From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from mp10.migadu.com ([2001:41d0:2:bcc0::]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits)) by ms0.migadu.com with LMTPS id 2OrdJ9C/RmKPegEAgWs5BA (envelope-from ) for ; Fri, 01 Apr 2022 11:03:12 +0200 Received: from aspmx1.migadu.com ([2001:41d0:2:bcc0::]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits)) by mp10.migadu.com with LMTPS id sFSyINC/RmI9/wAAG6o9tA (envelope-from ) for ; Fri, 01 Apr 2022 11:03:12 +0200 Received: from lists.gnu.org (lists.gnu.org [209.51.188.17]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by aspmx1.migadu.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 1A187164D3 for ; Fri, 1 Apr 2022 11:03:12 +0200 (CEST) Received: from localhost ([::1]:44012 helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1naDBX-0007uf-3u for larch@yhetil.org; Fri, 01 Apr 2022 05:03:11 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([209.51.188.92]:53700) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1naD79-0004nT-S8 for guix-devel@gnu.org; Fri, 01 Apr 2022 04:58:40 -0400 Received: from [2001:470:142:3::e] (port=50216 helo=fencepost.gnu.org) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1naD70-0003qW-8c; Fri, 01 Apr 2022 04:58:38 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnu.org; s=fencepost-gnu-org; h=MIME-Version:In-Reply-To:Date:References:Subject:To: From; bh=4STb/ufBlcfdGdbNA/gfzJ2JSpL7BwRcyc1YBVvVykw=; b=gjm+OOTBAQ/TZ2IA6JVD Nc4xmBEYJN/06zM7CoU41zP0I65egYb0FbJOQCRi4VjJ2ffvNWSrSzVdjHhuM/mkYE3Tgg/zta8C8 wKEmZIIVvfuYHZJR0n7Q0vMxKHeXSikypRUTuyb1jX4V9o+88XWo5pSjdakkTATaOL2TmpAAH3Dnu sD+RGSPw6dLUyAhzMt5gN/r8jabHdTFpchLvl/KAbKV7fgBPknOdELBY4WJce9lurCW6wJIRM1+Bd lyMYY3lZ3WQPM1/GnqG3qyV8FLFOENsxXjeEdRFUZAs+069mT/8SHbCXCoY+c43Ftt2RVv7TeS0H8 QjkuqBSZtto4gw==; Received: from [2001:660:6102:320:e120:2c8f:8909:cdfe] (port=38734 helo=ribbon) by fencepost.gnu.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1naD6k-000648-6I; Fri, 01 Apr 2022 04:58:24 -0400 From: =?utf-8?Q?Ludovic_Court=C3=A8s?= To: Maxime Devos Subject: Re: Autotools-generated 'configure' & 'Makefile.in' considered binaries? References: <9c2ca57d59672fc4f9ebc0230b08d8953030a456.camel@telenet.be> X-URL: http://www.fdn.fr/~lcourtes/ X-Revolutionary-Date: 12 Germinal an 230 de la =?utf-8?Q?R=C3=A9volution?= X-PGP-Key-ID: 0x090B11993D9AEBB5 X-PGP-Key: http://www.fdn.fr/~lcourtes/ludovic.asc X-PGP-Fingerprint: 3CE4 6455 8A84 FDC6 9DB4 0CFB 090B 1199 3D9A EBB5 X-OS: x86_64-pc-linux-gnu Date: Fri, 01 Apr 2022 10:58:11 +0200 In-Reply-To: <9c2ca57d59672fc4f9ebc0230b08d8953030a456.camel@telenet.be> (Maxime Devos's message of "Wed, 30 Mar 2022 14:04:34 +0200") Message-ID: <87zgl5npss.fsf@gnu.org> User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/27.2 (gnu/linux) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-BeenThere: guix-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: "Development of GNU Guix and the GNU System distribution." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Cc: guix-devel@gnu.org Errors-To: guix-devel-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org Sender: "Guix-devel" X-Migadu-Flow: FLOW_IN X-Migadu-To: larch@yhetil.org X-Migadu-Country: US ARC-Message-Signature: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=yhetil.org; s=key1; t=1648803792; h=from:from:sender:sender:reply-to:subject:subject:date:date: message-id:message-id:to:to:cc:cc:mime-version:mime-version: content-type:content-type: content-transfer-encoding:content-transfer-encoding: