Re: 01/01: hydra: Increase image sizes for USB image and Flash image.

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* Re: 01/01: hydra: Increase image sizes for USB image and Flash image.
       [not found] ` <20181208235342.94B112113E@vcs0.savannah.gnu.org>
@ 2018-12-09 13:30   ` Ludovic Courtès
  2018-12-09 16:16     ` Ricardo Wurmus
  0 siblings, 1 reply; 8+ messages in thread
From: Ludovic Courtès @ 2018-12-09 13:30 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: guix-devel, Danny Milosavljevic

guix-commits@gnu.org skribis:

> commit 07c791c1104db3530eb12c918043fc3b30c093be
> Author: Danny Milosavljevic <dannym@scratchpost.org>
> Date:   Sun Dec 9 00:49:54 2018 +0100
>
>     hydra: Increase image sizes for USB image and Flash image.
>     
>     * build-aux/hydra/gnu-system.scm (qemu-jobs) <usb-image>: Increase from
>     1024 MiB to 1500 MiB.
>     <flash-image>: Increase from 1024 MiB to 1500 MiB.

As discussed earlier on the list, it would be nice™ to see why these
images are so big and what can be done about it.  Really, 1 GiB is
already a lot for such a small image.

In commit 040ae1881952c90dae9478e5cfff6aad0ce950da, I ended up
increasing the image size for the tests, which is not great IMO.  I
looked at ‘guix size’ and couldn’t find any obvious way to improve
things.

One problem with the installation OS is that it’s pulling ALSA and all
sorts of sound-related libraries (libsamplerate, etc.), which clearly is
unnecessary in the installation image.  That comes from the alsa-utils
udev rules.  We could remove those udev rules, but since they’re in
%base-services, I chose not to do that to avoid breaking everyone’s
config.

Food for thought!

Ludo’.

^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 8+ messages in thread

* Re: 01/01: hydra: Increase image sizes for USB image and Flash image.
  2018-12-09 13:30   ` 01/01: hydra: Increase image sizes for USB image and Flash image Ludovic Courtès
@ 2018-12-09 16:16     ` Ricardo Wurmus
  2018-12-09 18:50       ` Leo Famulari
  2018-12-12  8:17       ` Giovanni Biscuolo
  0 siblings, 2 replies; 8+ messages in thread
From: Ricardo Wurmus @ 2018-12-09 16:16 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: Ludovic Courtès; +Cc: guix-devel


Ludovic Courtès <ludo@gnu.org> writes:

> One problem with the installation OS is that it’s pulling ALSA and all
> sorts of sound-related libraries (libsamplerate, etc.), which clearly is
> unnecessary in the installation image.  That comes from the alsa-utils
> udev rules.  We could remove those udev rules, but since they’re in
> %base-services, I chose not to do that to avoid breaking everyone’s
> config.

I’m in favour of moving them elsewhere, such as %desktop-services.

-- 
Ricardo

^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 8+ messages in thread

* Re: 01/01: hydra: Increase image sizes for USB image and Flash image.
  2018-12-09 16:16     ` Ricardo Wurmus
@ 2018-12-09 18:50       ` Leo Famulari
  2018-12-12  8:17       ` Giovanni Biscuolo
  1 sibling, 0 replies; 8+ messages in thread
From: Leo Famulari @ 2018-12-09 18:50 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: Ricardo Wurmus; +Cc: guix-devel

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On Sun, Dec 09, 2018 at 05:16:58PM +0100, Ricardo Wurmus wrote:
> 
> Ludovic Courtès <ludo@gnu.org> writes:
> 
> > One problem with the installation OS is that it’s pulling ALSA and all
> > sorts of sound-related libraries (libsamplerate, etc.), which clearly is
> > unnecessary in the installation image.  That comes from the alsa-utils
> > udev rules.  We could remove those udev rules, but since they’re in
> > %base-services, I chose not to do that to avoid breaking everyone’s
> > config.
> 
> I’m in favour of moving them elsewhere, such as %desktop-services.

Or we could just remove the sound services from the installation image.

