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[174.51.218.141]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id u9-20020a02cb89000000b0042b37dda71asm790703jap.136.2023.08.25.17.16.31 (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 bits=128/128); Fri, 25 Aug 2023 17:16:31 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: Date: Fri, 25 Aug 2023 18:16:30 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux x86_64; rv:102.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/102.13.0 Subject: Re: How can we decrease the cognitive overhead for contributors? Content-Language: en-US To: Ekaitz Zarraga , Csepp Cc: guix-devel@gnu.org Newsgroups: gmane.comp.gnu.guix.devel References: <871qfsayyx.fsf@riseup.net> From: Katherine Cox-Buday In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Received-SPF: pass client-ip=2607:f8b0:4864:20::d2f; envelope-from=cox.katherine.e@gmail.com; helo=mail-io1-xd2f.google.com X-Spam_score_int: -36 X-Spam_score: -3.7 X-Spam_bar: --- X-Spam_report: (-3.7 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, NICE_REPLY_A=-1.57, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001 autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-BeenThere: guix-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: "Development of GNU Guix and the GNU System distribution." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: guix-devel-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org Sender: guix-devel-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org X-Migadu-Flow: FLOW_IN X-Migadu-Country: US X-Migadu-Scanner: mx0.migadu.com X-Spam-Score: -5.78 X-Migadu-Queue-Id: 306F66D0C3 X-Migadu-Spam-Score: -5.78 X-TUID: TuVjz0YJtlnX On 8/24/23 6:10 PM, Ekaitz Zarraga wrote: >> Lots of important use cases that >> Guix could serve are ignored because the people who need them are not >> represented in our community and/or they can't contribute and no one is >> able/willing to write code for them. > > Yes, and even if you manage to write something yourself, many times you > get now answer to your patches because no one else is interested on what > you did. It's perfectly understandable but also discouraging. > > Example: I wanted to push Zig support in guix a while ago. Made a build > system and got no answer. > The feeling here is that the code proposed is not good enough, but I don't > know how to improve it so I'm stuck. It would be great to feel comfortable > enough with the code to be sure that it can be merged, but I can't find > the resources to make it better. If it was clearer or if it was easier > both sides, maintainers and contributors, would be more effective and > happier. Yes, a point I'm seeing echoed a lot here which I can't highlight enough is: Any effort made to make it easier to contribute helps everyone, not just those having issues. Your point about your patch going unanswered is indeed a good example. Here we sit with no Zig build system. It can't be proven, but maybe if contributing and reviewing were easier, we'd have more hands, and getting something like that merged would be easier. >>> * It's OK to make lots of mistakes >>> >>> The people who have reviewed my code have been generous both with their >>> time and fixing my mistakes and then applying. Maybe this model is OK? I >>> still feel guilty every time a reviewer has to correct an oversight I've >>> made. I also want to become a committer, but I don't know how that would >>> work if I'm regularly making mistakes. Obviously people would still be >>> reviewing my commits, but presumably a committer should not regularly be >>> making mistakes. > > Exactly my feeling. And I've been working with Guix for a while... Same here. My first commit was in 2018.