From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by arlo.cworth.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6C60A6DE01ED for ; Wed, 14 Feb 2018 21:37:58 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at cworth.org X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: 0.48 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=0.48 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-0.172, SPF_NEUTRAL=0.652] autolearn=disabled Received: from arlo.cworth.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (arlo.cworth.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id xzJAJE1YSgAH for ; Wed, 14 Feb 2018 21:37:56 -0800 (PST) Received: from guru.guru-group.fi (guru.guru-group.fi [46.183.73.34]) by arlo.cworth.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 142116DE01EC for ; Wed, 14 Feb 2018 21:37:54 -0800 (PST) Received: from guru.guru-group.fi (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by guru.guru-group.fi (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0E519100033; Thu, 15 Feb 2018 07:37:54 +0200 (EET) From: Tomi Ollila To: "W. Trevor King" , Daniel Kahn Gillmor Cc: Notmuch Mail Subject: Re: [PATCH] nmbug: explicitly prefer python3 In-Reply-To: <20180212175333.GA23662@valgrind.us> References: <20180209043211.4792-1-dkg@fifthhorseman.net> <20180209171257.GG30368@valgrind.us> <87bmgyt3gf.fsf@fifthhorseman.net> <20180209204624.GL30368@valgrind.us> <87tvumrhcb.fsf@fifthhorseman.net> <20180212175333.GA23662@valgrind.us> User-Agent: Notmuch/0.26~rc0+5~gaec2eb0 (https://notmuchmail.org) Emacs/25.2.1 (x86_64-unknown-linux-gnu) X-Face: HhBM'cA~ MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-BeenThere: notmuch@notmuchmail.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.26 Precedence: list List-Id: "Use and development of the notmuch mail system." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 15 Feb 2018 05:37:58 -0000 On Mon, Feb 12 2018, W. Trevor King wrote: > On Sun, Feb 11, 2018 at 10:56:36PM -0500, Daniel Kahn Gillmor wrote: >> On Fri 2018-02-09 12:46:24 -0800, W. Trevor King wrote: >> > From later on in PEP 394 [1]: >> > >> > It is anticipated that there will eventually come a time where >> > the third party ecosystem surrounding Python 3 is sufficiently >> > mature for this recommendation to be updated to suggest that the >> > python symlink refer to python3 rather than python2. >> > >> > And from right up at the beginning [2]: >> > >> > however, end users should be aware that python refers to python3 >> > on at least Arch Linux (that change is what prompted the >> > creation of this PEP), so python should be used in the shebang >> > line only for scripts that are source compatible with both >> > Python 2 and 3. >> > >> > On my Gentoo system, I've also selected Python 3 to back =E2=80=98pyth= on=E2=80=99. >> > So I think your solution should be =E2=80=9Cadd a /usr/bin/python syml= ink >> > to your python3=E2=80=9D, not =E2=80=9Cclaim that nmbug is only compat= ible with >> > Python 3=E2=80=9D. >>=20 >> Presumably you still have /usr/bin/python3 in addition to >> /usr/bin/python as well. So the one thing i think we're both >> agreeing on is that we use nmbug with python 3. > > Yup. But I'm not sure that is the case for all nmbug users. > >> It looks to me like you're asking me to change my operating system >> to accomodate your naming preference. > > No, I'm asking you to change your operating system to accommodate PEP > 394's naming preferences. As PEP 394 points out, Arch made the switch > to using =E2=80=98python=E2=80=99 for =E2=80=98python3=E2=80=99 long ago.= You'd just be following > their lead. > >> I'm asking that we put the onus on developers who really insist on >> using nmbug with python 2.7 maintain their own local patch against >> nmbug, rather than other developers either modifying their local >> operating system in potentially disastrous ways (/usr/bin/python as >> python3 would cause severe breakage for at least one python2-only >> tool i rely on daily, sadly)=E2=80=A6 > > That Python-2-only tool should be using python2 in its shebang. This > is exactly the sort of issue that PEP 394 was created to address. > Once you patch that tool to follow PEP 394, you should have no problem > adjusting your system to also follow PEP 394. > >> =E2=80=A6 or carrying their own local patch against nmbug. > > A shebang with =E2=80=98python=E2=80=99 should work with everyone (and it= 's what PEP > 394 recommends for scripts that work with both Python major versions). > The only folks who would need a local patch would be folks with > systems like your current plan that contain no =E2=80=98python=E2=80=99 c= ommand at > all. I see no upside to such systems, while I do see upsides to > systems with just a =E2=80=98python2=E2=80=99 (and a =E2=80=98python=E2= =80=99 alias for it) or just a > =E2=80=98python3=E2=80=99 (and a =E2=80=98python=E2=80=99 alias for it). > >> i'll drop this request now because i don't understand the origin of >> the strength of your reaction, and already wish i'd spent the time >> i've lost on it on something more productive :( I hope if you change >> your mind you'll come back and recommend it here. > > I like nmbug and have put some time into it. But I'm not the notmuch > maintainer, and as you point out, nmbug would still work for me with a > python3 shebang. So if the maintainers want to switch to python3 it's > no skin off my back. They can always wait and field requests from any > python2-only users if/when those users file complaints (which may be > never). Thank you both for interesting read. Based on these I cannot say which way this should go (personally I prefer faster conversion to python3 but perhaps that is not good readson to put python3 in hashbang). In this case I value Trevor as valid notmuch maintainer as anyone else who has done significant work for nmbug. Tomi > > Cheers, > Trevor > > --=20 > This email may be signed or encrypted with GnuPG (http://www.gnupg.org). > For more information, see http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pretty_Good_Privacy