From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from mp0.migadu.com ([2001:41d0:303:5f26::]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits)) by ms8.migadu.com with LMTPS id 4zT/BQHwlGV2gQEAkFu2QA (envelope-from ) for ; Wed, 03 Jan 2024 06:26:25 +0100 Received: from aspmx1.migadu.com ([2001:41d0:403:4876::]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits)) by mp0.migadu.com with LMTPS id wN1TOwDwlGVxMAAAqHPOHw (envelope-from ) for ; Wed, 03 Jan 2024 06:26:25 +0100 X-Envelope-To: larch@yhetil.org Authentication-Results: aspmx1.migadu.com; dkim=fail ("body hash did not verify") header.d=gmail.com header.s=20230601 header.b=QFEsjM89; spf=pass (aspmx1.migadu.com: domain of "help-guix-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org" designates 209.51.188.17 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom="help-guix-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org"; dmarc=fail reason="SPF not aligned (relaxed)" header.from=gmail.com (policy=none) ARC-Message-Signature: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=yhetil.org; s=key1; t=1704259584; h=from:from:sender:sender:reply-to:subject:subject:date:date: message-id:message-id:to:to:cc:cc:mime-version:mime-version: content-type:content-type: content-transfer-encoding:content-transfer-encoding: in-reply-to:in-reply-to:references:references:list-id:list-help: list-unsubscribe:list-subscribe:list-post:dkim-signature; bh=EiTBxDI1V7iZdiaa4KmdkWNeOSgBQHHMpm+5JdZrK9c=; b=DWmH5UXfoyIOYnzPbjGukhYMFrNFb/BbePW1uhd0fPo2qSt8HQvg0rTIKCnN/2aQlO+6ja LMF+d07Xgz5CwMnelOkF8yBDiiCiIqXRv9M3KYnr7sjcSWDg8Vxu2Dk5UH91byZp3rAmpY Pe3HqgRkQPBFUCry9cKZmPAjZQk/5ubmVphCf5nLzMB555QAnHFBW1PNHs24SU/6axnKbR 12axEGSQZlSZL1DhfrwawBw45oN/iaiUH1VfZV6/A1la7+AWdb1X0ApsjclUSR9s84LLL4 4A88sgA+DKdO8Ro8ls5I6X6TS7R9AGCM7k6yPUqFq7fvesCv8OhTLim0htCVXA== ARC-Authentication-Results: i=1; aspmx1.migadu.com; dkim=fail ("body hash did not verify") header.d=gmail.com header.s=20230601 header.b=QFEsjM89; spf=pass (aspmx1.migadu.com: domain of "help-guix-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org" designates 209.51.188.17 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom="help-guix-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org"; dmarc=fail reason="SPF not aligned (relaxed)" header.from=gmail.com (policy=none) ARC-Seal: i=1; s=key1; d=yhetil.org; t=1704259584; a=rsa-sha256; cv=none; b=db5xmmHIEOkMyURoSCGEhhkrMnSXmCER8XCFBO7Qut022EmZPbdhoH3fgZV7Pd+TGz7nV3 gpvXzcBBsbF5mFRivDjeHCg29CJ1JShAaz5N5YHmnApsxw3FRkXxKgxwhMboUUXBT+25/K 9uWZVdG3R+qoc09inF+V3ThdV4D0AVbfdYvleaPzNgnItX5kK9iCMeO1c2ADl0rL/sd1kD EgOLY3/pnsHS874rP1CUhEXBEUQQviKt3LBG72V3TNLS8XoEvJZZCTeFkpgpIfGJeGNCcF KdPNGiVzGGeKq3hGV5A3FaofNzU1wuKEZGg8oXldDGnuiXVo63qT0d7IrI6Pxg== Received: from lists.gnu.org (lists.gnu.org [209.51.188.17]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by aspmx1.migadu.