Specifying rust version

Specifying rust version

[phodina via]

Hi,

the documentation for 'cargo-build-system' [1] refers to parameter '#:rust' which allows user to specify the Rust compiler version.

However, I've found this commit 9635119a61a9ab1b023558727fcdf1816fdc7fc6 from Maxim which makes all 'rust-.*' definitions private.

Is there a way to specify newer Rust compiler? Something like 'rust-next'?

The package requires version 1.62 but the current is 1.60. Also both version are already defined. What's missing is just way to select them.

[1] https://guix.gnu.org/manual/en/html_node/Build-Systems.html

EDIT: Add help-guix@gnu.org to list of recipients.
----
Petr

------- Forwarded Message -------
From: phodina <phodina@protonmail.com>
Date: On Monday, December 26th, 2022 at 9:39 AM
Subject: Specifying rust version
To: Maxim Cournoyer <maxim.cournoyer@gmail.com>, Efraim Flashner <efraim@flashner.co.il>

> Hi,
>
> the documentation for 'cargo-build-system' [1] refers to parameter '#:rust' which allows user to specify the Rust compiler version.
>
> However, I've found this commit 9635119a61a9ab1b023558727fcdf1816fdc7fc6 from Maxim which makes all 'rust-.*' definitions private.
>
> Is there a way to specify newer Rust compiler? Something like 'rust-next'?
>
> The package requires version 1.62 but the current is 1.60. Also both version are already defined. What's missing is just way to select them.
>
> [1] https://guix.gnu.org/manual/en/html_node/Build-Systems.html
>
> ----
> Petr

Re: Specifying rust version

[Efraim Flashner]

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On Mon, Dec 26, 2022 at 09:00:40AM +0000, phodina wrote:
> Hi,
> 
> the documentation for 'cargo-build-system' [1] refers to parameter
> '#:rust' which allows user to specify the Rust compiler version.
> However, I've found this commit
> 9635119a61a9ab1b023558727fcdf1816fdc7fc6 from Maxim which makes all
> 'rust-.*' definitions private.  Is there a way to specify newer Rust
> compiler? Something like 'rust-next'?  The package requires version
> 1.62 but the current is 1.60. Also both version are already defined.
> What's missing is just way to select them.
> 
> [1] https://guix.gnu.org/manual/en/html_node/Build-Systems.html
> 

I checked gnu/packages/rust.scm and it looks like the rust packages
aren't hidden but actually not exported. If they were just hidden then
you could still do `#:rust ,rust-1.62`. Since they're actually not
exported you need to use the not-really-supported `@@` to refer to that
variable, so you'd have to use something like:
#:rust ,(@@ (gnu packages rust) rust-1.62)

Given how it would be useful to have access to newer rust versions I
think it'd be worthwhile to make a post in guix-devel about making the
newer versions of rust use define-public but be hidden, so they can be
used as expected for the #:rust keyword.


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Re: Specifying rust version

[Maxim Cournoyer]

Hello,

Efraim Flashner <efraim@flashner.co.il> writes:

> On Mon, Dec 26, 2022 at 09:00:40AM +0000, phodina wrote:
>> Hi,
>>
>> the documentation for 'cargo-build-system' [1] refers to parameter
>> '#:rust' which allows user to specify the Rust compiler version.
>> However, I've found this commit
>> 9635119a61a9ab1b023558727fcdf1816fdc7fc6 from Maxim which makes all
>> 'rust-.*' definitions private.  Is there a way to specify newer Rust
>> compiler? Something like 'rust-next'?  The package requires version
>> 1.62 but the current is 1.60. Also both version are already defined.
>> What's missing is just way to select them.
>>
>> [1] https://guix.gnu.org/manual/en/html_node/Build-Systems.html
>>
>
> I checked gnu/packages/rust.scm and it looks like the rust packages
> aren't hidden but actually not exported. If they were just hidden then
> you could still do `#:rust ,rust-1.62`. Since they're actually not
> exported you need to use the not-really-supported `@@` to refer to that
> variable, so you'd have to use something like:
> #:rust ,(@@ (gnu packages rust) rust-1.62)

Normally only the newest released Rust version is supported by upstream,
so what we should do is add a newer rust and use it by default.

The reasons previous rust versions are not exported is because they
aren't intended to be used by applications; they are built using
'--stage=1' to speed up compilation, which creates slower binaries and
may expose ABI stability problems (*if I remember the rust people's
explanation correctly).

When adding new version of rust, we move all the tests and final rust
version specifics to the leaf (last) rust version, and keep the
intermediary rusts minimal (no test, no tools, stage=1, etc.)

> Given how it would be useful to have access to newer rust versions I
> think it'd be worthwhile to make a post in guix-devel about making the
> newer versions of rust use define-public but be hidden, so they can be
> used as expected for the #:rust keyword.

It's typical that build system or services expose a way for the user to
use a variant of a package, but in the case of rust, I don't think it
should be advertised as a way to use different rust versions (given only
the last version is supported by upstream, e.g. sometimes fixing CVEs).

