIF3gYhYtvGx9D9btk X5kqgAE+n6vARS8rb+LYM+nSVUtDnhHTSKHSGb31BugbiOmY0WkFyBtO8/IMGDSc1b60Zt X4/zLDsgoWbC2prREzhsV+5Ua2v5M1+r/Rd1cJs+d3wRu6MHPmC/GBoCZbuE6w== ARC-Authentication-Results: i=1; aspmx1.migadu.com; dkim=pass header.d=posteo.net header.s=2017 header.b=n1NicRZQ; dmarc=pass (policy=none) header.from=posteo.net; spf=pass (aspmx1.migadu.com: domain of "emacs-orgmode-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org" designates 209.51.188.17 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom="emacs-orgmode-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org" X-Migadu-Spam-Score: -3.93 Authentication-Results: aspmx1.migadu.com; dkim=pass header.d=posteo.net header.s=2017 header.b=n1NicRZQ; dmarc=pass (policy=none) header.from=posteo.net; spf=pass (aspmx1.migadu.com: domain of "emacs-orgmode-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org" designates 209.51.188.17 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom="emacs-orgmode-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org" X-Migadu-Queue-Id: 62E80C855 X-Spam-Score: -3.93 X-Migadu-Scanner: scn0.migadu.com X-TUID: 4Pw1rmosbLg6 Hi, Ihor, Ihor Radchenko writes: > Given the raised objections, zero-width space does not appear to be a > useful escape symbol because it has its valid uses as a standalone space > symbol. > > The raised objections can be solved using some kind of intricate > heuristics, but I do not feel like it is a good direction to go. The > code will be too complex and fragile. > > Therefore, I am proposing a different approach for shielding > fontification: introducing a special entity. > > The new entity is \--, which is a valid boundary between emphasis > markup. It will be removed during export (replaced by ""). > > "\--" specifically is somewhat arbitrary choice. The actual requirements > for the entity name are: (1) No clash with LaTeX (which is why simpler > \- would not cut it); (2) Being a valid markup boundary: entity must end > with (any space ?- ?\( ?' ?\" ?\{). > > I am attaching a tentative patch introducing the new entity. Note that > some minor tweaks to the parser were needed. I do not see it as a big > deal - the current entity regexp has much more cumbersome exceptions. > > Also, the patch will not work correctly on org =E2=86=92 org export, simi= lar to > pointed in one of the replies to the previous abandoned approach. I do > not want to address it here because a much more appropriate solution for > this issue is changing org-element-interpret-data. > > Consider (org-element-interpret-data '("asd" (bold () "bold") "bsd")) > This will return "asd*bold*bsd", which is not correct even though the > given Org datum is not wrong by itself - such things can easily appear > when user filters are applied to parse tree during org=E2=86=92org export. > > Otherwise, the patch should be good enough to play around and kick-start > the discussion. I'm late joining this thread, although I am particularly interested in the topic. I can't make any technical comments because I haven't had time to test the patch yet, but I have to say that your idea of using a special entity seems to me the best approach to the problem. I would vote for this to be the way to go. I believe that using the zero width space character as an escape character is not a happy idea, and I have already left my arguments in some other thread, long ago. The zero width space is a random workaround, but should not (in my opinion) be part of the markup. For various reasons: it is not an ascii character, there are certain contexts in which it can produce an unexpected result in LaTeX, etc. In addition, the zero width space, as an escape character, has a curious anomaly: it is an escape character that does not have a plan B and a way to escape the escape character when you want to use it by itself. I also like the idea of using a special entity because it is not necessary to invent anything new and it takes advantage of an existing resource. Well, that's my opinion. Best regards, Juan Manuel