From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from mp2 ([2001:41d0:2:4a6f::]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits)) by ms0.migadu.com with LMTPS id 4NLkDYAji2EP0gAAgWs5BA (envelope-from ) for ; Wed, 10 Nov 2021 02:42:24 +0100 Received: from aspmx1.migadu.com ([2001:41d0:2:4a6f::]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits)) by mp2 with LMTPS id WC+XCYAji2FNeQAAB5/wlQ (envelope-from ) for ; Wed, 10 Nov 2021 01:42:24 +0000 Received: from lists.gnu.org (lists.gnu.org [209.51.188.17]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by aspmx1.migadu.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id EDE03298D7 for ; Wed, 10 Nov 2021 02:42:22 +0100 (CET) Received: from localhost ([::1]:41812 helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1mkcd4-0003HO-5v for larch@yhetil.org; Tue, 09 Nov 2021 20:42:22 -0500 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([209.51.188.92]:33396) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1mkccs-0003Gy-3c for help-guix@gnu.org; Tue, 09 Nov 2021 20:42:10 -0500 Received: from wout2-smtp.messagingengine.com ([64.147.123.25]:54189) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1mkcco-0005kB-Pa for help-guix@gnu.org; Tue, 09 Nov 2021 20:42:09 -0500 Received: from compute5.internal (compute5.nyi.internal [10.202.2.45]) by mailout.west.internal (Postfix) with ESMTP id 93A063200A2A; Tue, 9 Nov 2021 20:42:04 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailfrontend2 ([10.202.2.163]) by compute5.internal (MEProxy); Tue, 09 Nov 2021 20:42:05 -0500 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=famulari.name; h=date:from:to:cc:subject:message-id:references:mime-version :content-type:in-reply-to; s=mesmtp; bh=DNyxzD3sQEGGKCTz3z7OHJDc pbgjEOf921L0e2B/qIA=; b=XI/bzmtJ2d0dnhDjD+0ONipjkCFAEJXmcaqRrYL4 x6A10FpwVEag483Br9bR9QXZgK1dZToHlXcUsCvrIJCNF/g5W2dSdi9HMXzXaA3w 7rGkqbfhZu4CxHH5VTE7mUiuUbhr6VT5BTc74HYWtORHdOsR4wQbS6EwOw5CAwZi 4v0= DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d= messagingengine.com; h=cc:content-type:date:from:in-reply-to :message-id:mime-version:references:subject:to:x-me-proxy :x-me-proxy:x-me-sender:x-me-sender:x-sasl-enc; s=fm1; bh=DNyxzD 3sQEGGKCTz3z7OHJDcpbgjEOf921L0e2B/qIA=; b=Ly1APH4GBM9MxVfwDgHTDF EwH28KbRKhCHzSZJW05+WWzQhQfWOY3a7BSWOAllU6Q8no+1y+btLDkwyrGcY8bn g5Ve38HaOj/MVKTDGG/JuJFQOkWVbBPd+P0FyCw+HHGrPIf2qN7+cJArc6hk3Lyp Bgp7yg8Lf5ZWeAMQyXfshzEs8MpC2wfGWZjA5betNYLFBge2ulPPhaVPfiWngLSz 6Fu4nWWOmcwSljCiQiIaOfJ1l0GsAd/b4XjsukbXSxj3TCfrc1h08iZhS305GVFQ 9uNsSKraJ4zp0nl7gDSvxkJgAdqQaQy5Hdxghr/6NjR/CdVsV0tELqLEBXrijjjw == X-ME-Sender: X-ME-Received: X-ME-Proxy-Cause: gggruggvucftvghtrhhoucdtuddrgedvuddrudehgdeffecutefuodetggdotefrodftvf curfhrohhfihhlvgemucfhrghsthforghilhdpqfgfvfdpuffrtefokffrpgfnqfghnecu uegrihhlohhuthemuceftddtnecusecvtfgvtghiphhivghnthhsucdlqddutddtmdenuc fjughrpeffhffvuffkfhggtggujgesthdtredttddtvdenucfhrhhomhepnfgvohcuhfgr mhhulhgrrhhiuceolhgvohesfhgrmhhulhgrrhhirdhnrghmvgeqnecuggftrfgrthhtvg hrnheptefhvdfhfeetveffledtgeegjedtieetueektdffueetudevffeiteegtefgveff necuffhomhgrihhnpeifihhnghholhhoghdrohhrghdpuggvsghirghnrdhorhhgnecuve hluhhsthgvrhfuihiivgeptdenucfrrghrrghmpehmrghilhhfrhhomheplhgvohesfhgr mhhulhgrrhhirdhnrghmvg X-ME-Proxy: Received: by mail.messagingengine.com (Postfix) with ESMTPA; Tue, 9 Nov 2021 20:42:02 -0500 (EST) Date: Tue, 9 Nov 2021 20:41:59 -0500 From: Leo Famulari To: Philip McGrath Subject: Re: How to add /bin/sh to the build environment Message-ID: References: <87bl2u37wr.fsf@disroot.org> <8433ab7e-1540-37ff-e647-8e8da01e07fb@philipmcgrath.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <8433ab7e-1540-37ff-e647-8e8da01e07fb@philipmcgrath.com> Received-SPF: pass client-ip=64.147.123.25; envelope-from=leo@famulari.name; helo=wout2-smtp.messagingengine.com X-Spam_score_int: -27 X-Spam_score: -2.8 X-Spam_bar: -- X-Spam_report: (-2.8 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-0.7, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H2=-0.001, SPF_HELO_PASS=-0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001 autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-BeenThere: help-guix@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Cc: help-guix@gnu.org, Xinglu Chen Errors-To: help-guix-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org