From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from mp12.migadu.com ([2001:41d0:8:6d80::]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits)) by ms5.migadu.com with LMTPS id AOhCNDCSl2Jj7AAAbAwnHQ (envelope-from ) for ; Wed, 01 Jun 2022 18:22:08 +0200 Received: from aspmx1.migadu.com ([2001:41d0:8:6d80::]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits)) by mp12.migadu.com with LMTPS id KDAoNDCSl2IuRgEAauVa8A (envelope-from ) for ; Wed, 01 Jun 2022 18:22:08 +0200 Received: from lists.gnu.org (lists.gnu.org [209.51.188.17]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by aspmx1.migadu.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 7F064B00F for ; Wed, 1 Jun 2022 18:22:08 +0200 (CEST) Received: from localhost ([::1]:39040 helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1nwR6l-0007u0-5S for larch@yhetil.org; Wed, 01 Jun 2022 12:22:07 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:57144) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1nwR6W-0007rg-8M for guix-devel@gnu.org; Wed, 01 Jun 2022 12:21:52 -0400 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e]:38464) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1nwR6V-0005yh-Up; Wed, 01 Jun 2022 12:21:51 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnu.org; s=fencepost-gnu-org; h=MIME-Version:In-Reply-To:Date:References:Subject:To: From; bh=X/iVvGTc1/2a2R2OOPoF5GiT3QFaBuIcuqRJfRGfN3A=; b=Ld7k9Tdi1q1cG0htfqpd ZCzK8HMDEYXccUCQtOQ1XRvb1PUiBV/F4eFtjmOEyp9Rq5zwmSAp2yBRyjs9YA4aVaK4es3cnmCAO yH+AMf05LiHofnEKDp6c0kYfYKfKdNRAPoId4JeeUEzIH/cT0OeKSOacrE1pKbKOkPBmt7AknYHsl f+IvgI5RXjFmGL7urVNwJhSHmZvShp7E8VhAyLUKMwG8yNUoOv/jFB2w404qfunI6ZRIrfHORMdPD 35zJQYvWOLPyIi9NqAN1ZryqSL36IyE3Z0JSMvIoTJ41xapQwnXNviScVnsu49408Rwa8LbFmzvaY XRAVvbDO6tIZtw==; Received: from 91-160-117-201.subs.proxad.net ([91.160.117.201]:49779 helo=ribbon) by fencepost.gnu.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1nwR6V-00010d-7r; Wed, 01 Jun 2022 12:21:51 -0400 From: =?utf-8?Q?Ludovic_Court=C3=A8s?= To: zimoun Cc: Maxim Cournoyer , guix-devel Subject: Re: Merging the purge-python2-packages branch References: <87mtezrw2v.fsf@gmail.com> <87tu97aw0s.fsf@gmail.com> <87ilpnrq7a.fsf@gmail.com> <87o7zfartq.fsf@gmail.com> <87mtexr060.fsf@gmail.com> <86k0a1judp.fsf@gmail.com> X-URL: http://www.fdn.fr/~lcourtes/ X-Revolutionary-Date: Tridi 13 Prairial an 230 de la =?utf-8?Q?R=C3=A9volu?= =?utf-8?Q?tion=2C?= jour du Pois X-PGP-Key-ID: 0x090B11993D9AEBB5 X-PGP-Key: http://www.fdn.fr/~lcourtes/ludovic.asc X-PGP-Fingerprint: 3CE4 6455 8A84 FDC6 9DB4 0CFB 090B 1199 3D9A EBB5 X-OS: x86_64-pc-linux-gnu Date: Wed, 01 Jun 2022 18:21:48 +0200 In-Reply-To: <86k0a1judp.fsf@gmail.com> (zimoun's message of "Tue, 31 May 2022 22:54:10 +0200") Message-ID: <87y1yguzfn.fsf@gnu.org> User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/28.1 (gnu/linux) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-BeenThere: guix-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: "Development of GNU Guix and the GNU System distribution." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: guix-devel-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org Sender: "Guix-devel" X-Migadu-Flow: FLOW_IN X-Migadu-To: larch@yhetil.org X-Migadu-Country: US ARC-Message-Signature: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=yhetil.org; s=key1; t=1654100528; h=from:from:sender:sender:reply-to:subject:subject:date:date: message-id:message-id:to:to:cc:cc:mime-version:mime-version: content-type:content-type: content-transfer-encoding:content-transfer-encoding: in-reply-to:in-reply-to:references:references:list-id:list-help: