From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 From: Jean Louis Subject: Re: MAME emulator is giving incentive to use non-free software Date: Tue, 29 Mar 2016 12:12:53 +0200 Message-ID: <20160329101253.GA5567@protected.rcdrun.com> References: <20160328215516.GA27719@protected.rcdrun.com> <877fglzmml.fsf@T420.taylan> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Return-path: Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:4830:134:3::10]:58982) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1akqfB-0004jk-SH for guix-devel@gnu.org; Tue, 29 Mar 2016 06:14:22 -0400 Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1akqf7-00046J-Dy for guix-devel@gnu.org; Tue, 29 Mar 2016 06:14:17 -0400 Received: from stw1.rcdrun.com ([217.170.207.13]:50941) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1akqf7-00046B-6N for guix-devel@gnu.org; Tue, 29 Mar 2016 06:14:13 -0400 Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <877fglzmml.fsf@T420.taylan> List-Id: "Development of GNU Guix and the GNU System distribution." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: guix-devel-bounces+gcggd-guix-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Sender: guix-devel-bounces+gcggd-guix-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org To: Taylan Ulrich =?utf-8?B?QmF5xLFybMSxL0thbW1lcg==?= Cc: guix-devel@gnu.org Hello Taylan, Thank you for bringing up your opinion and also issue with Nintendo emulator. My opinion is that such software shall not be included in free software distribution. As using such emulators, also encourages users to ask for support within free software community, and in that case, people are going to answer like this: https://trisquel.info/en/forum/can-i-get-games-wine-working-trisquel which is basically dividing the community, you can see the Calinou, answering with: "We won't assist you in running proprietary software of any kind on this forum, it would violate our Community Guidelines." Including a package that provides platform for non-free, even if there are few free options, is enciting users to ask back for support. It will cause many of pages where there will be problems and rejections of such users. Why not make it clear from beginning, by not including such emulators in free distributions. Trademark issue: I have reviewed somewhat nestopia source code, like this: https://github.com/rdanbrook/nestopia/search?utf8=3D%E2%9C%93&q=3Dnintend= o and that software clearly uses the trademark that is protected: http://www.nintendo.com/corp/copyright.jsp and without permission to be used in such. Further, author of software has taken care not to include on their website any mention of Nintendo=C2=AE trademark: http://0ldsk00l.ca/nestopia/ However, your package definiton does uses trademark: synopsis: Nintendo Entertainment System (NES/Famicom) emulator description: Nestopia UE (Undead Edition) is a fork of the Nintendo + Entertainment System (NES/Famicom) emulator Nestopia, with enhancements from members of the emulation community. It provides highly = accurate emulation. Does making whole package impossible to copy legally. It is not GPL or free software any more. Your package definition is also not GPL or free software, because it uses trademark that their owners did not give permissions to be used in that manner. The software package nestopia-ue is infected by the trademark. Please see what I mean: http://www.gnu.org/distros/free-system-distribution-guidelines.html#trade= marks The problem may arise from Nintendo, as they are owner of the trademark. For your understanding: - I cannot just take your package definition and copy it on my website, because it includes trademark, it is simply not free description of the package. It asks for problems in future, with Nintendo.=20 - I cannot sell the package or that software, neither provide support, in that shape or form, with the trademark Nintendo=C2=AE because I don'= t have permission for that. - a software definition cannot be just made up with trademarks, especially not with well known trademarks, and claimed to be GPL licensed - software using trademarks within the source is also questionable. My statements shall be verified by attorney, as I am only paralegal. Jean Louis On Tue, Mar 29, 2016 at 10:58:26AM +0200, Taylan Ulrich Bay=C4=B1rl=C4=B1= /Kammer wrote: > For the record, we have a couple Nintendo emulators in games.scm. In > particular I packaged Nestopia and Mupen64Plus a while back, and was > planning to add higan once I have a solution to its license issue...