From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from mp0 ([2001:41d0:2:bcc0::]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits)) by ms0.migadu.com with LMTPS id yHJ4BsFBpmH5LwEAgWs5BA (envelope-from ) for ; Tue, 30 Nov 2021 16:22:41 +0100 Received: from aspmx1.migadu.com ([2001:41d0:2:bcc0::]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits)) by mp0 with LMTPS id gBZOAsFBpmHGQAAA1q6Kng (envelope-from ) for ; Tue, 30 Nov 2021 15:22:41 +0000 Received: from lists.gnu.org (lists.gnu.org [209.51.188.17]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by aspmx1.migadu.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 1BE5815E68 for ; Tue, 30 Nov 2021 16:22:40 +0100 (CET) Received: from localhost ([::1]:41672 helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1ms4xr-0005MA-6O for larch@yhetil.org; Tue, 30 Nov 2021 10:22:39 -0500 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([209.51.188.92]:58192) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1ms4xd-0005LW-F9 for guix-devel@gnu.org; Tue, 30 Nov 2021 10:22:25 -0500 Received: from mail-40135.protonmail.ch ([185.70.40.135]:60483) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1ms4xb-00026e-Gq for guix-devel@gnu.org; Tue, 30 Nov 2021 10:22:25 -0500 Date: Tue, 30 Nov 2021 15:22:04 +0000 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=protonmail.com; s=protonmail; t=1638285733; bh=fiJAVAgastIBBy3/3yMi/CprH7DxeadkOStxO55+BKk=; h=Date:To:From:Cc:Reply-To:Subject:In-Reply-To:References:From; b=AdM85+/2zJRZ+ROjXNZAhYPGXlM2uG7fDYLt361V31oue/KZKEsjlatHHteR/5RWy +q4HFhRbli08ZVI7vC8c2GG3gmXXGjVdEeXM5L4ID6Tk4jbzKwQnqtmwguU24currl CtmRRxIg1vzlcNnVUXZAGyR9Ott/C5XfPjghTM/g= To: Denis 'GNUtoo' Carikli From: raid5atemyhomework Cc: Vagrant Cascadian , "pelzflorian (Florian Pelz)" , "guix-devel@gnu.org" , Domagoj Stolfa Subject: Re: ZFS part of Guix? RFC? 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List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Reply-To: raid5atemyhomework Errors-To: guix-devel-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org Sender: "Guix-devel" X-Migadu-Flow: FLOW_IN X-Migadu-Country: US ARC-Message-Signature: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=yhetil.org; s=key1; t=1638285760; h=from:from:sender:sender:reply-to:reply-to:subject:subject:date:date: message-id:message-id:to:to:cc:cc:mime-version:mime-version: content-type:content-type: content-transfer-encoding:content-transfer-encoding: in-reply-to:in-reply-to:references:references:list-id:list-help: list-unsubscribe:list-subscribe:list-post:dkim-signature; bh=fiJAVAgastIBBy3/3yMi/CprH7DxeadkOStxO55+BKk=; b=XYMysT/AfKr5zjzGVF75W2wNa57gXXtNNsYt9kpl7fY9BmUINSnTJSkOohYtT0AQKNDFpo EqAyFE2NlcdAnQA0zTlMHa9xQpLqGmS01yGi2BM93GDhTVet428+yR0KfXxwPGKd+3lOuj zza1cEN78uJY0oSN9tdPTPSiY7RejeOn4Q6Vm6mSDGBP8VeqrfmSmWuzipXkB27H33Y2PU EUjkh97DynYkBwCaz+uCFGIXc1ADrAEz58xQ1ZYBZOQLguTNylESMUJd/1x/G7GiLpfopT dvR1sOV4vS0Cv4K0/MGWCj4rlNPc2/hqNogMNc+tVX+mtH4X0IKG0WinEy1N3w== ARC-Seal: i=1; s=key1; d=yhetil.org; t=1638285760; a=rsa-sha256; cv=none; b=svnTIKKGrCBFDsYGjQ3UG/8MKjJm5nP7Y1EflKRjEHRnV3WzzatGfp6J51Hldi/sHLvyzr 9TOkP1gBZrxn8kmAk51sd5mTjseZTXr3i6wx+10+8vua/UQKeivKAjcjt5SloxOalEOYB7 Vtalh0Skkq383aA7eI5kk+swOlaIZQLEatPwZHTGkCjF/pWZzfuYB/qn4q1q5b1s/ILwfW IBluBhnXgqoxGUZSpWFle7zMD7giYz+allkBW8b0B1oYNIrhScf7nUkZAgPiJz7NkagRAz aDezZWqF8d1Lvpg2/JviP9YIMtURczr79lsztYHWccN97f+v5T+ULVvKjetEIg== ARC-Authentication-Results: i=1; aspmx1.migadu.com; dkim=pass header.d=protonmail.com header.s=protonmail header.b="AdM85+/2"; dmarc=pass (policy=quarantine) header.from=protonmail.com; spf=pass (aspmx1.migadu.com: domain of "guix-devel-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org" designates 209.51.188.17 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom="guix-devel-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org" X-Migadu-Spam-Score: -3.11 Authentication-Results: aspmx1.migadu.com; dkim=pass header.d=protonmail.com header.s=protonmail header.b="AdM85+/2"; dmarc=pass (policy=quarantine) header.from=protonmail.com; spf=pass (aspmx1.migadu.com: domain of "guix-devel-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org" designates 209.51.188.17 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom="guix-devel-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org" X-Migadu-Queue-Id: 1BE5815E68 X-Spam-Score: -3.11 X-Migadu-Scanner: scn0.migadu.com X-TUID: a7UARR2e3hs6 Hello Denis, > While thinking about this very weird case of combining GPL and CDDL > code together, I wonder if the fact that we can't redistribute binaries > still makes it free software. AS I understood from early writings of GNU --- "Freedom" here is the freedom to modify how *the hardware you purchased, wh= ich is supposedly your own*, works. In principle, "binaries are enough", because you *can* modify executable bi= naries, and until Tivoization you could thus modify how the hardware you pu= rchased and is supposedly owned by you works. However, early GNU writers (= RMS I think?) noted that binaries are really awful and that you need source= code in order to modify how your hardware work, unless you are willing to = sacrifice a ridiculous portion of your life reverse-engineering executable = binaries. As long as the source code is redistributable, users can modify the source = code (without having to sacrifice too much of their limited lifetimes to th= e gods of extreme programming) and thereby modify how the hardware they pur= chased works. Thus, the essential freedom is preserved (users can fork ZFS and point thei= r personal ZFS package definition at their fork), even if a legal snag prev= ents redistribution of binaries. I am well aware that *somebody* at Sun Microsystems screwed up by inventing= the CDDL and putting the excellent ZFS under the CDDL and that is certainl= y a very cringey decision, but I want my hardware to work how I want it (i.= e. without RAID5 write holes and memory buffer corruption bugs like in BTRF= S "RAID5" mode) and not having ZFS on Guix is not helping that essential fr= eedom. Thanks raid5atemyhomework