From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 From: Omar Radwan Subject: Re: [ART] Background image for GRUB Date: Wed, 5 Nov 2014 07:21:54 -0800 Message-ID: References: <54594B40.9040008@openmailbox.org> <545951BE.5080301@gnu.org> <87tx2d6aog.fsf@gnu.org> <545A2FAF.3030103@gnu.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=001a113d593acfb6d205071e2317 Return-path: Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:4830:134:3::10]:46604) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1Xm2PF-0003xc-1M for guix-devel@gnu.org; Wed, 05 Nov 2014 10:21:58 -0500 Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1Xm2PD-0008SP-Ne for guix-devel@gnu.org; Wed, 05 Nov 2014 10:21:56 -0500 In-Reply-To: <545A2FAF.3030103@gnu.org> List-Id: "Development of GNU Guix and the GNU System distribution." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: guix-devel-bounces+gcggd-guix-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Sender: guix-devel-bounces+gcggd-guix-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org To: =?UTF-8?Q?Bruno_F=C3=A9lix_Rezende_Ribeiro?= , guix-devel@gnu.org --001a113d593acfb6d205071e2317 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable >I wonder if RMS has a good argument to justify his insistence in the >truthfulness of the equation 'GNU =3D GNU/Hurd' beyond the well-known >historical and technical ones. I see where you get that idea from. Linux-libre is just a deblobbed fork of the Linux kernel and the project which manages Linux-libre is a GNU project, But it's not the real GNU kernel, so it would still have to be called GNU/Linux-libre, or GNU/Linux. And with Linux-libre, and almost all forked projects that I have ever seen(MATE, Trinity, illumos, openIndiana, and the *BSD's to some extent), there is usually too much code for the project to handle, and it becomes a mess. The Linux kernel is approximately ~10 million lines of code, with a huge team, very hard to just fork it and make it your own. While the HURD is much smaller(with Mach I think I've read somewhere that it's about 200,000 lines of code) codebase wise. And it is written in GNU C style and doesn't have many small "hack" or shortcuts taken by the Linux kernel to achieve very fast speeds. On Wed, Nov 5, 2014 at 6:09 AM, Bruno F=C3=A9lix Rezende Ribeiro < oitofelix@gnu.org> wrote: > ludo@gnu.org (Ludovic Court=C3=A8s) wrote: > > > Agreed. But note that RMS asked me to not insist on calling the OS > > =E2=80=9Cthe GNU system=E2=80=9D, at least for now (AIUI, his main conc= ern is that > > GNU =3D GNU/Hurd, which is not currently supported.) > > I wonder if RMS has a good argument to justify his insistence in the > truthfulness of the equation 'GNU =3D GNU/Hurd' beyond the well-known > historical and technical ones. > > From a strategical perspective, I fail to see why the distinction > between GNU/Linux-libre and GNU/Hurd could be of any relevance. IMHO, > calling both simply "GNU" would help in the promotion of the GNU > project and its ideals. That would not cause confusion, because GNU > would be defined as an operating system of multiple kernels, and > technical-inclined people would always know how to tell the difference > when needed or appropriate. > > -- > ,=3D ,-_-. =3D. Bruno F=C3=A9lix Rezende Ribeiro (oitofelix) [0x28D618A= F] > ((_/)o o(\_)) There is no system but GNU; > `-'(. .)`-' GNU Linux-Libre is one of its official kernels; > \_/ All software must be free as in freedom; > > > --001a113d593acfb6d205071e2317 Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
>I wonder if RMS has a good argument to justify his insi= stence in the
>truthfulness of the equation 'GNU =3D GNU/Hurd'= beyond the well-known
>historical and technical ones.
I see where you get that idea from. Linux-libre is just a de= blobbed fork of the Linux kernel and the=C2=A0project=C2=A0which manages Li= nux-libre is a GNU project,=C2=A0
But = it's not the real GNU kernel, so it would still have to be called GNU/L= inux-libre, or GNU/Linux. And with Linux-libre, and almost all forked proje= cts that I have ever seen(MATE, Trinity, illumos, openIndiana, and the *BSD= 's to some extent), there is usually too much code for the project to h= andle, and it becomes a mess. The Linux kernel is approximately ~10 million= lines of code, with a huge team, very hard to just fork it and make it you= r own. While the HURD is much smaller(with Mach I think I've read somew= here that it's about 200,000 lines of code) codebase wise. And it is wr= itten in GNU C style and doesn't have many small "hack" or sh= ortcuts taken by the Linux kernel to achieve very fast speeds.
On Wed, Nov 5, 2014 at 6:09 AM, Bruno F=C3=A9lix Rezende = Ribeiro <oitofelix@gnu.org> wrote:
ludo@gnu.org (Ludovic Court=C3=A8s) wrote:

> Agreed.=C2=A0 But note that RMS asked me to not insist on calling the = OS
> =E2=80=9Cthe GNU system=E2=80=9D, at least for now (AIUI, his main con= cern is that
> GNU =3D GNU/Hurd, which is not currently supported.)

I wonder if RMS has a good argument to justify his insistence in the=
truthfulness of the equation 'GNU =3D GNU/Hurd' beyond the well-kno= wn
historical and technical ones.

>From a strategical perspective, I fail to see why the distinction
between GNU/Linux-libre and GNU/Hurd could be of any relevance.=C2=A0 IMHO,=
calling both simply "GNU" would help in the promotion of the GNU<= br> project and its ideals.=C2=A0 That would not cause confusion, because GNU would be defined as an operating system of multiple kernels, and
technical-inclined people would always know how to tell the difference
when needed or appropriate.

--
=C2=A0,=3D ,-_-. =3D.=C2=A0 Bruno F=C3=A9lix Rezende Ribeiro (oitofelix) [0= x28D618AF]
((_/)o o(\_)) There is no system but GNU;
=C2=A0`-'(. .)`-'=C2=A0 GNU Linux-Libre is one of its official kern= els;
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0\_/=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 All software must be free as in= freedom;



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