From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from mp1 ([2001:41d0:2:4a6f::]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits)) by ms0.migadu.com with LMTPS id GeG0ExiLvGCpgAEAgWs5BA (envelope-from ) for ; Sun, 06 Jun 2021 10:45:12 +0200 Received: from aspmx1.migadu.com ([2001:41d0:2:4a6f::]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits)) by mp1 with LMTPS id wOllDhiLvGBWIgAAbx9fmQ (envelope-from ) for ; Sun, 06 Jun 2021 08:45:12 +0000 Received: from lists.gnu.org (lists.gnu.org [209.51.188.17]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by aspmx1.migadu.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 5BBC8FFCA for ; Sun, 6 Jun 2021 10:45:11 +0200 (CEST) Received: from localhost ([::1]:39272 helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1lpoP8-0002Au-C8 for larch@yhetil.org; Sun, 06 Jun 2021 04:45:10 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:60680) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1lpoOu-0002AV-72 for guix-devel@gnu.org; Sun, 06 Jun 2021 04:44:56 -0400 Received: from flashner.co.il ([178.62.234.194]:53400) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1lpoOs-0008AX-6a for guix-devel@gnu.org; Sun, 06 Jun 2021 04:44:56 -0400 Received: from localhost (unknown [31.210.177.125]) by flashner.co.il (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 47E6240336; Sun, 6 Jun 2021 08:44:52 +0000 (UTC) Date: Sun, 6 Jun 2021 11:43:46 +0300 From: Efraim Flashner To: Mark H Weaver Subject: Re: Which kernel series to use in the installer and for installed systems? 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List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Cc: Vagrant Cascadian , guix-devel@gnu.org Errors-To: guix-devel-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org Sender: "Guix-devel" X-Migadu-Flow: FLOW_IN ARC-Message-Signature: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=yhetil.org; s=key1; t=1622969112; h=from:from:sender:sender:reply-to:subject:subject:date:date: message-id:message-id:to:to:cc:cc:mime-version:mime-version: content-type:content-type:in-reply-to:in-reply-to: references:references:list-id:list-help:list-unsubscribe: list-subscribe:list-post; bh=u/zdiCz0fbuAQ7BnWTdmL4Ropwg1+kHaxE6svTXk+h0=; b=RPEhx3U/rbwLaw/6TtBtFb5mkQs2QOxQ5tiixd3O9r0trR/YUL8fOUGrX6Wvh7zos2mRZW m/b6QvzzxU8iFf8w5NtvrqfR6geO/t+xOqsbcm4p9JEdb5wGqMDSb+vV4DLv+Nu0AmKq3+ 8YElNHTs0s8Ql9NDVbTJetEcz/Z3zk2+n0fhqAOAoFJpJzru0u92Ga+DKPwnnnJM+FfPbB Ll9a3eC0VGpA75AJeB6agPTOEygI0Zf6dY8F+csnxQoPbi22oTBGpvsTMjPjex+7C5ckWm S4MPRnKvIaKKLkvOwseSbj20k+2VVkJ5jNNK6uAVT8K2gIvQfVJFyaTpGE+LoA== ARC-Seal: i=1; s=key1; d=yhetil.org; t=1622969112; a=rsa-sha256; cv=none; b=UZbu+e0HYyqRm2p3q6aBzWwRzCGh/HpPOcHiAZ45vkXJ2Sf3K/QUxQXlZmjmwqV90C9UNf 1FYgMPx2V+Gdg2/1p+S1VPYC10sq38DMFKXxaTSWDuvtyPbKh6l5ZOQEHyQulaEdHUeilu RNgHfYqaoZhtbQdBa9QCU0Qp12iVRRE9268ERdvHRNNOpeVexHxZ7LIBWGQQSpW0rFmT8Q 19mA7iGgk0hLupJv6WVvewctLORdYzhrQYXQpaW+GGO1YPYZwRpBO8Dfl2OfoHhv+xYgyu hdxxc4CKebow3q0tANhR4Yx0rkQyj/I/lG1z5U2OWujUDMLyI8phfi85jiZMlQ== ARC-Authentication-Results: i=1; aspmx1.migadu.com; dkim=none; dmarc=none; spf=pass (aspmx1.migadu.com: domain of guix-devel-bounces@gnu.org designates 209.51.188.17 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=guix-devel-bounces@gnu.org X-Migadu-Spam-Score: -3.03 Authentication-Results: aspmx1.migadu.com; dkim=none; dmarc=none; spf=pass (aspmx1.migadu.com: domain of guix-devel-bounces@gnu.org designates 209.51.188.17 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=guix-devel-bounces@gnu.org X-Migadu-Queue-Id: 5BBC8FFCA X-Spam-Score: -3.03 X-Migadu-Scanner: scn0.migadu.com X-TUID: AqWmqMk9VVL3 --UrddssEA0P2LV9t8 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On Sat, Jun 05, 2021 at 02:09:59PM -0400, Mark H Weaver wrote: > Hi Efraim, >=20 > Efraim Flashner writes: > > I don't really understand why > > and how a newer kernel would make things stop working, >=20 > Newer kernels _usually_ work fine, but occasionally things break, and > that's much more likely to happen when switching to a newer kernel > series. It happened to me quite recently, when a couple of us found > that early 5.12.x kernels would lock up a Thinkpad X200 within minutes > of booting. See . >=20 > For those who can afford to deal with breakage like this at unscheduled > times, the 'linux-libre' variable is likely the best choice. For those > who prefer stability, I recommend 'linux-libre-X.YY' for some LTS series > X.YY. >=20 > The 'linux-libre-lts' variable seems to me the worst of both worlds, and > likely to lead to some people getting burned from unexpected kernel > upgrades that they might not have been expecting. If 'linux-libre-lts' > is included as an option, I recommend adding text that makes it clear to > users that automatic upgrades to newer LTS series will happen without > warning, years before such upgrades are needed. >=20 > What do you think? >=20 > Regards, > Mark >=20 I know if I were using the zfs kernel module I'd want to use the most recent lts release. I like the idea of labeling it something like: * linux-libre (tracks the latest kernel release) * linux-libre-lts (tracks most recent long-term support release, with upgrades to newer versions automatically) * linux-libre-5.10 (current long-term support release, supported until December 2026) I know upstream uses 'stable' to mean the current release, but I personally find the terminology confusing. --=20 Efraim Flashner =D7=90=D7=A4=D7=A8=D7=99=D7=9D = =D7=A4=D7=9C=D7=A9=D7=A0=D7=A8 GPG key =3D A28B F40C 3E55 1372 662D 14F7 41AA E7DC CA3D 8351 Confidentiality cannot be guaranteed on emails sent or received unencrypted --UrddssEA0P2LV9t8 Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name="signature.asc" -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- iQIzBAABCgAdFiEEoov0DD5VE3JmLRT3Qarn3Mo9g1EFAmC8isAACgkQQarn3Mo9 g1GTRA/+Lo14DZ7YFagH3f8+WLV0Eb4KeV33zEbgwDxa2PU4wTcHnjDy7w9SBY/c C+UBmKILQjPM+I9M2yUlu67HXQV7Bo/+zXMIDqfWonuzQM23KP44D4JumYHMS583 EIfF50Vta7J9bLiHqVbjn2dIWSSVP10ieF+otVJTQJPSU2w9jQDEnT9Fhf3dvRp/ mWnoZqDPZseMVI82KHMxbUQwjQbDX+h8O6MvgDyCpUXsV2Uu9ijOS/j7WGBfoAg4 ToePvhUcAZvRgtcb8YP8QKpGuyY6H4zgN7kJxlR5aOp2sfwIERcOeylHf66E/Hd5 +8LrzXLywfGeFzbprcDcKmdOOVEVD4QqaVIx2qJaFWjPKnfDguV4k1F5d8cilFQM VnCU1H9rBr1MllDpsoZUySvf4Py0dK762O9Q/zsZsQERbH6miHFneeJzkByUPScD QbMBMHhEdZNSFtOYuw45VAm9o+/Pg/HtQRJ11bZABLq4vOh++FqC94EyNhlkELUT FX1yzi4uqphD+drZjbeusdhSgI/iAf5O1JBJ/Fqr/72MIcjdi8KVN6uGX3LTQFec ptRjuUt1QgLK8qY92piOgJU/9N+DFU94PbzsPlrGnOdfAYFrmunZMXApN5+ISQpR CXLzMXJEwpVYjmfLCNYDwCV7VWFCW28H9mzD8OtSxou+VXuRDI4= =7DmT -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --UrddssEA0P2LV9t8--