-- 
Thanks,
Maxim

Re: Specifying rust version

[phodina]

Hi,

>> the documentation for 'cargo-build-system' [1] refers to parameter
>> '#:rust' which allows user to specify the Rust compiler version.
>> However, I've found this commit
>> 9635119a61a9ab1b023558727fcdf1816fdc7fc6 from Maxim which makes all
>> 'rust-.*' definitions private.  Is there a way to specify newer Rust
>> compiler? Something like 'rust-next'?  The package requires version
>> 1.62 but the current is 1.60. Also both version are already defined.
>> What's missing is just way to select them.
>> 
>> [1] https://guix.gnu.org/manual/en/html_node/Build-Systems.html
>> 
>
> I checked gnu/packages/rust.scm and it looks like the rust packages
> aren't hidden but actually not exported. If they were just hidden then
> you could still do `#:rust ,rust-1.62`. Since they're actually not
> exported you need to use the not-really-supported `@@` to refer to that
> variable, so you'd have to use something like:
> #:rust ,(@@ (gnu packages rust) rust-1.62)

Thanks Efraim, this is exactly what I've been looking for atm as temporary
hack.

> Given how it would be useful to have access to newer rust versions I
> think it'd be worthwhile to make a post in guix-devel about making the
> newer versions of rust use define-public but be hidden, so they can be
> used as expected for the #:rust keyword.

It would be definitely great to have access to the latest packaged version
of rust. However, I understand this will trigger a lot of rebuilds.

> > > 
> > > the documentation for 'cargo-build-system' [1] refers to parameter
> > > '#:rust' which allows user to specify the Rust compiler version.
> > > However, I've found this commit
> > > 9635119a61a9ab1b023558727fcdf1816fdc7fc6 from Maxim which makes all
> > > 'rust-.*' definitions private. Is there a way to specify newer Rust
> > > compiler? Something like 'rust-next'? The package requires version
> > > 1.62 but the current is 1.60. Also both version are already defined.
> > > What's missing is just way to select them.
> > > 
> > > [1] https://guix.gnu.org/manual/en/html_node/Build-Systems.html
> > 
> > I checked gnu/packages/rust.scm and it looks like the rust packages
> > aren't hidden but actually not exported. If they were just hidden then
> > you could still do `#:rust ,rust-1.62`. Since they're actually not
> > exported you need to use the not-really-supported `@@` to refer to that
> > variable, so you'd have to use something like:
> > #:rust ,(@@ (gnu packages rust) rust-1.62)
> 
> 
> Normally only the newest released Rust version is supported by upstream,
> so what we should do is add a newer rust and use it by default.
> 
> The reasons previous rust versions are not exported is because they
> aren't intended to be used by applications; they are built using
> '--stage=1' to speed up compilation, which creates slower binaries and
> may expose ABI stability problems (*if I remember the rust people's
> explanation correctly).
> 
> When adding new version of rust, we move all the tests and final rust
> version specifics to the leaf (last) rust version, and keep the
> intermediary rusts minimal (no test, no tools, stage=1, etc.)
> 
> > Given how it would be useful to have access to newer rust versions I
> > think it'd be worthwhile to make a post in guix-devel about making the
> > newer versions of rust use define-public but be hidden, so they can be
> > used as expected for the #:rust keyword.
> 
> 
> It's typical that build system or services expose a way for the user to
> use a variant of a package, but in the case of rust, I don't think it
> should be advertised as a way to use different rust versions (given only
> the last version is supported by upstream, e.g. sometimes fixing CVEs).

I have to agree with you that this is just an anti-pattern and the #:rust
should not be advertised.

The best approach would be to add new rust version and switch to it.

So do you think Maxim the `#:rust` parameter should be dropped and the
documentation also removed?

I guess same approach would apply for antioxidant-build-system, right? [1]

1 https://notabug.org/maximed/cargoless-rust-experiments

----
Petr

Re: Specifying rust version

[Maxim Cournoyer]

Hi,

phodina <phodina@protonmail.com> writes:

[...]

>> It's typical that build system or services expose a way for the user to
>> use a variant of a package, but in the case of rust, I don't think it
>> should be advertised as a way to use different rust versions (given only
>> the last version is supported by upstream, e.g. sometimes fixing CVEs).
>
> I have to agree with you that this is just an anti-pattern and the #:rust
> should not be advertised.
>
> The best approach would be to add new rust version and switch to it.
>
> So do you think Maxim the `#:rust` parameter should be dropped and the
> documentation also removed?

I don't think it needs to be dropped, as it can be useful for
experimentation.  Sometimes, newer rust may be needed and the work to
update the entire collection (with the risks it entails or the build
time) deferred, in which case it could be used.  It's preferable though
to do the work to package the latest and greatest rust and rebuild the
whole collection with it, on a branch though.

I hope that helps,

-- 
Thanks,
Maxim