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Resent-From: Janneke Nieuwenhuizen Original-Sender: "Debbugs-submit" Resent-CC: guix-patches@gnu.org Resent-Date: Fri, 10 Jan 2025 13:18:02 +0000 Resent-Message-ID: Resent-Sender: help-debbugs@gnu.org X-GNU-PR-Message: followup 74736 X-GNU-PR-Package: guix-patches X-GNU-PR-Keywords: patch To: Simon Tournier Cc: =?UTF-8?Q?No=C3=A9?= Lopez , Ludovic =?UTF-8?Q?Court=C3=A8s?= , Christopher Baines , 74736@debbugs.gnu.org, =?UTF-8?Q?No=C3=A9?= Lopez Received: via spool by 74736-submit@debbugs.gnu.org id=B74736.17365150754264 (code B ref 74736); Fri, 10 Jan 2025 13:18:02 +0000 Received: (at 74736) by debbugs.gnu.org; 10 Jan 2025 13:17:55 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:56720 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1tWEte-00016h-AP for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Fri, 10 Jan 2025 08:17:54 -0500 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:55356) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1tWEtb-00016T-QQ for 74736@debbugs.gnu.org; Fri, 10 Jan 2025 08:17:53 -0500 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e]) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1tWEtQ-0004fe-ET; Fri, 10 Jan 2025 08:17:41 -0500 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnu.org; s=fencepost-gnu-org; h=MIME-Version:Date:References:In-Reply-To:Subject:To: From; bh=9c7nRMM9aHR/55Z/VN961acHDAAU9Y1s0fVx2fzo7hg=; b=HcvzYD1fk5kX9zGduVLD ITG2NeXnTH/2B7FtJT+zMGAJwyrN2T+CijOhUGiREtWB7LOPYe3bMSJJSycy1H3v+6fe2Mk3/3yJh K/5xLLTf2ttbpgzO+Oz3IldQWtvKpkRUmv+Mpa1026kV8FLmcx0X+Q4iI89/ywG56Aa/Qrrn69MHl gtSv22RtvWSiWYJE+7j92Nvbi79DDRDGcKcflIx9q0E0fCrmcOJE8Z5yu2LKjbMSRQ5+iNj6PDSI2 e3sRjZrL6L3u2jEX2mNQM6RBii9UXK0mr6TLR8jrIVW7Q88UlMZd7tl+B2kFQBp3lOzNhnGBkTGsB 6dZG+SMlmMlXOw==; From: Janneke Nieuwenhuizen In-Reply-To: <87y0zikfch.fsf@gmail.com> (Simon Tournier's message of "Fri, 10 Jan 2025 13:45:02 +0100") Organization: AvatarAcademy.nl References: <87y0zn4lvi.fsf_-_@gnu.org> <87h667nmdk.fsf@gnu.org> <87y0zikfch.fsf@gmail.com> X-Url: http://AvatarAcademy.nl Date: Fri, 10 Jan 2025 14:17:03 +0100 Message-ID: <871pxaolkg.fsf@gnu.org> User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list X-BeenThere: guix-patches@gnu.org List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: guix-patches-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org Sender: guix-patches-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org X-Migadu-Flow: FLOW_IN X-Migadu-Country: US X-Migadu-Scanner: mx12.migadu.com X-Migadu-Spam-Score: -2.67 X-Spam-Score: -2.67 X-Migadu-Queue-Id: 1102C1C061 X-TUID: fnhc6S1FvXW3 Simon Tournier writes: Hi Simon, > On Fri, 10 Jan 2025 at 08:44, Janneke Nieuwenhuizen wro= te: > >>> # Motivation [..] >> * to draw more attention to / have important discussions stand out >> more in all the "noise", and guided by [..] > Yes! :-) Great! > >> A drawback could be that it slows >> development down, but for important changes that may be a good thing? > > I would you say yes :-) > > And I would also say it=E2=80=99s a counter measure against =E2=80=9CWhy = wasn't I > consulted=E2=80=9C [1] or some bullet points [2] from the talk that appea= r to me > helpful and that had been inspiration. > > 1: https://youtu.be/m0rakUuPXFM > 2: https://simon.tournier.info/posts/2023-10-30-toward-rfc.html Yes, I tend to agree. Especially improving the chance to get involved is a very good thing. >> The only things that I could suggest is to see if we should make it even >> be more lightweight/nimble as a first version, e.g, require only two >> *persons*, so that two authors could start a submission >> >> The RFC is *submitted* once it has at least one co-author or >> supporter in addition to the initial author(s). > > Ah you mean that the case of =E2=80=99two authors=E2=80=99 does not requi= re a Sponsor*, > right? Ah yes, Possibly I'm splitting hairs here too much. But ISTM that having one author and one sponsor being enough, whereas in the situation where an early sponsor actually contributes to become a second author, they would now have to go look for a third person. Dunno. > *Sponsor: was =E2=80=99Supporter=E2=80=99 but renamed in order to avoid c= onfusion > between supporting the Document before the Discussion Period and > replying =E2=80=99I support=E2=80=99 during the Delibration Period. Noted. Sorry for being sloppy with the terms :) >> or use shorter periods, e.g. >> >> submission[label=3Dup to 7=C2=A0days>] >> comments[label=3D15=E2=80=9360=C2=A0days>] >> deliberation[label=3D8-14=C2=A0days>] >> >> but I have no strong opinion on these. > > About the Discussion Period, I do not have an opinion. From my > intuition, it appears to be helpful when all have the time and space for > expressing their comments. > > About the Deliberation Period, I think we need to have enough time and 2 > weeks sound the good range based on what we are already doing for patch > review. Indeed, that mathes. I was just thinking about a patch that "just passes the RFC-importance threshold" but could have been applied within a week because it got a lot of review and attention, then someone proposes to create an RFC, and then you're automatically looking at 7+30+14 =3D=3D ~7 weeks. It's a puzzle indeed. I was thinking: if "everyone involved" argees it could be done/decided quicker, policy seems to prevent that. Otoh, that protects the "why wasn't I consulted" problem. So yeah. If nobody else sees the need to make the first iteration more lightweight, I'm happy to try this. Thanks again for your efforts. Greetings, Janneke --=20 Janneke Nieuwenhuizen | GNU LilyPond https://LilyPond.org Freelance IT https://www.JoyOfSource.com | Avatar=C2=AE https://AvatarAcade= my.com