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[72.10.128.55]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id y15sm12374611qko.74.2021.12.26.21.17.42 (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 bits=256/256); Sun, 26 Dec 2021 21:17:42 -0800 (PST) From: Maxim Cournoyer To: Ludovic =?utf-8?Q?Court=C3=A8s?= Subject: Re: Formalizing teams References: <87ee641w3e.fsf@inria.fr> Date: Mon, 27 Dec 2021 00:17:41 -0500 In-Reply-To: <87ee641w3e.fsf@inria.fr> ("Ludovic =?utf-8?Q?Court=C3=A8s=22?= =?utf-8?Q?'s?= message of "Wed, 22 Dec 2021 16:46:13 +0100") Message-ID: <87mtkmwrre.fsf@gmail.com> User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/27.2 (gnu/linux) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Host-Lookup-Failed: Reverse DNS lookup failed for 2607:f8b0:4864:20::f2b (failed) Received-SPF: pass client-ip=2607:f8b0:4864:20::f2b; envelope-from=maxim.cournoyer@gmail.com; helo=mail-qv1-xf2b.google.com X-Spam_score_int: -12 X-Spam_score: -1.3 X-Spam_bar: - X-Spam_report: (-1.3 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, RDNS_NONE=0.793, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001 autolearn=no autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-BeenThere: guix-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: "Development of GNU Guix and the GNU System distribution." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Cc: Guix Devel Errors-To: guix-devel-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org Sender: "Guix-devel" X-Migadu-Flow: FLOW_IN X-Migadu-Country: US ARC-Message-Signature: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=yhetil.org; s=key1; t=1640582283; h=from:from:sender:sender:reply-to:subject:subject:date:date: message-id:message-id:to:to:cc:cc:mime-version:mime-version: content-type:content-type: content-transfer-encoding:content-transfer-encoding: in-reply-to:in-reply-to:references:references:list-id:list-help: list-unsubscribe:list-subscribe:list-post:dkim-signature; bh=hSoylJxQ0vhogD9CZoGgVsO67oYL/47CnH+1ZY8CDOM=; b=BFphYprhB9kNKvSjqqnOH1Y4nqHyic8gmtl0wqqKoFL34iFhrc79AkeKalDpTD4zcVtajU X3q+k5slPLtPq4XrGrdCQdb2B4MaUfNRZqD1f4kOwJBzii60bHwagNER5wFUYQENDRXECA TxC8yq/8HwxEHUVauixupF16BJu5q7SmhU6Mf2VoB7hTKdEBCDGj/nDdL2NEdRtMJLKUaL dVe/6Wch1Q2+BzaQDTvPwuog8643QPN4ppdk0U21pojtJlOpGLxMZ64eRB1AetONx2m4Q5 74EYXs7iivgqiedAW5fN14eHHSC9aDjCtwUV8FEnLMHC15yzW439tksAxU1yKw== ARC-Seal: i=1; s=key1; d=yhetil.org; t=1640582283; a=rsa-sha256; cv=none; b=AACQ0KuuzQP9T/h4imOicvhDSEAsaVe9FKvwOv9q1dyqNrdCCKvYvDdhgNFU3uxuOTUTsr hxVSN9Ps6GcZo6hwYhFvqQGau0BUCzpsxCxFQkxeR9ULdYK4zFHrNthoYgG3S69ejGCq6O eGCA58TN6+B3MvHTAoG1sXrnFV4pvD0FWTbzrYl0jvQxHw5u0fZ2OquyreoIevH/8sZjG7 8IShCv7dSszYIDIyaFX9Xe11u3gXWNGu3VB6BlzwzdZTGVPyrU+PuTehwCRdr9flsjcFeZ PV+sltHZe7WzNQIdefsy6B3Fc28OkjPCluQZkI2MVo5ceZ15y2O7SGA8Eai66Q== ARC-Authentication-Results: i=1; aspmx1.migadu.com; dkim=pass header.d=gmail.com header.s=20210112 header.b=LD6gwLIs; dmarc=pass (policy=none) header.from=gmail.com; spf=pass (aspmx1.migadu.com: domain of "guix-devel-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org" designates 209.51.188.17 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom="guix-devel-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org" X-Migadu-Spam-Score: -7.77 Authentication-Results: aspmx1.migadu.com; dkim=pass header.d=gmail.com header.s=20210112 header.b=LD6gwLIs; dmarc=pass (policy=none) header.from=gmail.com; spf=pass (aspmx1.migadu.com: domain of "guix-devel-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org" designates 209.51.188.17 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom="guix-devel-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org" X-Migadu-Queue-Id: D71DA14EED X-Spam-Score: -7.77 X-Migadu-Scanner: scn0.migadu.com X-TUID: vnaPs6ZGsxom Hi Ludovic, Ludovic Court=C3=A8s writes: > Hello Guix! > > I=E2=80=99ve been looking at our guix-patches backlog, at the great > contributions we get but that stick there for too long, certainly > discouraging people, and also at non-code initiatives (meetups, Guix > Days, Outreachy, documentation, etc.) that we as a project could often > support and encourage better, wondering how we could improve. I think we're not doing too badly considering the tooling we have at our disposal, but yes, there's definitely room for improvement! [...] > One idea that I like is to bring structure to the group, or rather to > make structure visible, so that newcomers know who they can talk to to > get started on a topic, know who to ping for reviews, and so that each > one of us can see where they fit. Rust has well-defined teams: I've grown to like our apparent lack of structure; we interact globally on any topic of interest and the discussions all happen in a shared space, which makes it easy to stay informed with everything that's going on (do we really need more mailing lists to follow? I don't think so -- our current volume doesn't warrant it). > Guix is nowhere near the size of the Rust community (yet!), but I can > already picture teams and members: > > co-maintainers (=E2=80=9Ccore team=E2=80=9D) > community > infrastructure > internationalization > security response > release > Rust packaging > R packaging > Java packaging We'd have to include every language/system of importance to that list (Python, Ruby, Emacs, LaTeX, Perl, etc.), no? > In Rust, teams are responsible for overseeing discussions and changes in > their area, but also ultimately for making decisions. I think that=E2=80= =99s > pretty much the case with the informal teams that exist today in Guix, > but that responsibility could be made more explicit here. They > distinguish teams from =E2=80=9Cworking groups=E2=80=9D, where working gr= oups work on > actually implementing what the team decided. > > How about starting with a web page listing these teams, their work, > their members, and ways to contact them? Teams would be the primary > contact point and for things that fall into their area and would be > responsible for channeling proposals and advancing issues in their area. > > What do people think? Are our problems really organizational? I think before attempting to come up with a solution, we must analyze and agree on what it is that needs improvement to help us move forward more efficiently. Thanks for initiating the conversation, Maxim