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 6F1E7225FC for ; Wed, 3 Jan 2024 06:26:24 +0100 (CET) Received: from localhost ([::1] helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1rKtlV-0001n4-4U; Wed, 03 Jan 2024 00:26:05 -0500 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1rKtlS-0001lL-Q7 for help-guix@gnu.org; Wed, 03 Jan 2024 00:26:02 -0500 Received: from mail-wr1-x435.google.com ([2a00:1450:4864:20::435]) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_128_GCM_SHA256:128) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1rKtlN-0003b6-O4 for help-guix@gnu.org; Wed, 03 Jan 2024 00:26:00 -0500 Received: by mail-wr1-x435.google.com with SMTP id ffacd0b85a97d-33687627ad0so9393432f8f.2 for ; Tue, 02 Jan 2024 21:25:56 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20230601; t=1704259554; x=1704864354; darn=gnu.org; h=cc:to:subject:message-id:date:from:in-reply-to:references :mime-version:from:to:cc:subject:date:message-id:reply-to; bh=jU38k2beicJ1ov7bN2m9ebn6WphQzm73469GZjRevUo=; b=QFEsjM89RG97/QnQjgkUvuHDnZ9Mp5pc9iYVRDU0tS55VTDp0zHZi9rDDexiyxE7QH PyAwiwWQKnF3JyExKcSC5mzQj3UzHCuz3FqbVjqe2dIrMHuhbGiEvLbFsgQBRo0sarfh 8jN7cBnqxJib+uEF+lRxtwtWo926+uQv0FMJpizHHrYBcSFVpM1aNaadLifU4Kjzq49M fqQfKzS6yfIDLjyq8AO8Food63rhB3dA9vZ5kFvVhSeuXs/LO5cpEih/85xM0e5km9xV TI+9WwPjYBh56l4D72G5ScrvRLRlSDfcEgNna5+R1UFQugAWlBCIAqexzBYbfYK5OuBF xXYQ== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20230601; t=1704259554; x=1704864354; h=cc:to:subject:message-id:date:from:in-reply-to:references :mime-version:x-gm-message-state:from:to:cc:subject:date:message-id :reply-to; bh=jU38k2beicJ1ov7bN2m9ebn6WphQzm73469GZjRevUo=; b=l3U5cw3SsQZWHvPtWeGQ2RBLShZlZtyo/Awv5sqQcV7mwayyFBi12hkP0eCaiA3rtO eUZIBaJBZ36Jn4Ksg2bBK3ceVf32+f24BtpKO7ggJOjkbE1SIyHSrdYhwIoohjXPYCno UQazqCY/3Ke9KiIEv3rkcKVBRMHarQG2Uwuwn/IUs7aRH6YpXUpsMtnNdbU5q4+ZHOSG ///cou6YzTbGGSG9JdoSzmD+ntEvOiTXxH3Qw4+grrxyH13Fe/D48mvHgvRR/8OcxtuO kPKiJxsqMSSDiTOvAuROCS93/q64xFETylYl+yBHfnFmVeMxGvcJhrAEmN9c4N6z7xcf 83Fg== X-Gm-Message-State: AOJu0YyYtK3pP3rQVOqYvtUgfd3krMEwWOz3gZ2Kwryz0gUT6+AS/F1s E7k0db3xKnCPPlFMbuzYeTycre02Wqp++sRO5XyUwdB+ X-Google-Smtp-Source: AGHT+IGBr8D1KmkKeTGw/sBV30srunAPQ++M02Tg1OZ6DDaeaVnWktc6FtpcDiKniTwnJ0zTUP4OLQKK/GcfHlIhgFU= X-Received: by 2002:a05:6000:4c8:b0:336:d040:3f17 with SMTP id h8-20020a05600004c800b00336d0403f17mr6366696wri.124.1704259553993; Tue, 02 Jan 2024 21:25:53 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <958596c3-bb46-4615-8ff5-d0050fddce86@benwr.net> <878r57f299.fsf@meson> In-Reply-To: <878r57f299.fsf@meson> From: Josh Marshall Date: Wed, 3 Jan 2024 00:25:44 -0500 Message-ID: Subject: Re: [META] How to effectively ask for help with Guix? To: Ian Eure Cc: help-guix@gnu.org Received-SPF: pass client-ip=2a00:1450:4864:20::435; envelope-from=joshua.r.marshall.1991@gmail.com; helo=mail-wr1-x435.google.com X-Spam_score_int: -18 X-Spam_score: -1.9 X-Spam_bar: - X-Spam_report: (-1.9 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, FREEMAIL_ENVFROM_END_DIGIT=0.25, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, T_SCC_BODY_TEXT_LINE=-0.01 autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.29 X-BeenThere: help-guix@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: help-guix-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org Sender: help-guix-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org X-Migadu-Country: US X-Migadu-Flow: FLOW_IN X-Migadu-Spam-Score: -4.18 X-Spam-Score: -4.18 X-Migadu-Queue-Id: 6F1E7225FC X-Migadu-Scanner: mx10.migadu.com X-TUID: CR8A+gFECHL4 Hi Ben. I've seen some of this, too. I attribute it to the small community and userbase. We just can't compete with the likes of Nix. On Tue, Jan 2, 2024, 11:52=E2=80=AFPM Ian Eure wrote: > Hi Ben, > > I=E2=80=99ve seen some of your posts, and haven=E2=80=99t had any help to= offer. > Your questions remind me of others I=E2=80=99ve