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Resent-From: Simon Tournier Original-Sender: "Debbugs-submit" Resent-CC: guix-patches@gnu.org Resent-Date: Thu, 12 Oct 2023 19:19:02 +0000 Resent-Message-ID: Resent-Sender: help-debbugs@gnu.org X-GNU-PR-Message: followup 66430 X-GNU-PR-Package: guix-patches X-GNU-PR-Keywords: patch To: Ludovic =?UTF-8?Q?Court=C3=A8s?= , Maxim Cournoyer Cc: 66430@debbugs.gnu.org Received: via spool by 66430-submit@debbugs.gnu.org id=B66430.16971382851972 (code B ref 66430); Thu, 12 Oct 2023 19:19:02 +0000 Received: (at 66430) by debbugs.gnu.org; 12 Oct 2023 19:18:05 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:44287 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1qr1C9-0000Vk-8u for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Thu, 12 Oct 2023 15:18:05 -0400 Received: from mail-wr1-x42a.google.com ([2a00:1450:4864:20::42a]:40375) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1qr1C4-0000V5-2Y for 66430@debbugs.gnu.org; Thu, 12 Oct 2023 15:18:03 -0400 Received: by mail-wr1-x42a.google.com with SMTP id ffacd0b85a97d-32163c3ece5so137944f8f.1 for <66430@debbugs.gnu.org>; Thu, 12 Oct 2023 12:17:37 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20230601; t=1697138251; x=1697743051; darn=debbugs.gnu.org; h=content-transfer-encoding:mime-version:message-id:date:references :in-reply-to:subject:cc:to:from:from:to:cc:subject:date:message-id :reply-to; bh=Y/lcf9M8otatPCht9ocTEAFRvwIDCNLNUxf+lawIMN4=; b=aJ0rpM0uJFDiewgrS9G22OPNxaKGrfxECD9NRm61F6eWqoPawOJHin17pcacMbmAaV B2RT+WmSJ94kjgmvspWJaygGxyXyziOaT72jtIomKVZEfvzsiLivrHDnV5SWSXUOpULx 4AodmLEcdDCy+l7Fumw2VtXj7SdLN1I/D2I6Mw7JNxl5xubzq1ZhsUmGgwzq+xAK2LDT ZqRKH/6rkL4/dyKKfGoKcYtzpjX8dr5QlM/U1aL2s2IzFBU35B+/PnIOayhYpkxhc9U3 SO+TM6OpGIzfTmWLd9YqIijF2Dk7APo7ldvAaG5VbJhJ9Ro5IzAZdkN9H05kHT22uYhk UZxA== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20230601; t=1697138251; x=1697743051; h=content-transfer-encoding:mime-version:message-id:date:references :in-reply-to:subject:cc:to:from:x-gm-message-state:from:to:cc :subject:date:message-id:reply-to; bh=Y/lcf9M8otatPCht9ocTEAFRvwIDCNLNUxf+lawIMN4=; b=fwX/pUqR8Q/F3p/erFgvYQjlaBgn5Q27xI8CSSqkR5U/mrAVAUIAALoQDA2AANcc62 lukI/SfItMOMmIhGDMFGdWLIvir/b2IskUMOTMnHIPfoT6sFLWXo0HAPlK50pBbH209S uDq6zvCS4Y9P3Mo+1NrlQsC6w1tLL/4D1qe9QYzMk4EQK1vM/bTuaR2V25rRt8abqzWz bLJEb5ZtzpgCyTQ5eyiWwjAvZIF4UhcJ04J0gCRLRnXasYjep4ULaH+8YPHcKH55+hZS g72mc0N2KqpX4xCH25Jc7qE1lee3IwKpRaZX2a++ik5qRk7UD7rpai5Wpv9/i1tvMZ3Q F26w== X-Gm-Message-State: AOJu0Yx7A8Lgkf2xSiNjOUcIzB4nIgKmD4ddwneheWzBDIkrMxPSZ35l uhGxIiMu2w3JywBRidbA6p2h/2o31FI= X-Google-Smtp-Source: AGHT+IF/jx9iap3uGfa8lwhHJrfc+f7l0kUtAkTCAcguJd08JUZaB0bJ5eay77lZdRbaZcawjCvlmA== X-Received: by 2002:a5d:58c2:0:b0:324:87d3:873d with SMTP id o2-20020a5d58c2000000b0032487d3873dmr21250576wrf.3.1697138251374; Thu, 12 Oct 2023 12:17:31 -0700 (PDT) Received: from lili ([2a01:e0a:59b:9120:65d2:2476:f637:db1e]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id q8-20020a05600000c800b0032415213a6fsm18979035wrx.87.2023.10.12.12.17.30 (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 bits=256/256); Thu, 12 Oct 2023 12:17:31 -0700 (PDT) From: Simon Tournier In-Reply-To: <87h6mwrhl6.fsf@gnu.org> References: <5760a46dfc1b97312d1d5512ebf1bd21da6707f5.1696903067.git.maxim.cournoyer@gmail.com> <87h6mwrhl6.fsf@gnu.org> Date: Thu, 12 Oct 2023 21:17:22 +0200 Message-ID: <86mswnzm4d.fsf@gmail.