From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from mp1.migadu.com ([2001:41d0:303:e16b::]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits)) by ms13.migadu.com with LMTPS id WEDvJ6BPHWdOTQAA62LTzQ:P1 (envelope-from ) for ; Sat, 26 Oct 2024 20:22:56 +0000 Received: from aspmx1.migadu.com ([2001:41d0:303:e16b::]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits)) by mp1.migadu.com with LMTPS id WEDvJ6BPHWdOTQAA62LTzQ (envelope-from ) for ; Sat, 26 Oct 2024 22:22:56 +0200 X-Envelope-To: larch@yhetil.org Authentication-Results: aspmx1.migadu.com; dkim=pass header.d=gnu.org header.s=fencepost-gnu-org header.b=FWuVulX4; spf=pass (aspmx1.migadu.com: domain of "guix-devel-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org" designates 209.51.188.17 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom="guix-devel-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org"; dmarc=pass (policy=none) header.from=gnu.org ARC-Message-Signature: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=yhetil.org; s=key1; t=1729974176; h=from:from:sender:sender:reply-to:subject:subject:date:date: message-id:message-id:to:to:cc:cc:mime-version:mime-version: content-type:content-type: content-transfer-encoding:content-transfer-encoding: in-reply-to:in-reply-to:references:references:list-id:list-help: list-unsubscribe:list-subscribe:list-post:dkim-signature; bh=xJUERX6Lar3wWWk/tT9+KQo00L39DTm2XShGtyEMlkU=; b=uARJriQhEd7z/b9DjzsUaaOyAPNK+VqV/Sx6lioRKagb6eEYLdCKEGDpMQGtXPkKLs3lhJ IzyrfuQfhRc2KpoN/B2pvj+/gxmKVF39RQoKEcaagjsP33jZRy+GllKhnt36JpWM0tsPPS QpmyyA2DL+80q++w8hZz7/0uIvmTydLX4M77Nceul7ScgbB2XodGz7c8HSP/KTZKXSyPu0 HlVf0HKp05Lr/zJBYrdvHswuLz7gMR+751ibPwW4cjtp0q7UUwjPI6AAL5rA5YWQf2mRwA YHchGarYa4158hrjAHWBpptmm4/rUqOqINhcaS/B2AqiazqeE4bDPSWIto6cGQ== ARC-Seal: i=1; s=key1; d=yhetil.org; t=1729974176; a=rsa-sha256; cv=none; b=iAIS8xHdVDWdvAcKu4e97XgS0JgC/WgjscCCOQZZYIEtbPP+U7BXn/qOP3NPJ7NBDsy4X4 AJ8OMSFPtiOjxz/AzEQEvBHpYsTWdsfBmVfIQoRM1RPnIHFPpG5K2qKSjtyTNKkV+H4m45 AgOYyRqxQJNrl0G5tet6PYRE4ATuSePbE4HYrC71f5aOeRs7nL55mLgHc+qBRvxiEECQQe aa2WT2ilOBSQkKicfpqz2R+vDblDEJCvRUmPQHDSqzGVdN8Y11lfllgflF4htOry/8ir4o j089mkP+eUZcSgEAq4+XNBhkXH8QGYlAp/nJ19OHSQXejmZ9Nk8P2WCV9Cv7Qw== ARC-Authentication-Results: i=1; aspmx1.migadu.com; dkim=pass header.d=gnu.org header.s=fencepost-gnu-org header.b=FWuVulX4; spf=pass (aspmx1.migadu.com: domain of "guix-devel-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org" designates 209.51.188.17 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom="guix-devel-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org"; dmarc=pass (policy=none) header.from=gnu.org Received: from lists.gnu.org (lists.gnu.org [209.51.188.17]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by aspmx1.migadu.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id D9A417AA12 for ; Sat, 26 Oct 2024 22:22:55 +0200 (CEST) Received: from localhost ([::1] helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1t4nIl-00016N-RQ; Sat, 26 Oct 2024 16:22:23 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1t4nIi-000169-FG for guix-devel@gnu.org; Sat, 26 Oct 2024 16:22:21 -0400 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e]) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1t4nIg-0006YB-QV; Sat, 26 Oct 2024 16:22:19 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnu.org; s=fencepost-gnu-org; h=MIME-Version:Date:References:In-Reply-To:Subject:To: From; bh=xJUERX6Lar3wWWk/tT9+KQo00L39DTm2XShGtyEMlkU=; b=FWuVulX4rAbX+3drqHGG srbT/a8XYpcQHJzvMutzdQthzzz+FnPHpGb7P+9qMWA9YxEv4/tDjjHCalVY0Gkzdjw235Nu7hiCn Beo4vkvmDIlFCjTd7KqwtA12Oyav6xRpk8V5dJ4LB5MYl7v9UGz40iierW2rEz3a7Q46IWnx8vY+G 9i4Xr3SqeWC72KZ733XvVGh/1kbthR0CW9g+S6QPeBgBiQnUi5BzWW9n479W/1jlH/L8r6ZIx48O1 h9zECH/GVogrWLSSs6ty2zF+UcQLnIKsmKxC1occWhS5EhxFQaTYyekao4bgr0nNs7DFGEfxeUa0d aOlbVIR1AKdkVg==; From: =?utf-8?Q?Ludovic_Court=C3=A8s?