seen, where someone gets > into the weeds of a problem and asks weedy questions, when they > should be asking big picture questions. I don=E2=80=99t know for if > that=E2=80=99s the case here, but it seems like a possibility. At the > very least, I=E2=80=99ve found that explaining how I got to the point of > having a specific question almost always gets better results. In > the many, many cases where I=E2=80=99ve been on the wrong path, this has > allowed people to suggest better approaches that I didn=E2=80=99t know > about, or hadn=E2=80=99t considered. > > I=E2=80=99d also note that the last three weeks are typically a much > slower time of year for people in the US due to the holidays, and > that almost certainly means that you=E2=80=99ll get slower responses (if > any) for this type of thing. > > =E2=80=94 Ian > > Ben Weinstein-Raun writes: > > > [[PGP Signed Part:Undecided]] > > Hello! > > > > I notice that I haven't been able to get much help with Guix, > > via any > > route. Having asked six or seven questions[^1] over the last > > three weeks > > (on this list, on the subreddit, and on the IRC channel), I've > > received > > help with only one of those problems (thanks nckx!). Ultimately > > I've > > cobbled together crappy solutions to my problems over that time, > > but a > > couple knowledgeable responses could have saved me dozens of > > hours. > > > > I'd love to wholeheartedly recommend Guix, because technically > > speaking > > I much prefer it to Nix, and to the "classic" alternatives. I'm > > hugely > > grateful that it exists! Of course it's nobody's responsibility > > to > > answer beginner questions! But at the moment, I'm going to need > > to give > > a big caveat with any recommendation: "The Guix documentation is > > relatively high-quality, but if you want to understand anything > > that > > isn't explained there, you should expect to dive much deeper > > than you > > would with most tools, as it's quite hard to get any engagement > > fr > > om > > people who know the answers to your questions." > > > > One possibility is that there just aren't many people who know > > those > > answers. If that's true, then there's not much to be > > done. Another is > > that I've gone about this wrongly somehow, in which case I'd > > love to > > know how I could do better (in reply to this message is great, > > though I > > also have an anonymous feedback form you can use, if you want to > > be > > really ruthless :-) https://forms.gle/8fYoiNedq2g4UTPj8). And > > another > > possibility is that I've just been unlucky, either with timing, > > or with > > the particular questions I've wanted to ask. > > > > Anyway, what, if anything, could I be doing better? I've read > > and try to > > follow the advice at > > http://www.catb.org/~esr/faqs/smart-questions.html, > > but it's been a while and it occurs to me that I should refresh > > myself. > > What else? > > > > Thanks for any meta-help! > > > > [1] > > - > > https://lists.gnu.org/archive/html/help-guix/2023-12/msg00123.html > > - > > https://lists.gnu.org/archive/html/help-guix/2023-12/msg00160.html > > - > > https://lists.gnu.org/archive/html/help-guix/2023-12/msg00164.html > > - > > > https://www.reddit.com/r/GUIX/comments/18mimv0/user_services_that_run_on_= startup/ > > - https://logs.guix.gnu.org/guix/2023-12-16.log#003630 > > > > [[End of PGP Signed Part]] > > > >