GNU Mes 0.27 released

GNU Mes 0.27 released

[Janneke Nieuwenhuizen]

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We are happy to announce the release of GNU Mes 0.27.

It's been only a month since the previous release mainly because most
this work has been waiting for 0.26 to be released.  This release
represents 55 commits over 17 weeks.  This release resurrects running
Mes on the Hurd and adds support for using NYACC versions 0.99.0 through
1.09.4.

We are excited that the NLnet Foundation is sponsoring this work!

What's next?

Bringing the Full Source Bootstrap to NixOS.  Remove indirect Guile
dependencies (via Gash and Gash-Utils) from the Mes bootstrap in Guix.
Support for bootstrapping gcc-4.6.4, and a Full Source Bootstrap for
armhf-linux, and riscv64-linux.

Enjoy!

ABOUT

  GNU Mes is a Scheme interpreter and C compiler for bootstrapping the
  GNU System.  It has helped to decimate the number and size of binary
  seeds that were used in the bootstrap of GNU Guix 1.0.  Recently,
  version 0.24.2 has realized the first Full Source Bootstrap for Guix
  <https://guix.gnu.org/en/blog/2023/the-full-source-bootstrap-building-from-source-all-the-way-down/>.
  The final goal is to help create a full source bootstrap as part of
  the bootstrappable builds effort <https://bootstrappable.org> for any
  UNIX-like operating system.

  Mes + MesCC + Mes C Library can build a bootstrappable TinyCC
  <https://gitlab.com/janneke/tinycc> that is self-hosting.  Using this
  bootstrappable-tcc and the Mes C library we can build an ancient
  version of the GNU tools triplet: glibc-2.2.5, binutils-2.20.1,
  gcc-2.95.3.  This is enough to bootstrap Guix for i686-linux,
  x86_64-linux, armhf-linux and aarch64-linux.

  Mes was inspired by The Maxwell Equations of Software: LISP-1.5 --
  John McCarthy page 13, Guix's source/binary packaging transparency and
  Jeremiah Orians's Stage0 <https://github.com/oriansj/stage0>, a
  ~500-byte self-hosting hex assembler.

DOWNLOAD

Here is the GNU mes home page:
    https://gnu.org/s/mes/

For a summary of changes and contributors, see:
  https://git.sv.gnu.org/gitweb/?p=mes.git;a=shortlog;h=v0.27
or run this command from a git-cloned mes directory:
  git shortlog v0.26.2..v0.27

Here are the compressed sources and a GPG detached signature:
  https://ftp.gnu.org/gnu/mes/mes-0.27.tar.gz
  https://ftp.gnu.org/gnu/mes/mes-0.27.tar.gz.sig

Use a mirror for higher download bandwidth:
  https://ftpmirror.gnu.org/mes/mes-0.27.tar.gz
  https://ftpmirror.gnu.org/mes/mes-0.27.tar.gz.sig

Here are the SHA1 and SHA256 checksums:

  273ad95203efe83d0b0e8bdbce5b41cfebb316e4  mes-0.27.tar.gz
  033ee656d98cfc04a826eab27eed6e6a276d15bbb980a7cd71d00f30227aaaa8  mes-0.27.tar.gz

Use a .sig file to verify that the corresponding file (without the
.sig suffix) is intact.  First, be sure to download both the .sig file
and the corresponding tarball.  Then, run a command like this:

  gpg --verify mes-0.27.tar.gz.sig

The signature should match the fingerprint of the following key:

  pub   rsa4096 2018-04-08 [SC]
        1A85 8392 E331 EAFD B8C2  7FFB F3C1 A0D9 C1D6 5273
  uid   Jan (janneke) Nieuwenhuizen <janneke@gnu.org>

If that command fails because you don't have the required public key,
or that public key has expired, try the following commands to retrieve
or refresh it, and then rerun the 'gpg --verify' command.

  gpg --recv-keys 1A858392E331EAFDB8C27FFBF3C1A0D9C1D65273

As a last resort to find the key, you can try the official GNU
keyring:

  wget -q https://ftp.gnu.org/gnu/gnu-keyring.gpg
  gpg --keyring gnu-keyring.gpg --verify mes-0.27.tar.gz.sig

