Re: Feature requests

[Joshua Marshall <j.marshall@arroyo.io>]

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Thank you!  I have ~500 pages of other stuff to read this week, but I'll
get to this as soon as I can.

On Mon, Mar 25, 2019 at 5:40 AM Giovanni Biscuolo <g@xelera.eu> wrote:

> Hi Joshua,
>
> Joshua Marshall <j.marshall@arroyo.io> writes:
>
> [...]
>
> > I'd like to see it take on
> > the ability to have a per-installation target cgroup, network namespace,
> > and filesystem chroot settings set with defaults which are overridable at
> > invocation.
>
> me too and the only missing point above (AFAIU) is network isolation for
> Guix containers, I mean one created via `guix environment` or `guix
> system container`)
>
> having that, the "last mile" in *obsoleting* tools like Docker &
> Co. (e.g. kubernetes, even openstack probably) is to have a declarative
> way to setup containers, something like `containers.<name>` from NixOS
> [1]
>
> ...and a set of Guix services to declaratively `scale out` an
> infrastrtucture: a layer 4+7 proxy (e.g. haproxy, missing in Guix),
> Software Defined Network (openvswitch, got it!), Software Defined
> Storage (ceph: we have the pachage but missing the service AFAIU)
>
> anyway: containers are here to solve infrastructural problems, not
> development environments problems :-)
>
> [1] https://nixos.org/nixos/manual/index.html#sec-declarative-containers
>
> > In this way, a user could install and use packages with
> > mutually incompatible dependencies (I talked about this with a few people
> > on IRC) like what happens with python.  If this kind of functionality
> were
> > added, it would largely supplant Docker,
>
> you cited Docker so I guess you are using containers as a mean to
> isolate *development environment* each other and from the *production
> environment*, not to build an insfrastructure of isolated set of
> processes (including networking layer) - let's call them nodes -
> possibly distributed on several hosts
>
> in this thread Julien already explained how to achieve this with `guix
> environment`: with Guix (and Nix, the *only* other sofware natively
> permitting this) you don't need to install a container to have
> *isolated* development environments
>
> AFAIU in *many*, many, many use cases containers (Docker, LXC and so on)
> are _not_ used as an infrastructural component but as a development
> tool: Guix obsoletes this thanks to its native isolated environments
> (made possible by The Store)
>
> I hope more and more developers will realize this since this is
> _for_sure_ a big win for the entire free software community (no more
> python virtualenv clones, *please*)
>
> > virtualenv, pip, poetry, apk,
> > pacman, and probably a few other tools at my company which are there just
> > to handle this kind of frailness.
>
> `guix environment` and the package definition programming interface [2]
> (it's really easy to learn, believe me :-) ) are your best friends here
>
> you can even `guix pack` sofware bundles (e.g. in Docker format) and
> distribute it to your internal/external customers who are still not able
> to use Guix to install them
>
> [2]
> https://www.gnu.org/software/guix/manual/en/html_node/Defining-Packages.html#Defining-Packages
>
> [...]
>
> HTH to better explain how development works in a Guix environment :-)
>
> Gio
>
> --
> Giovanni Biscuolo
>
> Xelera IT Infrastructures
>

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