From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 From: Christopher Lemmer Webber Subject: Re: my latest blog post Date: Sat, 09 Jun 2018 10:29:13 -0500 Message-ID: <87a7s4htbq.fsf@dustycloud.org> References: <877enaimsn.fsf@fastmail.com> <87po11j46q.fsf@dustycloud.org> <87k1r91hkp.fsf@elephly.net> <877en8171p.fsf@elephly.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Return-path: Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:4830:134:3::10]:37945) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1fRfnp-0001sS-Ur for guix-devel@gnu.org; Sat, 09 Jun 2018 11:29:18 -0400 Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1fRfnm-0000j9-Pn for guix-devel@gnu.org; Sat, 09 Jun 2018 11:29:17 -0400 Received: from dustycloud.org ([50.116.34.160]:34098) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.0:DHE_RSA_AES_256_CBC_SHA1:32) (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1fRfnm-0000iz-KE for guix-devel@gnu.org; Sat, 09 Jun 2018 11:29:14 -0400 In-reply-to: List-Id: "Development of GNU Guix and the GNU System distribution." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: guix-devel-bounces+gcggd-guix-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Sender: "Guix-devel" To: Catonano , guix-devel Catonano writes: > Instead of calling me an hopeless moron unwilling to learn, he went and > updated Skribilo, without saying a single word > > I noticed > > And I appreciated it > > So, yes, it was aggressie indeed > > Again. I'll try to be more complete later I think it's great that Ludovic responded so nicely with Skribilo. Though I read what Ricardo wrote... I think he never called you anything of the sort, and if I had read only your email I would have gotten the impression that he had (I am not sure if this is what you intended here, maybe you were referring to something else, but I think it applies to at least the comment where you interpreted what Ricardo said as "f--- you"). If I were in Ricardo's situation I think I would feel very hurt. I think part of the conflict here is you're saying you're seeing some things that you think are clearly missing from the project, and here are some things that you'd like to see changed, and here are some things you are offering to change. And that I think is very good. But you are also identifying some things you'd like to see changed that you don't yet know how to change. Ricardo is suggesting that you learn more about them and jump in to help change them. Is this a hostile thing to do? Well, if it were used as a way to dismiss the request entirely, probably. But what I think Ricardo is trying to say is that the Guile community is resource-strapped (which it is, being run by volunteers). We cannot demand that anyone who is volunteering work on a specific thing, but we can ask and make suggestions. And one excellent way to make changes happen is to learn and step into the role of making them happen. Not everyone can, and this is true and I fully agree. To that end, I think that's where bug reports come in, and making an appeal to the community to work on a specific thing is useful. But I also think that it is true that everyone can help in some ways, and that we also remember that everyone is volunteering. We cannot expect that everything that we would like done will be done because all volunteers only have so much energy. To that end, a call to "please help" is not necessarily dismissive... it may be a call to ask you to be empowered, and a call to say that your contributions would be welcome and appreciated. Most importantly, I think we should not put negative words in another person's mouth that they did not say or intend. I linked "Assume Good Faith" earlier because I think we cannot build a strong community together without doing so. To put more negative words in place of what someone said puts them on the defensive and makes it hard to come towards further progress. This is a collaborative game... let's recognize that, and all work together to make it a better place.