Alternatively, Mes can be installed using GNU Guix:

  guix pull
  guix install mes

NEWS

* Changes in 0.27 since 0.26.2
** Core
*** Support for running Mes on the Hurd has been resurrected.
** Mes
*** (ice-9 optargs) now supports lambda* #:optional with #:key.
*** Define-module now handles #:version by ignoring it.
*** 2 new functions:
pair-for-each, with-fluids*.
*** 2 new modules:
(rnrs arithmetic bitwise), (srfi srfi-39).
*** For Guile compatibility, (srfi srfi-39) is loaded by default.
** Build
*** When configuring using `--with-courage, mescc-tools are now optional.
** MesCC
*** MesCC now works with NYACC versions 0.99.0 to 1.09.4.
*** Legacy mes-style module support was removed for NYACC.
*** Legacy mes-style module support was removed for MesCC.

See also <https://bootstrappable.org>.
Join bug-mes@gnu.org and #bootstrappable on irc.libera.chat for
discussions.

Janneke
 [on behalf of the mes maintainers]

-- 
Janneke Nieuwenhuizen <janneke@gnu.org>  | GNU LilyPond https://LilyPond.org
Freelance IT https://www.JoyOfSource.com | Avatar® https://AvatarAcademy.com

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Re: GNU Mes 0.27 released

[Simon Tournier]

Hi Janneke,

On Sat, 06 Jul 2024 at 11:16, Janneke Nieuwenhuizen <janneke@gnu.org> wrote:

> We are happy to announce the release of GNU Mes 0.27.

Cool!  Really nice.

>                                               Remove indirect Guile
> dependencies (via Gash and Gash-Utils) from the Mes bootstrap in Guix.

Do you mean remove guile-bootstrap from the picture?  The root of this graph:

    https://www.gnu.org/software/mes/manual/images/gcc-mesboot-graph.png

?  What’s the plan?  Replace the requirements of stage0-posix provided
by Gash and Gash-Utils by increasing bootstrap-seeds?

Well, gcc-core-mesboot0 which is higher in the graph also depends on
guile-bootstrap, right?

Cheers,
simon

Re: GNU Mes 0.27 released

[Andrius Štikonas]

(Sorry, initially forgot to do reply all and only sent it to bug-mes)

2024 m. liepos 9 d., antradienis 18:18:19 GMT+1 Simon Tournier rašė:
> Hi Janneke,
> 
> On Sat, 06 Jul 2024 at 11:16, Janneke Nieuwenhuizen <janneke@gnu.org> wrote:
> > We are happy to announce the release of GNU Mes 0.27.
> 
> Cool!  Really nice.
> 
> >                                               Remove indirect Guile
> > 
> > dependencies (via Gash and Gash-Utils) from the Mes bootstrap in Guix.
> 
> Do you mean remove guile-bootstrap from the picture?  The root of this
> graph:

I think what janneke means (correct me if I'm wrong) is that before now gash 
and gash utils could only run on guile but not on mes. So that arrow that was 
pointing from gash to guile-bootstrap will point to mes.

> 
>     https://www.gnu.org/software/mes/manual/images/gcc-mesboot-graph.png
> 
> ?  What’s the plan?  Replace the requirements of stage0-posix provided
> by Gash and Gash-Utils by increasing bootstrap-seeds?

bootstrap seeds bubble in that graph refers to [1], so it wouldn't be changing 
as we don't add anything else there.

stage0-posix requirements are related to package manager and/or limitations of 
source distribution method. If stage0-posix exists in unpacked form, it can 
run the whole bootstrap chain itself using either kaem-optional-seed [2] in 
userspace/POSIX bootstrap (e.g. just kernel and initramfs with bootstrap-seeds 
and source) or builder-hex0 [3] (plus sources) in MBR/BIOS bootstrap (where we 
bootstrap linux kernel too). And then no guile-bootstrap is needed at all. 
Both of these problems are already solved on x86 (though now new x86 machines 
generally come without BIOS and bootstrapping on UEFI is only partially done).