in-reply-to:in-reply-to:references:references:list-id:list-help: list-unsubscribe:list-subscribe:list-post:dkim-signature; bh=4STb/ufBlcfdGdbNA/gfzJ2JSpL7BwRcyc1YBVvVykw=; b=Gg+vC9k5Pl3BwrJ+WIiFVuVcao6NZ0bTOXHCDMNCdiyuAL62Ica/PMt+Fr7mnj/VyfKgEj NF58iaUe2hDzXvPVgRI4awU42Cbo4nUnN91HxKhi1tMYnlj3+c7nPgEInO2Olac7MpscXr g79jRBYO/IUQ1BNAdDtGELE+LLMCeIsZfYXGxuv3ygc6YjyIs8Ub+vdiuQwjASu1jPam3A +2fsxcqwAXGJGVzQtY4+6gbDuufukl0fhkI7/7ZnkXQzLS/loAuDhll9dIsk1ovqBuSEMY w7APdjx6tpe5K7yjpBVqbRZftjm+nr1HBQo1LKVNYZMTgSMty38STKxl+JUQPQ== ARC-Seal: i=1; s=key1; d=yhetil.org; t=1648803792; a=rsa-sha256; cv=none; b=X0w18wJ6ojZS5ZTjyVdPACZ0QbwIHMCOB6okO2f92BkcnLKt9Wxm8r2ou+BX/8cFoguTgp vSzxh8jBnoDCgvtm2Q3p+ailMM6ekKgLqirrxKh4F0VPjTXROPFu/+keSlCRbBa1MMTP2L L2yZkWl2YkguJFRdHRk0ruVBTN3Cjhwv/FkXBAND7VB7Hl+BRMRM2lzq/UAiBqzBF/b3Tr /qw46nK5TTgK1UIznWZTgiG/AuE1dlx5OOixMoR8ZO+X/+ugZirWaf1UYnBGVqaSrHZTr0 /LpjfCnFPVD6wdlqD80aJ4cEfBNO1qOskQaGQqkJ/GE7+XMNPaySzsHsoVB5LQ== ARC-Authentication-Results: i=1; aspmx1.migadu.com; dkim=pass header.d=gnu.org header.s=fencepost-gnu-org header.b=gjm+OOTB; dmarc=pass (policy=none) header.from=gnu.org; spf=pass (aspmx1.migadu.com: domain of "guix-devel-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org" designates 209.51.188.17 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom="guix-devel-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org" X-Migadu-Spam-Score: -4.27 Authentication-Results: aspmx1.migadu.com; dkim=pass header.d=gnu.org header.s=fencepost-gnu-org header.b=gjm+OOTB; dmarc=pass (policy=none) header.from=gnu.org; spf=pass (aspmx1.migadu.com: domain of "guix-devel-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org" designates 209.51.188.17 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom="guix-devel-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org" X-Migadu-Queue-Id: 1A187164D3 X-Spam-Score: -4.27 X-Migadu-Scanner: scn1.migadu.com X-TUID: ZEbKTPtLQ+ZA Hi! Maxime Devos skribis: > Quite some packages in Guix use the Autotools system. In this system, > a 'configure.ac' and 'Makefile.am' script / makefile is written, from > which 'autoconf' & 'automake' generate a very long bash script and a > Makefile.in. Depending on the maintainer of the upstream package, this > 'configure' and 'Makefile.in' are sometimes included in release > tarballs. Clearly, this is an exception to the rule in Guix, some might say it=E2=80= =99s the elephant in the room. Debian has long considered that these are not source and so it regenerates all these files as a first step (IIRC). This is conceptually the =E2=80=9Cright thing=E2=80=9D, but it raises a sig= nificant bootstrapping problem. Our bootstrap path currently focuses on being able to run shell scripts, in particular =E2=80=98configure=E2=80=99 script= s, before we can even build Bash, thanks to Gash and Gash-Utils. If we were to build the autotools machinery systematically, we=E2=80=99d need Gash-Utils to pro= vide a Perl and an M4 implementation. (Now, Timothy has written an Awk interpreter, so a Perl interpreter can=E2=80=99t be so hard, right? :-)) The other option is to write an Autoconf and Automake implementation=E2=80= =A6 As a first milestone, maybe we could start running =E2=80=98autoreconf=E2= =80=99 more often, for packages higher in the graph. We could change the =E2=80=98bootstrap=E2=80=99 build phase to do that unless it=E2=80=99s expl= icitly turned off. It may turn out to be a Sisyphean task though=E2=80=A6 Thoughts? Ludo=E2=80=99.