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[109.90.125.150]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id 5sm4065358ejr.200.2022.02.20.04.44.21 (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 bits=128/128); Sun, 20 Feb 2022 04:44:21 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <675b6da5-e33a-fbaf-800a-83a949844ac3@gmail.com> Date: Sun, 20 Feb 2022 13:44:18 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 10.0; Win64; x64; rv:91.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/91.6.0 Subject: Re: Excessively energy-consuming software considered malware? Content-Language: en-US To: Maxime Devos , guix-devel@gnu.org References: <2067ba1e606855eace261fd0b0ae9721b369bbd5.camel@telenet.be> <902e44183660c5de7e76b90a1fd9ae52e527a448.camel@telenet.be> From: Taylan Kammer In-Reply-To: <902e44183660c5de7e76b90a1fd9ae52e527a448.camel@telenet.be> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Host-Lookup-Failed: Reverse DNS lookup failed for 2a00:1450:4864:20::630 (failed) Received-SPF: pass client-ip=2a00:1450:4864:20::630; envelope-from=taylan.kammer@gmail.com; helo=mail-ej1-x630.google.com X-Spam_score_int: -6 X-Spam_score: -0.7 X-Spam_bar: / X-Spam_report: (-0.7 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, NICE_REPLY_A=-0.001, PDS_HP_HELO_NORDNS=0.659, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, RDNS_NONE=0.793, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, T_SCC_BODY_TEXT_LINE=-0.01 autolearn=no autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-BeenThere: guix-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: "Development of GNU Guix and the GNU System distribution." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: guix-devel-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org Sender: "Guix-devel" X-Migadu-Flow: FLOW_IN X-Migadu-Country: US ARC-Message-Signature: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=yhetil.org; s=key1; t=1645361300; h=from:from:sender:sender:reply-to:subject:subject:date:date: message-id:message-id:to:to:cc:mime-version:mime-version: content-type:content-type: content-transfer-encoding:content-transfer-encoding: in-reply-to:in-reply-to:references:references:list-id:list-help: list-unsubscribe:list-subscribe:list-post:dkim-signature; bh=lYQt8BrR3+7TCFMTlW+4X7vhCAhLedzozWBu9W+jUZU=; b=sqXHSWJnuCsbq1OSs9gZNFIsS/GIC4Hnr4nuUFbVrFbb5vQLZP87R417hY72E3jI6WInoG BLZ6yCmhK68dWvLnEFLEODA0p+GLyN3ju1oiAozJ6QeDYDHAgOUQ4C8WQt4kYhyiuE3wdQ zBjCvjsW/vbzn+pRJc0q+vE3rgWRwqlJS3gxZq03n8yXY8CZrCng0i3Zvbejp9OdeJ0/ra D27jXjmYEDJgX8LXcKS5UZPsbvEkThI7SEsLobPX76UsBLqMxAt4MMbhXEk2Y5sxARqSCP 4FJwx0g5va0QWbbl2pxDI4597fgSEdWhIuwGrjeAS5coubRmYuSrkEa3Popz0A== ARC-Seal: i=1; s=key1; d=yhetil.org; t=1645361300; a=rsa-sha256; cv=none; b=rEK08tRIDP6YTQrDenfcCisQovkmmCF9aCMRI9v35IyhS49QW7yVT/wp45FIAClVs0ybKn kaeTRbCQxVbNS1/SvMH5rWWJP0eFG1tF7QW+/MJDFdgT57RFp82t+T5u9NzSds/N0MoCKc iHJvHpkyOE3c7ijTRsi5Ouak/Zi5TF47DQLo4fNpYrdvSiIcIdzxpESgYEJBOMMKOuM4ql 34YBZ3/L/2DX1xEgOXxVvMvXUcl4eFLM7O63Z3QFDX8cEtCu20R2aHLwfiXQpMkQYb/dog aJMAMcCRIZrK0FLEH1HfDoE8qNqCQ0juigtaehwQ97exWEyk8xlKOhxcpPBYkA== ARC-Authentication-Results: i=1; aspmx1.migadu.com; dkim=pass header.d=gmail.com header.s=20210112 header.b=nNBIL9M0; dmarc=pass (policy=none) header.from=gmail.com; spf=pass (aspmx1.migadu.com: domain of "guix-devel-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org" designates 209.51.188.17 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom="guix-devel-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org" X-Migadu-Spam-Score: -8.83 Authentication-Results: aspmx1.migadu.com; dkim=pass header.d=gmail.com header.s=20210112 header.b=nNBIL9M0; dmarc=pass (policy=none) header.from=gmail.com; spf=pass (aspmx1.migadu.com: domain of "guix-devel-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org" designates 209.51.188.17 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom="guix-devel-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org" X-Migadu-Queue-Id: 5D32C2E3A9 X-Spam-Score: -8.83 X-Migadu-Scanner: scn0.migadu.com X-TUID: H9KCTbqA7TXy On 20.02.2022 13:37, Maxime Devos wrote: > > The points about slippery slopes, research and niche use-cases seem > reasonable to me. I do see follow-up questions though, should the > description in Guix warn about potential issues? And should the > description focus on research uses? ... > > More concretely, the p2pool description is: > > ‘Monero P2Pool is a peer-to-peer Monero mining pool. P2Pool > combines the advantages of pool and solo mining; you still fully > control your Monero node and what it mines, but *you get frequent > payouts like on a regular pool.*’ > > This is quite a bit different from, say, aircrack-ng which seems > to be mostly about assessing security, whereas the p2pool description > is about gaining money (see ‘payouts’), and without mentioning that > mining costs a lot of energy (and hence money, and possibly the money > that is gained by mining is smaller than the amount lost due to energy > costs!). > > My dislike for the description of p2pool might just be my views on > money leaking through, though. > > Greetings, > Maxime. I guess a different description would be better. It sounds almost like a sales pitch with the mention of making money. :-) I'm not familiar with Monero/P2Pool so I don't know what a better description might sound like though. -- Taylan