But this method of running bootstrap from just sub 1KB bootstrap-seeds (and no 
guile-bootstrap) cannot be directly implemented in Guix or any other package 
manager. They'll always need some extra seeds that run package manager itself.
At best we can hope to make those additional seeds smaller, e.g. replace 
guile-bootstrap with mes and make Guix run in mes but we can't replace guile-
bootstrap with kaem-optional-seed and still keep package manager 
functionality.

What would be interesting from bootstrapping perspective is to make those 
additional seeds (guile-bootstrap in particular) fully bootstrappable/
reproducible not just from inside Guix but also without Guix, so that we don't 
have chicken and egg problem of how to build guile-bootstrap binary when we
don't yet have Guix.
> 
> Well, gcc-core-mesboot0 which is higher in the graph also depends on
> guile-bootstrap, right?

I think janneke hopes that one day guile-bootstrap will be replaced by mes. 
mes is also much easier to irreducibly bootstrap than guile.

Andrius

[1] https://github.com/oriansj/bootstrap-seeds/
[2] https://github.com/oriansj/bootstrap-seeds/tree/master/POSIX/x86
[3] https://github.com/oriansj/bootstrap-seeds/tree/master/NATIVE/x86

Re: GNU Mes 0.27 released

[Simon Tournier]

Hi Andrius,

On Tue, 09 Jul 2024 at 23:15, Andrius Štikonas <andrius@stikonas.eu> wrote:

>> Do you mean remove guile-bootstrap from the picture?  The root of this
>> graph:
>
> I think what janneke means (correct me if I'm wrong) is that before now gash 
> and gash utils could only run on guile but not on mes. So that arrow that was 
> pointing from gash to guile-bootstrap will point to mes.

It would mean to have mes-bootstrap (instead of guile-bootstrap) that
would be indirectly used by mes-boot.

Right?


>>     https://www.gnu.org/software/mes/manual/images/gcc-mesboot-graph.png
>> 
>> ?  What’s the plan?  Replace the requirements of stage0-posix provided
>> by Gash and Gash-Utils by increasing bootstrap-seeds?
>
> bootstrap seeds bubble in that graph refers to [1], so it wouldn't be changing 
> as we don't add anything else there.
>
> stage0-posix requirements are related to package manager and/or limitations of 
> source distribution method. If stage0-posix exists in unpacked form, it can 
> run the whole bootstrap chain itself using either kaem-optional-seed [2] in 
> userspace/POSIX bootstrap (e.g. just kernel and initramfs with bootstrap-seeds 
> and source) or builder-hex0 [3] (plus sources) in MBR/BIOS bootstrap (where we 
> bootstrap linux kernel too). And then no guile-bootstrap is needed at all. 
> Both of these problems are already solved on x86 (though now new x86 machines 
> generally come without BIOS and bootstrapping on UEFI is only partially done).

Thanks for explaining.

[...]

> What would be interesting from bootstrapping perspective is to make those 
> additional seeds (guile-bootstrap in particular) fully bootstrappable/
> reproducible not just from inside Guix but also without Guix, so that we don't 
> have chicken and egg problem of how to build guile-bootstrap binary when we
> don't yet have Guix.

Hum, I am missing something, I guess.  Well, from my poor understanding,
one way is what you explained just above or something as “Extreme“
Bootstrapping as discussed in [4], and the other way is to root the
graph in some binary driver (as guile-bootstrap).

For sure, the binary guile-bootstrap could be replaced by another
lighter, smaller and surely more reproducible other binary as
mes-bootstrap but that would not tackle the chicken-or-the-egg problem,
IMHO.  However, it could be nice to reduce again the binary footprint.

Well, from my weak understanding, maybe one direction (but huge work)
would to implement all the features required by the whole graph and
provided by gash-boot and gash-utils-boot directly in auditable binary.
Yeah, it’s a piece of work and I do not volunteer. ;-)

Cheers,
simon

4: https://guix.gnu.org/en/blog/2019/reproducible-builds-summit-5th-edition/