= To: Ekaitz Zarraga Cc: Christine Lemmer-Webber , "Thompson, David" , guix-devel@gnu.org Subject: Re: Guix (and Guile's) promise, and how to (hopefully) get there In-Reply-To: (Ekaitz Zarraga's message of "Sat, 26 Oct 2024 16:49:13 +0200") References: <6daee7b4-a5d6-4f80-bbfa-995e65e17ae0@elenq.tech> <87r083ht4p.fsf@dustycloud.org> X-URL: http://www.fdn.fr/~lcourtes/ X-Revolutionary-Date: Quintidi 5 Brumaire an 233 de la =?utf-8?Q?R=C3=A9vo?= =?utf-8?Q?lution=2C?= jour de l'Oie X-PGP-Key-ID: 0x090B11993D9AEBB5 X-PGP-Key: http://www.fdn.fr/~lcourtes/ludovic.asc X-PGP-Fingerprint: 3CE4 6455 8A84 FDC6 9DB4 0CFB 090B 1199 3D9A EBB5 X-OS: x86_64-pc-linux-gnu Date: Sat, 26 Oct 2024 22:22:09 +0200 Message-ID: <87ldyar4we.fsf@gnu.org> User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-BeenThere: guix-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: "Development of GNU Guix and the GNU System distribution." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: guix-devel-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org Sender: guix-devel-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org X-Migadu-Flow: FLOW_IN X-Migadu-Country: US X-Migadu-Spam-Score: -4.71 X-Spam-Score: -4.71 X-Migadu-Queue-Id: D9A417AA12 X-Migadu-Scanner: mx13.migadu.com X-TUID: XrTSj4onOp50 Hi! Before I reply to Christine=E2=80=99s insightful message, here=E2=80=99s my Chief Visionary *cough* view on the questions you ask: Ekaitz Zarraga skribis: > - Do we need independent funding so we can pay for our machines and > maintenance? We have enough money, about 50k=E2=82=AC currently at the FSF plus a couple thousand =E2=82=AC at Guix Foundation=E2=81=B0. =E2=81=B0 There=E2=80=99s a ledger at but I don=E2=80=99t remember how to get the balance with the =E2=80=98led= ger=E2=80=99 command. :-) > - Is the Guix Foundation the way to do it? It is one way to do it, yes. > - Does GNU, or the FSF, have some role on that? GNU isn=E2=80=99t a legal structure, it =E2=80=9Cdoesn=E2=80=99t exist=E2= =80=9D so to speak. The FSF reimburses when we send them invoices; Guix Foundation can pay services, hardware, etc. directly, which is more convenient. My preference would be to have a single structure, to improve legibility and simplify things, and that structure would not be the FSF. > - Can we improve anything relieving weight from the shoulders of some > people instead of putting even more on them? Yes! Committers can review code; people interested in governance can help with the next steps, in particular the RFC process at ; sysadmins/devops/hackers can help with the infrastructure=C2=B9; and so on. These are some of the thankless tasks that are key to a healthy project and where we must ensure a fair distribution of work to avoid burnout. =C2=B9 https://lists.gnu.org/archive/html/guix-devel/2024-05/msg00183.html > - Would having more committers help relieve some of the weight? Only if they participate in code review. > - If so, should we propose commit access to people, instead of waiting > them to propose themselves? We should. I think maintainers started doing it? > - Should we ease the process of becoming a committer? Do you think the process is difficult? Or intimidating maybe? Ludo=E2=80=99.