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^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 8+ messages in thread

* Re: 01/01: hydra: Increase image sizes for USB image and Flash image.
  2018-12-09 16:16     ` Ricardo Wurmus
  2018-12-09 18:50       ` Leo Famulari
@ 2018-12-12  8:17       ` Giovanni Biscuolo
  2018-12-13 20:32         ` Leo Famulari
  1 sibling, 1 reply; 8+ messages in thread
From: Giovanni Biscuolo @ 2018-12-12  8:17 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: Ricardo Wurmus, Ludovic Courtès; +Cc: guix-devel

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Ricardo Wurmus <rekado@elephly.net> writes:

> Ludovic Courtès <ludo@gnu.org> writes:
>
>> One problem with the installation OS is that it’s pulling ALSA and all
>> sorts of sound-related libraries (libsamplerate, etc.), which clearly is
>> unnecessary in the installation image.  That comes from the alsa-utils
>> udev rules.  We could remove those udev rules, but since they’re in
>> %base-services, I chose not to do that to avoid breaking everyone’s
>> config.

for sure users should be warned of this important change, anyway I doubt
any user using sound does not use %desktop-services (possibly customized)

> I’m in favour of moving them elsewhere, such as %desktop-services.

yes please: sound related services are not-so-base, we do not need them
on installation/web/mail/DNS et. al servers (and containers) and it does
not makes much sense to remove them an all that class of
hosts/containers

it makes sense - semantically speaking - to move sound to
%desktop-services since we only need sound on desktops

thanks!
Gio

-- 
Giovanni Biscuolo

Xelera IT Infrastructures

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^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 8+ messages in thread

* Re: 01/01: hydra: Increase image sizes for USB image and Flash image.
  2018-12-12  8:17       ` Giovanni Biscuolo
@ 2018-12-13 20:32         ` Leo Famulari
  2018-12-14  9:08           ` Ludovic Courtès
  0 siblings, 1 reply; 8+ messages in thread
From: Leo Famulari @ 2018-12-13 20:32 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: Giovanni Biscuolo; +Cc: guix-devel

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On Wed, Dec 12, 2018 at 09:17:23AM +0100, Giovanni Biscuolo wrote:
> > I’m in favour of moving them elsewhere, such as %desktop-services.
>
> yes please: sound related services are not-so-base, we do not need them
> on installation/web/mail/DNS et. al servers (and containers) and it does
> not makes much sense to remove them an all that class of
> hosts/containers
> 
> it makes sense - semantically speaking - to move sound to
> %desktop-services since we only need sound on desktops
 
I would prefer if sound services were removed from the installation
system rather than from the %base-services. I am using systems based on
%base-services for music playback and other audio work. They are not
desktop systems — there is no graphical interface to these machines.

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^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 8+ messages in thread

* Re: 01/01: hydra: Increase image sizes for USB image and Flash image.
  2018-12-13 20:32         ` Leo Famulari
@ 2018-12-14  9:08           ` Ludovic Courtès
  2018-12-15 10:19             ` Maxim Cournoyer
  0 siblings, 1 reply; 8+ messages in thread
From: Ludovic Courtès @ 2018-12-14  9:08 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: Leo Famulari; +Cc: guix-devel

Hi,

Leo Famulari <leo@famulari.name> skribis:

> On Wed, Dec 12, 2018 at 09:17:23AM +0100, Giovanni Biscuolo wrote:
>> > I’m in favour of moving them elsewhere, such as %desktop-services.
>>
>> yes please: sound related services are not-so-base, we do not need them
>> on installation/web/mail/DNS et. al servers (and containers) and it does
>> not makes much sense to remove them an all that class of
>> hosts/containers
>> 
>> it makes sense - semantically speaking - to move sound to
>> %desktop-services since we only need sound on desktops
>  
> I would prefer if sound services were removed from the installation
> system rather than from the %base-services. I am using systems based on
> %base-services for music playback and other audio work. They are not
> desktop systems — there is no graphical interface to these machines.

Yeah I do that as well.