list-unsubscribe:list-subscribe:list-post:dkim-signature; bh=X/iVvGTc1/2a2R2OOPoF5GiT3QFaBuIcuqRJfRGfN3A=; b=HtE/QIRo5DIpAqlbqhY9FMRKKtt3M3SxU05pA5pTcczZOn0uqcf+DfevG76hCzo3gxihSc rc2LTgi94HNBxGdq4IBAVvAlCg1bjyHDyV0hlYf4HGqojm6CmrxdsB7V7D1erlfTk+C5OD TQ0I3yiqJGj419tkLjk0S6rKb/ja1c5TtAD5p+zvLBF98YrBO0S1SSEn1tLY0zU7j7s+vU Z1aQxCMDvL6irTsK+CF8K4tFsY1OKuIfCHnGOqOmKcyHIosWUVFs2mjrZJHjQUOhEto2Hb vOH3zP/AthZvuuaoc6/5VIotuwYLd56R6AEBvuM1eGaP0TtYypjlqzDIFgbPfw== ARC-Seal: i=1; s=key1; d=yhetil.org; t=1654100528; a=rsa-sha256; cv=none; b=SCSViCrHuKVF/jZGIfX4LAQKnfqGBEZB5PzqgsZZtw8Ri8+CzjgT5JgOQTI5ltRSsJc9aT q256CLGrxr9L6h9ZDoMCq7OVQ7nI1cWWhCLEq6l41qs1GzVsRbL8pFbQYyF+uZnZ2p1+mY 19/r9l84LXOtCH8OeBFSaSZBFljLyQCCR3eR43ehLBp3rPkxCprPCYcrZ0alPvHze5HkZe rBsGVgVPv/SWAWcef7yFLPWkmNNSbwPfEe2Jqxso4k2cPDiZkS67kzvOazpl+6j8GAKE8q aRg5g5Txzvb+ilEhgbWtqeaTq6QUWUw9wUscMh1t/uvXfTRnpnFZhDbOCCRBZA== ARC-Authentication-Results: i=1; aspmx1.migadu.com; dkim=pass header.d=gnu.org header.s=fencepost-gnu-org header.b=Ld7k9Tdi; dmarc=pass (policy=none) header.from=gnu.org; spf=pass (aspmx1.migadu.com: domain of "guix-devel-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org" designates 209.51.188.17 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom="guix-devel-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org" X-Migadu-Spam-Score: -9.23 Authentication-Results: aspmx1.migadu.com; dkim=pass header.d=gnu.org header.s=fencepost-gnu-org header.b=Ld7k9Tdi; dmarc=pass (policy=none) header.from=gnu.org; spf=pass (aspmx1.migadu.com: domain of "guix-devel-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org" designates 209.51.188.17 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom="guix-devel-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org" X-Migadu-Queue-Id: 7F064B00F X-Spam-Score: -9.23 X-Migadu-Scanner: scn0.migadu.com X-TUID: jcQ9+OA/ezQ8 Hi, zimoun skribis: > On Tue, 31 May 2022 at 15:07, Maxim Cournoyer = wrote: > >>> Well, as a hobbyist, I am fine with such purge. As a scientific >>> practitioner using Guix at work, it is more annoying=E2=80=A6 >> >> Agreed. My understanding is that scientists making use of Guix already >> use a variety of Guix channels, so I'd assume the now missing bits can >> be fitted in Guix-Past or a suitable place without causing too much of a >> change to their workflow. > > This assumption about scientists is not rooted, IMHO. What I can say is > that, in my lab, some people are still using python2- variants as =E2=80= =99bamm=E2=80=99 > for example. They are not packager and they have other fishes to fry; > they use Guix to have the things done, they are not hobbyists who like > tweaking their computational environment. :-) I=E2=80=99m sure you=E2=80=99re right. The question boils down to: how can we maintain a general-purpose package collection? It=E2=80=99s great that you=E2=80=99re voicing the concerns of the scientif= ic community. At the end of the day though, someone has to maintain all this code. We=E2=80=99re removing packages from Guix proper, letting interested users either pin their software environment or maintain those packages in a channel of their own. In the latter case, the maintenance burden is transferred. The transition can be difficult; surely, some user out there will discover all of a sudden that their favorite package disappeared. As engineers who support scientific users, you and I (and others) can help smooth that by pasting package definitions that we know are still used into Guix-Past or some other channels. In the end, it can have a good side effect: getting scientists aware of, and ideally involved in, the maintenance of their own infrastructure. Maybe you have an argument to recruit an new engineer on your team? :-) Ludo=E2=80=99.