From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from mp2 ([2001:41d0:2:4a6f::]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits)) by ms11 with LMTPS id 7YjoOGIe1V/JQgAA0tVLHw (envelope-from ) for ; Sat, 12 Dec 2020 19:47:46 +0000 Received: from aspmx1.migadu.com ([2001:41d0:2:4a6f::]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits)) by mp2 with LMTPS id KKgUNGIe1V+2QAAAB5/wlQ (envelope-from ) for ; Sat, 12 Dec 2020 19:47:46 +0000 Received: from lists.gnu.org (lists.gnu.org [209.51.188.17]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by aspmx1.migadu.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 552029402A8 for ; Sat, 12 Dec 2020 19:47:46 +0000 (UTC) Received: from localhost ([::1]:32850 helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1koArp-0007bb-0s for larch@yhetil.org; Sat, 12 Dec 2020 14:47:45 -0500 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:37968) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1ko9kl-0005ky-UN for guix-patches@gnu.org; Sat, 12 Dec 2020 13:36:23 -0500 Received: from debbugs.gnu.org ([209.51.188.43]:34911) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_128_GCM_SHA256:128) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1ko9kl-0008Iy-IV for guix-patches@gnu.org; Sat, 12 Dec 2020 13:36:23 -0500 Received: from Debian-debbugs by debbugs.gnu.org with local (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1ko9iU-0000XW-9X for guix-patches@gnu.org; Sat, 12 Dec 2020 13:34:02 -0500 X-Loop: help-debbugs@gnu.org Subject: [bug#45020] [PATCH 0/2] image: Add system field. Resent-From: Ludovic =?UTF-8?Q?Court=C3=A8s?= Original-Sender: "Debbugs-submit" Resent-CC: guix-patches@gnu.org Resent-Date: Sat, 12 Dec 2020 18:34:02 +0000 Resent-Message-ID: Resent-Sender: help-debbugs@gnu.org X-GNU-PR-Message: followup 45020 X-GNU-PR-Package: guix-patches X-GNU-PR-Keywords: patch To: Mathieu Othacehe Received: via spool by 45020-submit@debbugs.gnu.org id=B45020.16077979892009 (code B ref 45020); Sat, 12 Dec 2020 18:34:02 +0000 Received: (at 45020) by debbugs.gnu.org; 12 Dec 2020 18:33:09 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:46453 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1ko9hd-0000WF-K4 for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 12 Dec 2020 13:33:09 -0500 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([209.51.188.92]:43054) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1ko9hG-0000Sx-1s for 45020@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 12 Dec 2020 13:32:57 -0500 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e]:48126) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1ko9h9-000702-4O; Sat, 12 Dec 2020 13:32:39 -0500 Received: from [2a01:e0a:1d:7270:af76:b9b:ca24:c465] (port=34600 helo=ribbon) by fencepost.gnu.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.2:RSA_AES_256_CBC_SHA1:256) (Exim 4.82) (envelope-from ) id 1ko93C-000236-Cb; Sat, 12 Dec 2020 12:51:22 -0500 From: Ludovic =?UTF-8?Q?Court=C3=A8s?= References: <20201203105353.149482-1-othacehe@gnu.org> <87eejw5lsn.fsf@gnu.org> <87h7orpgsh.fsf@gnu.org> X-URL: http://www.fdn.fr/~lcourtes/ X-Revolutionary-Date: 22 Frimaire an 229 de la =?UTF-8?Q?R=C3=A9volution?= X-PGP-Key-ID: 0x090B11993D9AEBB5 X-PGP-Key: http://www.fdn.fr/~lcourtes/ludovic.asc X-PGP-Fingerprint: 3CE4 6455 8A84 FDC6 9DB4 0CFB 090B 1199 3D9A EBB5 X-OS: x86_64-pc-linux-gnu Date: Sat, 12 Dec 2020 18:51:21 +0100 In-Reply-To: <87h7orpgsh.fsf@gnu.org> (Mathieu Othacehe's message of "Sat, 12 Dec 2020 09:30:54 +0100") Message-ID: <87czze3obq.fsf@gnu.org> User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/27.1 (gnu/linux) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list X-BeenThere: guix-patches@gnu.org List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Cc: 45020@debbugs.gnu.org Errors-To: guix-patches-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org Sender: "Guix-patches" X-Migadu-Flow: FLOW_IN X-Migadu-Spam-Score: -2.80 Authentication-Results: aspmx1.migadu.com; dkim=none; dmarc=pass (policy=none) header.from=gnu.org; spf=pass (aspmx1.migadu.com: domain of guix-patches-bounces@gnu.org designates 209.51.188.17 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=guix-patches-bounces@gnu.org X-Migadu-Queue-Id: 552029402A8 X-Spam-Score: -2.80 X-Migadu-Scanner: scn1.migadu.com X-TUID: v+h/38vnYk6i Hi! Mathieu Othacehe skribis: >> I understand the need for an easier way to create images. However, I >> feel like is the wrong place for =E2=80=98system=E2=80=99 and = =E2=80=98target=E2=80=99: the >> image format, conceptually, has nothing to do with whether we=E2=80=99re >> cross-compiling, compiling for a specific system, etc. > > On the one hand, I agree that adding "system" and "target" to , > so that they can override the corresponding arguments doesn't feel > nice. On the other hand, I think that dealing with system/target is too > low level for most users. > > When using Yocto, Buildroot or even OpenWrt, you say "build me an image > for that board/machine" and not, "build me an image for that board by > cross-compiling to this mysterious triplet". Agreed; I understand that this is a desirable level of abstraction. > If the user selects the image type "pine64" or "novena", it's obvious > that the image has to be built for ARM, so I think it makes sense to > hardcode it somewhere. The record might not be the right > location for that information but I cannot think of another one. OTOH, I might want to cross-build a Novena image from x86_64, or I might want to build it natively. Perhaps what could be said is that a Novena image can either be built natively on armhf-linux, or cross-built to arm-linux-gnueabihf. Perhaps we should encode this constraint rather than a specific =E2=80=98system=E2=80=99 or =E2=80=98target=E2=80=99? (I= =E2=80=99m thinking out loud=E2=80=A6) Regarding ARM boards, do you think some additional abstraction is needed to encode cross-cutting concerns that affect not just the partition layout and choice of a bootloader, but also kernel build options, and maybe options for some userland packages (are there examples of that, though?)? Maybe the best course of action is to add all this info to until we have a better idea, after all. I guess I=E2=80=99m contributing more questions that answers. :-) Thanks, Ludo=E2=80=99.