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list X-BeenThere: guix-patches@gnu.org List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: guix-patches-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org Sender: guix-patches-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org X-Migadu-Flow: FLOW_IN X-Migadu-Country: US X-Spam-Score: 2.80 X-Migadu-Queue-Id: 9B2AC68AFB X-Migadu-Scanner: mx0.migadu.com X-Migadu-Spam-Score: 2.80 X-TUID: ixYQy6qRScFc Hi, On Wed, 11 Oct 2023 at 23:10, Ludovic Court=C3=A8s wrote: >> +@url{https://www.seedsforchange.org.uk/consensus}. The project uses the >> +@samp{Requiring people who block to help find solutions} block variant, >> +which means a participant wishing to block a proposal bears a >> +special responsibility for finding alternatives and proposing ideas/code >> +to resolve the deadlock. > > I=E2=80=99m unsure about this. A situation I have in mind is this: a vol= unteer > writes a review describing issues with a proposed change that have no > obvious solution, or rejecting the change altogether (for instance > because it=E2=80=99s deemed outside the scope of the project or tool). > > How would one interpret the reviewer=E2=80=99s responsibility in this cas= e? Using the wording I am proposing [1], the case would be solved by =E2=80=9Csignificant concerns=E2=80=9D, =E2=80=9Ccan live with=E2=80=9D, = =E2=80=9Cactively=E2=80=9D and =E2=80=9Cspecial responsibility for finding alternatives=E2=80=9D. Well, this wording [1] tries to capture Maxim=E2=80=99s answer [2], I guess. Somehow, it is an attempt to 1. summarize what consensus means, and 2. clarify that blocking also implies actively being part of the resolution. Maybe, what is missing is explicitly mention the status quo case. In my mind it is covered by =E2=80=9Cfinding alternatives=E2=80=9D but maybe it w= ould be better to explicit mention it. What do you think about this, --8<---------------cut here---------------start------------->8--- It is expected from all contributors, and even more so from committers, to help build consensus and make decisions based on consensus. By using consensus, we are committed to finding solutions that everyone can live with. It implies that no decision is made against significant concerns and these concerns are actively resolved with proposals that work for everyone. A participant wishing to block a proposal bears a special responsibility for finding alternatives, proposing ideas/code or detailing the status quo to resolve the deadlock. To learn what consensus decision making means and understand its finer details, you are encouraged to read . --8<---------------cut here---------------end--------------->8--- ? Cheers, simon 1: [bug#66430] [PATCH] doc: Mention the responsibilities that blocking come= s with. Simon Tournier Wed, 11 Oct 2023 11:30:10 +0200 id:867cntld5p.fsf@gmail.com https://issues.guix.gnu.org//66430 https://issues.guix.gnu.org/msgid/867cntld5p.fsf@gmail.com https://yhetil.org/guix/867cntld5p.fsf@gmail.com 2: [bug#66430] [PATCH] doc: Mention the responsibilities that blocking come= s with. Maxim Cournoyer Thu, 12 Oct 2023 13:08:53 -0400 id:87pm1j7opm.fsf@gmail.com https://issues.guix.gnu.org//66430 https://issues.guix.gnu.org/msgid/87pm1j7opm.fsf@gmail.com https://yhetil.org/guix/87pm1j7opm.fsf@gmail.com