On closer inspection my initial diagnostic was not accurate: the ALSA
udev rules are not in the installation system itself:

--8<---------------cut here---------------start------------->8---
scheme@(gnu system install)> (define s (operating-system-services installation-os))
scheme@(gnu system install)> (fold-services s #:target-type udev-service-type)
$3 = #<<service> type: #<service-type udev 2cb00f0> value: #<<udev-configuration> udev: #<package eudev@3.2.5 gnu/packages/linux.scm:2039 3cd2e40> rules: (#<package lvm2@2.02.177 gnu/packages/linux.scm:2101 3cd2cc0> #<package crda@3.18 gnu/packages/linux.scm:2237 3cd2a80>)>>
--8<---------------cut here---------------end--------------->8---

Instead, the ALSA rules come from the bare-bones OS, which we
purposefully add as a GC root of the installation OS (see commit
4e854b1814a9216ae7cc90aef4d82fd989a519c3).

So I suppose there’s not much we can do in this area.

The good news is that there are other optimization opportunities.  :-)

--8<---------------cut here---------------start------------->8---
$ guix size $(guix system build gnu/system/install.scm) | head -10
store item                                                       total    self
/gnu/store/0zajbn9q39yva4l0zzrcshlll8qikzba-linux-libre-4.19.6     236.5   236.5  21.2%
/gnu/store/mdw00a2sq0qqyzqygmp9035g8r2rlslj-guix-0.15.0-8.71a78ba   345.7   182.3  16.3%
/gnu/store/1lcniyxkxkh8g73zvh2gpbccvl6ggna7-locale-2.28             91.8    91.8   8.2%
/gnu/store/dna8kpb00kq176rz8x69yy4j33my2q55-perl-5.28.0            146.3    58.2   5.2%
/gnu/store/ybglr7nfs8v9kpnm8vf4drg3gafnvd15-guile-static-stripped-2.2.4    45.9    45.9   4.1%
/gnu/store/r658y3cgpnf99nxjxqgjiaizx20ac4k0-guile-2.2.4            121.9    44.4   4.0%
/gnu/store/9alic3caqhay3h8mx4iihpmyj6ymqpcx-guile-2.2.4            121.9    44.4   4.0%
/gnu/store/h90vnqw0nwd0hhm1l5dgxsdrigddfmq4-glibc-2.28              37.8    36.3   3.2%
/gnu/store/4sqps8dczv3g7rwbdibfz6rf5jlk7w90-gcc-5.5.0-lib           68.0    30.2   2.7%
--8<---------------cut here---------------end--------------->8---

Ludo’.

^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 8+ messages in thread

* Re: 01/01: hydra: Increase image sizes for USB image and Flash image.
  2018-12-14  9:08           ` Ludovic Courtès
@ 2018-12-15 10:19             ` Maxim Cournoyer
  2018-12-15 18:18               ` Ludovic Courtès
  0 siblings, 1 reply; 8+ messages in thread
From: Maxim Cournoyer @ 2018-12-15 10:19 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: guix-devel, Ludovic Courtès, Leo Famulari

Hello!

On December 14, 2018 9:08:50 AM UTC, "Ludovic Courtès" <ludo@gnu.org> wrote:

[...]

>The good news is that there are other optimization opportunities.  :-)
>
>--8<---------------cut here---------------start------------->8---
>$ guix size $(guix system build gnu/system/install.scm) | head -10
>store item                                                       total 
>  self
>/gnu/store/0zajbn9q39yva4l0zzrcshlll8qikzba-linux-libre-4.19.6    
>236.5   236.5  21.2%
>/gnu/store/mdw00a2sq0qqyzqygmp9035g8r2rlslj-guix-0.15.0-8.71a78ba  
>345.7   182.3  16.3%
>/gnu/store/1lcniyxkxkh8g73zvh2gpbccvl6ggna7-locale-2.28            
>91.8    91.8   8.2%
>/gnu/store/dna8kpb00kq176rz8x69yy4j33my2q55-perl-5.28.0           
>146.3    58.2   5.2%
>/gnu/store/ybglr7nfs8v9kpnm8vf4drg3gafnvd15-guile-static-stripped-2.2.4
>   45.9    45.9   4.1%
>/gnu/store/r658y3cgpnf99nxjxqgjiaizx20ac4k0-guile-2.2.4           
>121.9    44.4   4.0%
>/gnu/store/9alic3caqhay3h8mx4iihpmyj6ymqpcx-guile-2.2.4           
>121.9    44.4   4.0%
>/gnu/store/h90vnqw0nwd0hhm1l5dgxsdrigddfmq4-glibc-2.28             
>37.8    36.3   3.2%
>/gnu/store/4sqps8dczv3g7rwbdibfz6rf5jlk7w90-gcc-5.5.0-lib          
>68.0    30.2   2.7%
>--8<---------------cut here---------------end--------------->8

