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Resent-From: "pelzflorian (Florian Pelz)" Original-Sender: "Debbugs-submit" Resent-CC: guix-patches@gnu.org Resent-Date: Mon, 11 Mar 2024 18:11:01 +0000 Resent-Message-ID: Resent-Sender: help-debbugs@gnu.org X-GNU-PR-Message: followup 69587 X-GNU-PR-Package: guix-patches X-GNU-PR-Keywords: patch To: Ludovic =?UTF-8?Q?Court=C3=A8s?= Cc: 69587@debbugs.gnu.org Received: via spool by 69587-submit@debbugs.gnu.org id=B69587.17101806383376 (code B ref 69587); Mon, 11 Mar 2024 18:11:01 +0000 Received: (at 69587) by debbugs.gnu.org; 11 Mar 2024 18:10:38 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:41233 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1rjk6f-0000sO-Rg for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 11 Mar 2024 14:10:38 -0400 Received: from relay.yourmailgateway.de ([46.38.247.119]:47773) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1rjk6b-0000s9-B8 for 69587@debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 11 Mar 2024 14:10:37 -0400 Received: from mors-relay-8404.netcup.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mors-relay-8404.netcup.net (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 4TtlDP6tgxz82G5; Mon, 11 Mar 2024 19:09:57 +0100 (CET) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=pelzflorian.de; s=key2; t=1710180598; bh=J93z4D18upN98vnp7B92CKZ9nyFle1W0KrXZaEsRWlY=; h=From:To:Cc:Subject:In-Reply-To:References:Date:From; b=JkUNg7rSwWWzPUu2cYcGKxIQ35X6H5fZBtT6EuA8TI8W8r24WCg7e4HccaFdJVBAB d3z7glB55zTSC7ZjRxYuhruIn+GE9nh8neLRr2K5hox7NGX7B4bwbHi36Wy7PctZte 04esZBC+1eochzteDzWzPYWblbhvMddgi3CBU2QpFM+eyPwXA0Wd6/yH1g3uz/B/Rd RBlfdBtLClXtZAwYy0G8OObdD7Ja/eSQtd9fegG/hMpyMVTv+WvL/o35CkD+Lt6FRM pRrw8VDmj+Dmjlx7S6QF1lh5IPu6EMfy10VQQNN2nIrNlABWsqahAzaU+7M3A3Z2ER H2bpucRKOCITw== Received: from policy01-mors.netcup.net (unknown [46.38.225.35]) by mors-relay-8404.netcup.net (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 4TtlDP6VpHz4yT0; Mon, 11 Mar 2024 19:09:57 +0100 (CET) X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at policy01-mors.netcup.net Received: from mxe217.netcup.net (unknown [10.243.12.53]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by policy01-mors.netcup.net (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 4TtlDG0LgQz8sZl; Mon, 11 Mar 2024 19:09:49 +0100 (CET) Received: from florianrock64 (ip92344de0.dynamic.kabel-deutschland.de [146.52.77.224]) by mxe217.netcup.net (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id AF8EA832BD; Mon, 11 Mar 2024 19:09:44 +0100 (CET) From: "pelzflorian (Florian Pelz)" In-Reply-To: <87le6oog1j.fsf@gnu.org> ("Ludovic =?UTF-8?Q?Court=C3=A8s?="'s message of "Mon, 11 Mar 2024 18:05:12 +0100") References: <878r2sa9hd.fsf@pelzflorian.de> <877cic2xa6.fsf@gnu.org> <878r2r8o7f.fsf@pelzflorian.de> <87le6oog1j.fsf@gnu.org> Date: Mon, 11 Mar 2024 19:09:43 +0100 Message-ID: <87jzm8prmg.fsf@pelzflorian.de> User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: AF8EA832BD X-Rspamd-Server: rspamd-worker-8404 X-NC-CID: Y0kXCLQHYVZvweKfc0h64Pfocqs2RUdyD4spLHn/6aA6k0HiuAw7IjRx X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list X-BeenThere: guix-patches@gnu.org List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: guix-patches-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org Sender: guix-patches-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org X-Migadu-Country: US X-Migadu-Flow: FLOW_IN X-Migadu-Scanner: mx12.migadu.com X-Migadu-Spam-Score: -2.28 X-Spam-Score: -2.28 X-Migadu-Queue-Id: D13641675E X-TUID: Mz/kz8Dzc/jr Hi Ludo. Ludovic Court=C3=A8s writes: >> Nice things like (guix swh) or (gnu system), (gnu build), (gnu >> installer), (gnu machine), or po, still seem not useful for the general >> populace to me. > > This is in the =E2=80=9CContributing=E2=80=9D chapter, so we=E2=80=99re t= alking about a subset > of the general populace. :-) > > You might argue that few current contributors care about the modules you > mention, but by exposing the structure of the code, my hope is that more > people would dare take a look and fiddle with it. Your reply makes clear that emphasis on (guix swh) was intentional. If SWH is central to Guix, then you are right mentioning it. I had not recognized and only considered it a nice, well-integrated bonus. Still I would prefer if (gnu system), (gnu build), (gnu installer), (gnu machine), and especially po, were not part of the list. I expect that most contributors want to provide a package or (home) service with docs and tests. They will not customize the operating-system record type. > [...] > >>> The examples were meant to illustrate what is meant by =E2=80=9Ccore=E2= =80=9D. Do you >>> think some other adjective or a longer description would help? >>> >>>> Perhaps (guix =E2=80=A6) should be listed after (gnu =E2=80=A6) and d= efined as the >>>> Guix mechanisms that do not belong in gnu? Not quite sure either. >> >> Josselin called the distinction between (guix =E2=80=A6) and (gnu =E2=80= =A6) murky, >> explaining that most of (guix =E2=80=A6) must not import (gnu =E2=80=A6)= except by >> module-ref, while (guix scripts =E2=80=A6) and such can just use-modules= (gnu >> =E2=80=A6). To me, gnu/packages.scm looks like core as well, but it rig= htfully >> is in gnu. > > I think =E2=80=9Cmurky=E2=80=9D is a strong word, or at least it shouldn= =E2=80=99t be > interpreted as meaning that the guix/gnu distinction is arbitrary. I=E2= =80=99ll > try to clarify that as well. Hmm what is the difference between, let=E2=80=99s say, (gnu packages) and (= guix package)? > @@ -638,10 +640,16 @@ Source Tree Structure > @end table >=20=20 > The directories we have seen so far all live under @file{guix/}. The > -other important place is the @code{gnu/} directory, which contains > +other important place is the @file{gnu/} directory, which contains > primarily package definitions as well as libraries and tools for Guix > System (@pxref{System Configuration}) and Guix Home (@pxref{Home > -Configuration}). > +Configuration}), all of which build upon functionality provided by > +@code{(guix @dots{})} modules@footnote{For this reason, @code{(guix > +@dots{})} modules must generally not depend on @code{(gnu @dots{})} > +modules, with one notable exception: @code{(guix build-system @dots{})} > +modules may look up packages at run time---e.g., @code{(guix > +build-system cmake)} needs to access the @code{cmake} variable at run > +time.}. I think the (guix build-system @dots{}) never use (gnu =E2=80=A6)? scripts= and importers do. Regards, Florian