From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from mp12.migadu.com ([2001:41d0:2:bcc0::]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits)) by ms9.migadu.com with LMTPS id iJBRMdSnNWS1PQEASxT56A (envelope-from ) for ; Tue, 11 Apr 2023 20:32:52 +0200 Received: from aspmx1.migadu.com ([2001:41d0:2:bcc0::]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits)) by mp12.migadu.com with LMTPS id sJVWMdSnNWTVqwAAauVa8A (envelope-from ) for ; Tue, 11 Apr 2023 20:32:52 +0200 Received: from lists.gnu.org (lists.gnu.org [209.51.188.17]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by aspmx1.migadu.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 565C63F5D2 for ; Tue, 11 Apr 2023 20:32:52 +0200 (CEST) Received: from localhost ([::1] helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1pmIn5-0006F1-Vc; Tue, 11 Apr 2023 14:32:28 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1pmImy-0006Dy-Md for guix-devel@gnu.org; Tue, 11 Apr 2023 14:32:21 -0400 Received: from mail-qt1-x82c.google.com ([2607:f8b0:4864:20::82c]) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_128_GCM_SHA256:128) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1pmImw-0007JP-BF; Tue, 11 Apr 2023 14:32:19 -0400 Received: by mail-qt1-x82c.google.com with SMTP id a23so5873140qtj.8; Tue, 11 Apr 2023 11:32:16 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20210112; t=1681237936; x=1683829936; h=content-transfer-encoding:mime-version:user-agent:message-id :in-reply-to:date:references:subject:cc:to:from:from:to:cc:subject :date:message-id:reply-to; bh=Ugp4V4hBDC5sPCz7J46gSLYjf6PqtpOqujtBo2fU7oQ=; b=YWkctadt1CDBArydRVw4LcXtGw5olTU9xfutRF9cCFI0OiEtKfWzVq9Ts4r7tP7BJd ItlhiQvPvIvW/bdyEzLN/aYdOAVAk4gHSTDQ0Drs5OyNuDQp2fbxKpzrW4zEIHuAGWWf LGGq9GPBE7t60MLZpFh/rv7aAzzHCGGY3n1qIjBfUY6fFGhDczZWpc7Lgk9GtxXUwqIS GVFwKZ70WuqG6m5qCV992ereOEL0A3eoFEvLRlvppFBwX/h4aG/U3G1TismLhP8q459A B7Hujvh6dNwH6lMryGiiqzdMidf921s3S+HoVzwUjZJHFkqPXspmANfWTIoBa97/qDEs qqDA== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20210112; t=1681237936; x=1683829936; h=content-transfer-encoding:mime-version:user-agent:message-id :in-reply-to:date:references:subject:cc:to:from:x-gm-message-state :from:to:cc:subject:date:message-id:reply-to; bh=Ugp4V4hBDC5sPCz7J46gSLYjf6PqtpOqujtBo2fU7oQ=; b=B9GJC2ntQA7aZd/oYnKGVcff67ONCubcs/a74XMeKANsrLbTT2P7Re2TGBma5bTDfS haUW8+SdZd3yB/+irtN5EcwbHHecv1TxYWkViZjTjF4Uja2uM9JpDLZZGrsWMrKfhPqo 8vjUWlj/dLkLcd0McmY4D+DK9s/M/oGIWDwQQ9n+fRhQlZDJ3bgy5QtjD02NqYJTiP0S wl6mtUoIrBp3VURFZj20hAkb/Iek6b/aHQ/IA2D9aoZLlAl08GcQ/H/mY068sk53EKxf m5O4Z9ewDkdesDRLzDNiQd7IK5cxWUV+zDdHruXymXlmbmORaHM8PDqtH61O3Rfn/xFi 0rGw== X-Gm-Message-State: AAQBX9dRwJVeXt0Jxw82eji/YpZ01wKLzpPwKRdfs68DpbZHak+W9BT2 7Mg6LOCKqt/rdSjs2axQ9M4= X-Google-Smtp-Source: AKy350Yur8GGriqrteRYpueOxxDSACTafEk0TcoxflXYaVi/b0Ujlcu1WF+cDqGzCDnMrhUqeUNnzg== X-Received: by 2002:a05:622a:1d1:b0:3bf:d193:1b0 with SMTP id t17-20020a05622a01d100b003bfd19301b0mr24925176qtw.48.1681237936382; Tue, 11 Apr 2023 11:32:16 -0700 (PDT) Received: from hurd (dsl-152-224.b2b2c.ca. [66.158.152.224]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id l4-20020a37f904000000b007422eee8058sm4118256qkj.125.2023.04.11.11.32.15 (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 bits=256/256); Tue, 11 Apr 2023 11:32:15 -0700 (PDT) From: Maxim Cournoyer To: Simon Tournier Cc: Ludovic =?utf-8?Q?Court=C3=A8s?= , Andreas Enge , guix-devel@gnu.org, Pjotr Prins Subject: Re: Debugging Guix beyond pk (was Re: Notes from the Guix Days) References: <87pm9bmix7.fsf@gmail.com> <87ilf2ltmh.fsf@gmail.com> <87r0tq0y9b.fsf_-_@gnu.org> <87fsa376ww.fsf@gmail.com> <871qkqjyzl.fsf@gmail.com> Date: Tue, 11 Apr 2023 14:32:14 -0400 In-Reply-To: <871qkqjyzl.fsf@gmail.com> (Simon Tournier's message of "Tue, 11 Apr 2023 16:05:18 +0200") Message-ID: <87y1myl175.fsf@gmail.com> User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/28.2 (gnu/linux) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Received-SPF: pass client-ip=2607:f8b0:4864:20::82c; envelope-from=maxim.cournoyer@gmail.com; helo=mail-qt1-x82c.google.com X-Spam_score_int: -20 X-Spam_score: -2.1 X-Spam_bar: -- X-Spam_report: (-2.1 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001 autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-BeenThere: guix-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: "Development of GNU Guix and the GNU System distribution." