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Sun, 19 Jun 2022 16:55:42 +1000 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable From: Paul Jewell Mime-Version: 1.0 (1.0) Subject: Re: On commit access, patch review, and remaining healthy Date: Sun, 19 Jun 2022 08:55:36 +0200 Message-Id: References: <87lety2ywg.fsf@systemreboot.net> Cc: zimoun , Giovanni Biscuolo , =?utf-8?Q?Ludovic_Court=C3=A8s?= , Guix Devel , GNU Guix maintainers In-Reply-To: <87lety2ywg.fsf@systemreboot.net> To: Arun Isaac X-Mailer: iPad Mail (19F77) X-OutGoing-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.0 X-AuthUser: paul@teulu.org Received-SPF: softfail client-ip=23.83.218.249; envelope-from=paul@teulu.org; helo=poodle.tulip.relay.mailchannels.net X-Spam_score_int: -13 X-Spam_score: -1.4 X-Spam_bar: - X-Spam_report: (-1.4 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, MIME_QP_LONG_LINE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_SOFTFAIL=0.665, T_SCC_BODY_TEXT_LINE=-0.01 autolearn=no autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-BeenThere: guix-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: "Development of GNU Guix and the GNU System distribution." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: guix-devel-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org Sender: "Guix-devel" X-Migadu-Flow: FLOW_IN X-Migadu-To: larch@yhetil.org X-Migadu-Country: US ARC-Message-Signature: i=2; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=yhetil.org; s=key1; t=1655621809; h=from:from:sender:sender:reply-to:subject:subject:date:date: message-id:message-id:to:to:cc:cc:mime-version:mime-version: content-type:content-type: content-transfer-encoding:content-transfer-encoding: in-reply-to:in-reply-to:references:references:list-id:list-help: list-unsubscribe:list-subscribe:list-post:dkim-signature; bh=NGIa6sSQ6K0u0tIAtEavBWh8slscuFkYavNL5ThaVPY=; b=U6tpNdegV40KDV2T1loYA4WwXEODLUff5P/7RLEK4RtPX+6fCXq4yDBP3bToJHM/89HUNy 9dthIdgALtmoXKOe8d5kN1mdN4h+iXsj16Lmf7FhNgJ9//6MlTtde5d/LCaCmDH9a98avQ 3MtQigX7FWQJ9eUFZ4LkPVUjfTKgqN38oGCllOHlzZ4BOPdcK0hqHu7b5TT2180xpE7b0P 35Xcdz/FgyI/CuiL8FXEVss4s9uCjIgW7qbe9VWPoH+Ek77HefJLd5BSxHnw+XblxHUOR0 deDEfynfdMQDzMy1tpn/vbQ4wvd4MgV4BiUu24cQwK1HKloJCXapGGutN+Gnpw== ARC-Seal: i=2; s=key1; d=yhetil.org; t=1655621809; a=rsa-sha256; cv=pass; b=rmFBY0e+7sdmbB5/IE4GeSXmArgLOekvjcUxV4hIJWr7lDqSYLHxwgnRbVrmECcIXLP/kW YI6rfjEB87enmQcbpr0rjKTwgEks4z0iZ8Dn2KjtHUIf4MegRtoOtRCTy7AkkMkCAD86gM 8X3a5HY+KOPYXyHN8sLQmDgHU0d47gD3vmNTHZXn9VUtlfkHcqYljFLMWdpMQxv1STeBqn j3GscX7hwPNt46vxGsaTcj8gFVlaoHRNPlDmBEuEzHYs0+dw6dc9J1KgBLXty+T43BFssO cI+y+DpxyElihCo86vuQ70HiWLhVquBkj23xf7XLoTWF2wnxLrjL+g8a+EE89w== ARC-Authentication-Results: i=2; aspmx1.migadu.com; dkim=fail ("headers rsa verify failed") header.d=teulu.org header.s=default header.b=G8wglO0q; arc=pass ("mailchannels.net:s=arc-2022:i=1"); dmarc=none; spf=pass (aspmx1.migadu.com: domain of "guix-devel-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org" designates 209.51.188.17 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom="guix-devel-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org" X-Migadu-Spam-Score: 0.91 Authentication-Results: aspmx1.migadu.com; dkim=fail ("headers rsa verify failed") header.d=teulu.org header.s=default header.b=G8wglO0q; arc=pass ("mailchannels.net:s=arc-2022:i=1"); dmarc=none; spf=pass (aspmx1.migadu.com: domain of "guix-devel-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org" designates 209.51.188.17 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom="guix-devel-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org" X-Migadu-Queue-Id: 92047CBA3 X-Spam-Score: 0.91 X-Migadu-Scanner: scn0.migadu.com X-TUID: 5vP8kBcif4n8 > On 15 Jun 2022, at 09:15, Arun Isaac wrote: >=20 > I would also like to raise a couple of more controversial suggestions: >=20 > Should we restrict the set of packages that will be accepted into Guix? > Currently, we accept practically any free software package into > Guix. Should we limit the number of packages we will accept in order to > ease maintenance? "Minimal" distros like Arch Linux do this, for > example. >=20 > The cons are that, say if we reject packages involving difficult > languages (think javascript), we may alienate a section of our users > (and potential users) and thus inhibit further growth. If we go down > this route, Guix may never grow into an "universal distribution" like > Debian is. >=20 If there is someone willing to maintain the packages, then in my opinion suc= h restrictions shouldn=E2=80=99t be applied. I guess this would mean knowing= who is the maintainer for each package in guix, but this could also be a te= am (reference the recent teams discussion). > Also, should we remove old/broken/unused/rarely-used packages from Guix? > In the past, I have packaged and contributed very niche packages which > probably no one else uses, and sometimes even I don't use anymore. But, > these packages continue to stay in Guix and add to the maintenance > burden. Should we have some policy to phase out such packages, > especially if such packages break often? I mean, that there is no need > to phase out an elisp package that builds trivially all the time, but > what about more complex packages that take many many hours to maintain? I think they should be removed. This could link to the maintainer comment ab= ove. If a package is identified as old or broken, then users could be notifi= ed, and after a =E2=80=9Ccooling off=E2=80=9D period they are removed. This c= ould allow for discussion about whether removal is appropriate, or whether s= omeone else would step up and update the package. Under Gentoo (the distro I= know well, having used it since 2004), obsolete and problematic packages ar= e hard masked, and users notified why, and when removal from the repository w= ill occur. The hard masking prevents new installations (almost - you can mak= e some additional configuration changes to enable installation). Users then h= ave a choice - support the resolution of the issues leading to hard masking,= or move the package definition to a personal repository so it can continue t= o be used (at their own risk). Regarding rarely used packages - I wouldn=E2=80= =99t remove these if there is a maintainer for them and they are still being= kept up to date. If this no longer happens, then they are in the old/broken= category. I guess the big question for me is =E2=80=9Ccould this be automated in some w= ay?=E2=80=9D > I don't have strong opinions on these questions. I would love to hear > what others think. >=20 I hope my comments are useful! Best regards, Paul