Why does Guile 2.2.4 appear twice but with a different hash?

Maxim 

^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 8+ messages in thread

* Re: 01/01: hydra: Increase image sizes for USB image and Flash image.
  2018-12-15 10:19             ` Maxim Cournoyer
@ 2018-12-15 18:18               ` Ludovic Courtès
  0 siblings, 0 replies; 8+ messages in thread
From: Ludovic Courtès @ 2018-12-15 18:18 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: Maxim Cournoyer; +Cc: guix-devel

Hi,

Maxim Cournoyer <maxim.cournoyer@gmail.com> skribis:

> On December 14, 2018 9:08:50 AM UTC, "Ludovic Courtès" <ludo@gnu.org> wrote:
>
> [...]
>
>>The good news is that there are other optimization opportunities.  :-)
>>
>>--8<---------------cut here---------------start------------->8---
>>$ guix size $(guix system build gnu/system/install.scm) | head -10
>>store item                                                       total 
>>  self
>>/gnu/store/0zajbn9q39yva4l0zzrcshlll8qikzba-linux-libre-4.19.6    
>>236.5   236.5  21.2%
>>/gnu/store/mdw00a2sq0qqyzqygmp9035g8r2rlslj-guix-0.15.0-8.71a78ba  
>>345.7   182.3  16.3%
>>/gnu/store/1lcniyxkxkh8g73zvh2gpbccvl6ggna7-locale-2.28            
>>91.8    91.8   8.2%
>>/gnu/store/dna8kpb00kq176rz8x69yy4j33my2q55-perl-5.28.0           
>>146.3    58.2   5.2%
>>/gnu/store/ybglr7nfs8v9kpnm8vf4drg3gafnvd15-guile-static-stripped-2.2.4
>>   45.9    45.9   4.1%
>>/gnu/store/r658y3cgpnf99nxjxqgjiaizx20ac4k0-guile-2.2.4           
>>121.9    44.4   4.0%
>>/gnu/store/9alic3caqhay3h8mx4iihpmyj6ymqpcx-guile-2.2.4           
>>121.9    44.4   4.0%
>>/gnu/store/h90vnqw0nwd0hhm1l5dgxsdrigddfmq4-glibc-2.28             
>>37.8    36.3   3.2%
>>/gnu/store/4sqps8dczv3g7rwbdibfz6rf5jlk7w90-gcc-5.5.0-lib          
>>68.0    30.2   2.7%
>>--8<---------------cut here---------------end--------------->8
>
> Why does Guile 2.2.4 appear twice but with a different hash?

That’s a good question!  It’s the kind of thing that we need to
investigate…

Ludo’.

^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 8+ messages in thread

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     [not found] ` <20181208235342.94B112113E@vcs0.savannah.gnu.org>
2018-12-09 13:30   ` 01/01: hydra: Increase image sizes for USB image and Flash image Ludovic Courtès
2018-12-09 16:16     ` Ricardo Wurmus
2018-12-09 18:50       ` Leo Famulari
2018-12-12  8:17       ` Giovanni Biscuolo
2018-12-13 20:32         ` Leo Famulari
2018-12-14  9:08           ` Ludovic Courtès
2018-12-15 10:19             ` Maxim Cournoyer
2018-12-15 18:18               ` Ludovic Courtès

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