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: guix-devel-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org Sender: guix-devel-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org X-Migadu-Country: US X-Migadu-Flow: FLOW_IN ARC-Seal: i=1; s=key1; d=yhetil.org; t=1681237972; a=rsa-sha256; cv=none; b=GuXRFW/T61butf/jJTRO1K5rBnbEogAOjgoYW15UCghDA1lhyn4kBDAUmSSljB1X9uquKx bGjnYMgj4RtccFCAwbmh6k6MKnb0A9FQ9dZoLh7Sah9bLfrFKmwGVGTCFAgQ0xfu2a//AG zNt+FHAjyghVAYoRUlAQveFWS7Moa6y6TTNQC/6VI9md7CrzeyEeb9S7n9TrlTUXPhpLzB TGHA+SOSapjupl4RSkCa7VVC4eEXQgrOtBNwZ9pXpozoOhuf8UDfudhro+G36ENr9gCo7z bIU5dGpryNJsZzHiScktG8/1fx6W32o4TMF+qSWTfym78XBkXAcqPnAF2sOWDw== ARC-Authentication-Results: i=1; aspmx1.migadu.com; dkim=pass header.d=gmail.com header.s=20210112 header.b=YWkctadt; dmarc=pass (policy=none) header.from=gmail.com; spf=pass (aspmx1.migadu.com: domain of "guix-devel-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org" designates 209.51.188.17 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom="guix-devel-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org" ARC-Message-Signature: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=yhetil.org; s=key1; t=1681237972; h=from:from:sender:sender:reply-to:subject:subject:date:date: message-id:message-id:to:to:cc:cc:mime-version:mime-version: content-type:content-type: content-transfer-encoding:content-transfer-encoding: in-reply-to:in-reply-to:references:references:list-id:list-help: list-unsubscribe:list-subscribe:list-post:dkim-signature; bh=Ugp4V4hBDC5sPCz7J46gSLYjf6PqtpOqujtBo2fU7oQ=; b=qe/i7iifmksEcaGw2Bqsts8+DaG0qoTWo+VGQCB0BQJ+PJoogOWZQd0zvOTunGq0MP0m5b jJnM2Cm8qFGgD6/ZvdRxpfAZfb6jxyERRpZQ7ZA+cwBa7sWZGZPUQ92AEZ8ZF6Dazb/X31 P6YKNC/I4ykpfArMdgCsQ0/elrmwD1PUB+omTBW7YA0ShSXb6GTRhs6Ne2a7JAxC8vI9Qf Jtj/lFW/ls0iVhtb05E8yl1FdgQLN4rzo+1r1q9frnGY0Px/qeQEjx8A4GnlUWJYaD90rZ k9VnnzFVtLxiW178VKaihUq0rIqhGMmv7cCv4rNnW6vWCHEBlyjTv0HhVCf5jw== Authentication-Results: aspmx1.migadu.com; dkim=pass header.d=gmail.com header.s=20210112 header.b=YWkctadt; dmarc=pass (policy=none) header.from=gmail.com; spf=pass (aspmx1.migadu.com: domain of "guix-devel-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org" designates 209.51.188.17 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom="guix-devel-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org" X-Migadu-Scanner: scn0.migadu.com X-Migadu-Spam-Score: -8.25 X-Spam-Score: -8.25 X-Migadu-Queue-Id: 565C63F5D2 X-TUID: nfXdqWuTgOaq Hi Simon, Simon Tournier writes: > Hi Maxim, > > On ven., 17 mars 2023 at 11:07, Maxim Cournoyer wrote: > >>> https://gitlab.com/pjotrp/guix-days-fosdem-2023/-/tree/main/ >> >> This is nice, I just peeked at "Debugging Guix beyond pk". I'll >> bookmark and read more of it, thank you! > > I was very interested by this session, especially after the recent > thread [1] about Guile debugger. In that thread [1], Ludo wrote, > quoting: > > Also, I think I mentioned before that I almost never use breakpoi= nts on > Guile code=E2=80=94not because of some deficiency of the debugger= , not (just) > because I=E2=80=99m silly or inexperienced, but because it=E2=80= =99s rarely the right > tool for the job. > > and that=E2=80=99s the conclusion I came back to home: the good ol=E2=80= =99 =E2=80=99pk=E2=80=99 is just > the right tool for the job =E2=80=93 considering the current state of Gui= le > debugger as discussed in this thread [1]. I agree it's the "right" as in "best" tool for the job given the current situation that makes stepping Guile code difficult/impossible to follow or stop where one wants. I still think a more user-friendly/capable debugger would be nice, but haven't had the opportunity to take actions yet. The obvious low hanging fruit would be to start with documenting 'pk' in the Guile user manual :-). > That=E2=80=99s said, the notes do not mention =E2=80=99guix-derivation-mo= de=E2=80=99 from the > package emacs-guix. Well, last do not miss =E2=80=99guix-scheme-mode=E2= =80=99 which > eases the reading of Scheme =E2=80=9Cbuilder=E2=80=9D code =E2=80=93 it i= s not always > autoloaded. > > 1: https://yhetil.org/guix/87fse69czr.fsf@gnu.org I know these, they are very useful. Not too discoverable too, I reckon! Thanks for pointing them out. --=20 Thanks, Maxim