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List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Cc: guix-devel@gnu.org Errors-To: guix-devel-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org Sender: "Guix-devel" X-Migadu-Flow: FLOW_IN X-Migadu-Country: US ARC-Message-Signature: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=yhetil.org; s=key1; t=1645450924; h=from:from:sender:sender:reply-to:subject:subject:date:date: message-id:message-id:to:to:cc:cc:mime-version:mime-version: content-type:content-type:in-reply-to:in-reply-to: references:references:list-id:list-help:list-unsubscribe: list-subscribe:list-post:dkim-signature; bh=M0B+XSKiGP2JaW7I8k/9OagzpujscnjB5gAKDr09/RI=; b=X2+9w6UnOom3bbaxwjc1pcNcIGR5kJTrGipBCBVKmCXs9fZjPJCuHqT+KBIP2Ewq17/LD4 Mgy9C6yyZtQFPEguCobJwm4/SOyTJH6LXbgJvh8VV6XuEIP3zQI3RbdfYj23RwnQZyzYRO gffx39VMPg39InVG3ZJeBMW2SS9zSgOcrNcpX38YgJJqYxlqsujaKG8vPj91V+GLk287J3 ZTrLbFMgbVhL4MHvp3siNPDuHW2SLahpC6bkacJL8+/AbHHCaqY/Xn02yr3Lh7VWh9sgGT sTTuay5bPSxdtxaUyPXMo8DZKi+u2FtJ0DXZ30gvUgs0f9V4F1cznkrypGyfrQ== ARC-Seal: i=1; s=key1; d=yhetil.org; t=1645450924; a=rsa-sha256; cv=none; b=E5jel/CH0HwA8yMp99jlBJUldC0e7mVkOFXAXcDLAMgXPRJGkYwRgYG+OCmXDOP0YIdUZ/ dnUoSgNMeOhhNS8s44mCN8eJuBPTPV0ufmxhEn7SrGgODWbjdN1IwRrnbQHiRDT5LJvn9/ F0U+tlnR6mOfGa0eehr7Zae/J4BYCEbTzyM9ZVbuQDmeI2SQfnpyBYwUXrApR3NbfrDxMT c/RMwgBU39Kc99iqcBM0eS4ZHlkSzr28Yg5Y8HlsqQZZDWDwpjOMeI81I/4gntLNQ/Xzoe DINqjKtbRgOdaQDtoQs7vM2ObShN8HYb7MBPQ6B+LXlXOa2YRbZo8aUOCvo3TQ== ARC-Authentication-Results: i=1; aspmx1.migadu.com; dkim=fail ("headers rsa verify failed") header.d=telenet.be header.s=r22 header.b=DMLoBBPn; dmarc=fail reason="SPF not aligned (relaxed)" header.from=telenet.be (policy=none); spf=pass (aspmx1.migadu.com: domain of "guix-devel-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org" designates 209.51.188.17 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom="guix-devel-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org" X-Migadu-Spam-Score: -4.13 Authentication-Results: aspmx1.migadu.com; dkim=fail ("headers rsa verify failed") header.d=telenet.be header.s=r22 header.b=DMLoBBPn; dmarc=fail reason="SPF not aligned (relaxed)" header.from=telenet.be (policy=none); spf=pass (aspmx1.migadu.com: domain of "guix-devel-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org" designates 209.51.188.17 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom="guix-devel-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org" X-Migadu-Queue-Id: CD6D83A4CD X-Spam-Score: -4.13 X-Migadu-Scanner: scn0.migadu.com X-TUID: VyP6jXlikeuA --=-aCuITNrSXzLf2BnaEW5N Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Attila Lendvai schreef op ma 21-02-2022 om 09:29 [+0000]: > let me add, though, that a more apples-to-apples comparison here would be= to > compare Bitcoin to the FED, and PoW to the costs of enforcing the PetroDo= llar > system on the entire world. Here PetroDollar =3D US dollar and FED=3DUS Federal Government? > these costs not only include the direct environmental damages of wars and > militaries. more generally, it also includes the costs of enforcing a cer= tain > economic structure globally, instead of potential better alternatives for > facilitating cooperation between strangers that may very well promote pea= ce and > prosperity more effectively and efficiently than the current system. If the US Government enforces the US Dollar with wars etc., then this seems more a bug of the US than a benefit of Bitcoin to me. Also, I don't understand what you mean with =E2=80=98enforcing=E2=80=99 here. Locally, in Belgium, I can use the Euro as currency. The US isn't forcing me to use the US dollar, in fact I have never seen a US dollar in person and most (all?) local businesses accept the Euro as currency and most physical shops wouldn't accept foreign currency(*). I can also use the US dollar as currency to buy from overseas (after trading Euro for US dollar, this happens automatically when e-shopping), even though the US hasn't stationed military forces at the banks to force the banks to allow converting Euro<->US dollar. I'm not seeing any enforcement here, nor any need for enforcement to make the US dollar a usable currency. While the US would (does?) wage wars to force countries to trade with the US (and perhaps force them to accept US dollar maybe?), I don't see how Bitcoin would change this -- Bitcoin might change the currency used for the forced trade, but not the existence of the forced trade. (*) at least, I think so, I haven't ever tried. > and from that perspective i don't see the use of 'absurd amount' justifie= d, by a large margin. >=20 > and the more some of us disagree with the above, the more appropriate it = seems to have been to use 'controversial morality' by Martin. Greetings, Maxime. --=-aCuITNrSXzLf2BnaEW5N Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name="signature.asc" Content-Description: This is a digitally signed message part Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- iI0EABYKADUWIQTB8z7iDFKP233XAR9J4+4iGRcl7gUCYhOOPxccbWF4aW1lZGV2 b3NAdGVsZW5ldC5iZQAKCRBJ4+4iGRcl7t3YAQDJfNuEGRW97s5vCwCuo3HTe3bZ MQhf7wNBEqyo11Ga/AEAqyLXlXjW7vUNtSzj6+svT/tzPRm6GGwONEyB7H8UUQ4= =8JsI -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --=-aCuITNrSXzLf2BnaEW5N--