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Sun, 17 Mar 2024 12:28:11 -0400 (EDT) References: <87il1mupco.fsf@meson> <6f47e0b6-2045-ae2d-379c-1b8dd8c3b39a@fannys.me> User-agent: mu4e 1.8.13; emacs 28.2 From: Ian Eure To: MSavoritias Cc: Lars-Dominik Braun , Ryan Prior , guix-devel Subject: Re: Concerns/questions around Software Heritage Archive Date: Sun, 17 Mar 2024 09:20:19 -0700 In-reply-to: <6f47e0b6-2045-ae2d-379c-1b8dd8c3b39a@fannys.me> Message-ID: <87a5mwvn52.fsf@meson> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Received-SPF: pass client-ip=64.147.123.157; envelope-from=ian@retrospec.tv; helo=wfhigh6-smtp.messagingengine.com X-Spam_score_int: -27 X-Spam_score: -2.8 X-Spam_bar: -- X-Spam_report: (-2.8 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-0.7, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, T_SCC_BODY_TEXT_LINE=-0.01 autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-BeenThere: guix-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: "Development of GNU Guix and the GNU System distribution." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: guix-devel-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org Sender: guix-devel-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org X-Migadu-Flow: FLOW_IN X-Migadu-Country: US X-Migadu-Spam-Score: -9.49 X-Spam-Score: -9.49 X-Migadu-Queue-Id: 6ED336CC99 X-Migadu-Scanner: mx11.migadu.com X-TUID: NjX+L2qYGhqQ MSavoritias writes: > On 3/17/24 11:39, Lars-Dominik Braun wrote: >> Hey, >> >>> I have heard folks in the Guix maintenance sphere claim that=20 >>> we >> never rewrite git history in Guix, as a matter of policy. I=20 >> believe >> we should revisit that policy (is it actually written=20 >> anywhere?) >> with an eye towards possible exceptions, and develop a=20 >> mechanism for >> securely maintaining continuity of Guix installations after=20 >> history >> has been rewritten so that we maintain this as a technical >> possibility in the future, even if we should choose to use it >> sparingly. >> the fallout of rewriting Guix=E2=80=99 git history would be=20 >> devastating. It >> would break every single Guix installation, because >> >> a) `guix pull` authenticates commits and we might lose our=20 >> trust anchor >> if we rewrite history earlier than the introduction of this=20 >> feature, >> b) `guix pull` outright rejects changes to the commit history=20 >> to prevent >> downgrade attacks. >> >> Additionally it would break every single existing usage of the >> time machine and thereby completely defeat the goal of=20 >> providing >> reproducible software environments since the commit hash is=20 >> used to >> identify the point in time to jump to. >> >> I doubt developing =E2=80=9Cmechanisms=E2=80=9D =E2=80=93 whatever they = look like =E2=80=93=20 >> would >> be worth the effort. Our contributors matter, but so do our=20 >> users. Never >> ever rewriting our git history is a tradeoff we should make for=20 >> our users. >> >> Lars >> >> > Thats a good point. in the sense that its a tradeoff here and I > absolutely agree. > > > But let me add some food for thought here: > > 1. Were the social aspects considered when the system came into=20 > place? > > 2. Is it more important for the system to stay as is than to=20 > welcome > new contributors? > > 3. You mention "its a tradeoff we should make for our=20 > users". How many > trans people where involved in that decision and how much did=20 > their > opinion matter in this? > > > I am saying this because giving power to people(what is called=20 > users) > is not only handling them code or make sure everything is free > software. > > Its also the hard part of making sure the voices of people that=20 > can > not code is heard and is participating and taking in mind. > Just want to say that I appreciate and agree with your thoughtful=20 words. I=E2=80=99d also note that name changes aren=E2=80=99t a concern limited to= trans=20 people, and framing this as "we have to upend everything Because=20 Transgender" is both wrong and feels pretty bad to me. Anyone can=20 change their name at any time for any reason, or no reason at all,=20 and may wish to update historical references to their previous=20 names. Having a mechanism to support this is, in my view, a=20 matter of basic decency and respect for all humans. Thanks, =E2=80=94 Ian