From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from mp1 ([2001:41d0:2:4a6f::]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits)) by ms0.migadu.com with LMTPS id ffIEKm0kpGA+9AAAgWs5BA (envelope-from ) for ; Tue, 18 May 2021 22:32:45 +0200 Received: from aspmx1.migadu.com ([2001:41d0:2:4a6f::]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits)) by mp1 with LMTPS id kDAQJW0kpGDeYQAAbx9fmQ (envelope-from ) for ; Tue, 18 May 2021 20:32:45 +0000 Received: from lists.gnu.org (lists.gnu.org [209.51.188.17]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by aspmx1.migadu.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 02E741A37C for ; Tue, 18 May 2021 22:32:45 +0200 (CEST) Received: from localhost ([::1]:32922 helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1lj6OR-0001zJ-S8 for larch@yhetil.org; Tue, 18 May 2021 16:32:43 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:45938) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1lj6GT-0003K8-0x for guix-devel@gnu.org; Tue, 18 May 2021 16:24:30 -0400 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e]:50854) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1lj6GQ-0005NK-PE; Tue, 18 May 2021 16:24:28 -0400 Received: from [2a01:e0a:1d:7270:af76:b9b:ca24:c465] (port=37432 helo=ribbon) by fencepost.gnu.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1lj6GM-0005cs-Or; Tue, 18 May 2021 16:24:23 -0400 From: =?utf-8?Q?Ludovic_Court=C3=A8s?= To: Bone Baboon Subject: Re: =?utf-8?Q?What=E2=80=99s?= next? References: <87v97jhot4.fsf@inria.fr> <877djwd85h.fsf@disroot.org> X-URL: http://www.fdn.fr/~lcourtes/ X-Revolutionary-Date: 29 =?utf-8?Q?Flor=C3=A9al?= an 229 de la =?utf-8?Q?R?= =?utf-8?Q?=C3=A9volution?= X-PGP-Key-ID: 0x090B11993D9AEBB5 X-PGP-Key: http://www.fdn.fr/~lcourtes/ludovic.asc X-PGP-Fingerprint: 3CE4 6455 8A84 FDC6 9DB4 0CFB 090B 1199 3D9A EBB5 X-OS: x86_64-pc-linux-gnu Date: Tue, 18 May 2021 22:24:21 +0200 In-Reply-To: <877djwd85h.fsf@disroot.org> (Bone Baboon's message of "Mon, 17 May 2021 23:37:30 -0400") Message-ID: <87k0nv94ei.fsf@gnu.org> User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/27.2 (gnu/linux) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-BeenThere: guix-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.23 Precedence: list List-Id: "Development of GNU Guix and the GNU System distribution." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Cc: guix-devel@gnu.org Errors-To: guix-devel-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org Sender: "Guix-devel" X-Migadu-Flow: FLOW_IN ARC-Message-Signature: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=yhetil.org; s=key1; t=1621369965; h=from:from:sender:sender:reply-to:subject:subject:date:date: message-id:message-id:to:to:cc:cc:mime-version:mime-version: content-type:content-type: content-transfer-encoding:content-transfer-encoding: in-reply-to:in-reply-to:references:references:list-id:list-help: list-unsubscribe:list-subscribe:list-post; bh=YJ0wkpGQJUuu5WSYEwpaYf1fN4zq8P9wFP5Rhqcx8+A=; b=uCH0UvZ5PCLFnuhqzwmFRdOUv3Myoy5BgIZC4euLO2rSY4kMR2YfM7GVOlZLpFbi2otrvn 3EpfLXFtD1ofR2M6KfkDoLhqHhQDdxqwPVufMCwRV5kL0QoEyyZJQiV6wBJKx1IKf2No+z gom3AqXktcuuMOYWsdcMWS7S19jTilL4Z4vW6wxVquiibLdPHtByDRuJHxFojEW6aHF9od Pp3ig6i9PqvqUastctzZ2ONkcra3ZP8AmsXmLxNdiN/QKehUEa1jjotF3QOIgD4LokrQV6 6C5a6fOR7VWsLJfCNtudjzIVlUnzZLvwy+Pb0BxRrPnn7P2sztIVzjf5dO2iLA== ARC-Seal: i=1; s=key1; d=yhetil.org; t=1621369965; a=rsa-sha256; cv=none; b=p0mciBOWjJX8yM4BJrBYB2KQXYG+EB+Vu1LQjXchMXQ+o1vD/X9ZSK6kCyOs5W/AechXhS 0ByW70L64Huq1sPPQZdxXJYz7njn/jmiR7aaAvyK5adfBrbJsLSJ8AtWJ7rNwrZkAQ+Pgt A/Vi6iKgpjrfqoiqcBPyufoRsjUzQFZXQhL8GZwozQMMlpm/9E3i/EwLiS55ujqIrrjQpQ yixrksL3MCyWyCv/T6Xql+7eD+8NclOeTMgsNlHI1Nh67FLVm187YLcZe0oI4V5TjA6EtL h3+NcrG0OHxPK2vCg65re/Xwvz5LSvC8+y0qaZPVVNNmqjy9Iig2E1BGhOKNpA== ARC-Authentication-Results: i=1; aspmx1.migadu.com; dkim=none; dmarc=pass (policy=none) header.from=gnu.org; spf=pass (aspmx1.migadu.com: domain of guix-devel-bounces@gnu.org designates 209.51.188.17 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=guix-devel-bounces@gnu.org X-Migadu-Spam-Score: -1.94 Authentication-Results: aspmx1.migadu.com; dkim=none; dmarc=pass (policy=none) header.from=gnu.org; spf=pass (aspmx1.migadu.com: domain of guix-devel-bounces@gnu.org designates 209.51.188.17 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=guix-devel-bounces@gnu.org X-Migadu-Queue-Id: 02E741A37C X-Spam-Score: -1.94 X-Migadu-Scanner: scn0.migadu.com X-TUID: uum6MZq+3+Jq Hi, Bone Baboon skribis: > 1) Make the core parts of Guix reproducible > > Many core parts of Guix are not reproducible. If more core parts of > Guix were reproducible it would benefit all Guix users. > > There are several core parts of Guix that are not reproducible > including: > > * Linux-libre > https://issues.guix.gnu.org/24028#2 > Note: I like what the Linux-libre project is doing. > This is likely a result of Linux not being reproducible. > > * Many guix-* > https://issues.guix.gnu.org/48487#0 > > * Guile > https://issues.guix.gnu.org/48490#0 > > * nss 3.59 on the master branch > https://issues.guix.gnu.org/40316#5 > > * Emacs > https://issues.guix.gnu.org/35085#7 > Note: A good text editor is important. > nvi, vim and neovim are reproducible for me. > Emacs is more than a text editor and that is a part of why it is > not reproducible.=20 All these are great (apart from the Guile and guix-* ones, which are =E2=80=9Cknown=E2=80=9D issues). I think it takes investigation, to pinpoi= nt the source of non-determinism, and also checking what other distros do, possibly asking on the . > 2) Alternative kernel [...] > It is great that work is already underway to get Guix to run on the Gnu > Hurd microkernel. Yup! Help welcome on this front, too. :-) > I think the design concept of a microkernel make them more resistant to > the problem of increasing complexity at the kernel level when compared > to monolithic kernels. With microkernels the increased complexity is > pushes out to user processes. This allows the user (or their operating > system) to choose the level of complexity. > > is a listing of microkernel projects. Note that once you have a microkernel, you have next to nothing, by definition. The Hurd (+ libc) provides everything you need to provide a POSIX personality. Thanks, Ludo=E2=80=99.