Sender: "Help-Guix" X-Migadu-Flow: FLOW_IN ARC-Message-Signature: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=yhetil.org; s=key1; t=1636508543; h=from:from:sender:sender:reply-to:subject:subject:date:date: message-id:message-id:to:to:cc:cc:mime-version:mime-version: content-type:content-type:in-reply-to:in-reply-to: references:references:list-id:list-help:list-unsubscribe: list-subscribe:list-post:dkim-signature; bh=DNyxzD3sQEGGKCTz3z7OHJDcpbgjEOf921L0e2B/qIA=; b=UKM3us7/9QQkT9lmb8ZzSnOymsl7HtUa/RDhZtyiYX0Z7fqZOMjEo29edftHwIGTZh4RTW Y/ogqFPe81SB7pDa9lV5uTAYmSnMkLCLsZCygEe3mt9FAUvUhB1B98V3FXo9yJbg25ltVd gwcKJlzf2xj5oXzM0/pl4HHGtxQAEvNW2Gk0rZkyCmWdOPURJwkQE1jscpga3mk1XebxN4 pXxOpgee6KiW3EqMXTqK6UBD4kQd6U9PS4jGZ9nq2/T0v44nEL7H1tYcV6SBAeEwIj6vR4 E6lCREr9n+VycNeoZeewVQEh8YOxw3bW+5yam4ZIt2A5d51pAf9o//c4/DEI4w== ARC-Seal: i=1; s=key1; d=yhetil.org; t=1636508543; a=rsa-sha256; cv=none; b=gX2cw7HEqT/U3VgX9HKJL7O/X/1OV/B4pjtvd68V9RXK065MCgBn5P0SYSyBaBd/AeC+7o 5wuKEQg+wIUPbbN+5FxFDs5i7b+AKRRImVC3dB1DmH7CimlPbJ+H6P2K4qtF9IvsdwF7ii kZLx0GF5fd0moZ3WxX0cmPPQO0jOlOqtIJbLtY3iLZwGd4oWQpfDZNFPbFL10safgK2Ndp FXNv/34HqrhSFK+/siah1d8nFXFPV2H74x5/MLWgz6K8cDvdwCR6XfOey1ZaPdNZZwgbMb thR5wQQ4VQX8p64/fOsL/9qa4jzdladksuWb/4DGYMKjSbXEhUY4HJYuHeWIuw== ARC-Authentication-Results: i=1; aspmx1.migadu.com; dkim=fail ("headers rsa verify failed") header.d=famulari.name header.s=mesmtp header.b="XI/bzmtJ"; dkim=fail ("headers rsa verify failed") header.d=messagingengine.com header.s=fm1 header.b=Ly1APH4G; spf=pass (aspmx1.migadu.com: domain of help-guix-bounces@gnu.org designates 209.51.188.17 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=help-guix-bounces@gnu.org X-Migadu-Spam-Score: -1.92 Authentication-Results: aspmx1.migadu.com; dkim=fail ("headers rsa verify failed") header.d=famulari.name header.s=mesmtp header.b="XI/bzmtJ"; dkim=fail ("headers rsa verify failed") header.d=messagingengine.com header.s=fm1 header.b=Ly1APH4G; dmarc=none; spf=pass (aspmx1.migadu.com: domain of help-guix-bounces@gnu.org designates 209.51.188.17 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=help-guix-bounces@gnu.org X-Migadu-Queue-Id: EDE03298D7 X-Spam-Score: -1.92 X-Migadu-Scanner: scn1.migadu.com X-TUID: BBjK1CZYVvx7 On Mon, Nov 08, 2021 at 08:36:08PM -0500, Philip McGrath wrote: > Mostly I wanted to follow up to say that, from my perspective, SML/NJ is a > very noteworthy and influential language implementation. Perhaps the most > familiar example for Guix folks would be that Guile's fibers are based on > Concurrent ML, which is an SML/NJ extension: > https://wingolog.org/archives/2017/06/29/a-new-concurrent-ml Thanks for sharing your knowledge. I stand corrected! > Personally I've only read ML, not written it, but from a Debian bug I found > through searching online > (), it appears > that there are no known Standard ML implementations that avoid this > bootstrapping problem. SML/NJ, in addition to being one of the most > important implementations in its own right, is apparently capable of > bootstrapping at least one other implementation, MLton. (Unlike some on that > thread, I don't consider the 5x slowdown for the bootstrap build to be > prohibitive: bootstrapping Chez Scheme via Racket has a 10x slowdown.) > > It is very valuable that Guix maintains such high standards for > bootstrapping from source. However, Guix does still contain some compilers > that have bootstrapping limitations. SML/NJ is no worse that Chez Scheme in > this respect, and comparably important. (One difference is that there is a > path to backporting the bootstrap simulation from Racket's fork to the > upstream variant, which would remove the problem---but I don't that wasn't > true when Chez Scheme was first added to Guix.) The status quo is that no > Standard ML language implementation at all seems to be in Guix. I think > including SML/NJ would be better than waiting for someone to write a > hypothetical Standard ML compiler in a host language with a better > bootstrapping story. I see. Maybe it's worth attempting to patch the binary to use /tmp/sh while bootstrapping, in that case. Or maybe there *is* some way to add /bin/sh to the build environment for just this package, without having to make the change for all packages, which would be undesirable.